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Switch to Forum Live View Egyptian TV airs slow beheading of Tunisian Muslim who converted to Christianity
6 years ago  ::  Nov 29, 2012 - 10:22AM #21
Posts: 248

Nov 29, 2012 -- 3:31AM, Ebon wrote:

One cannot simply abolish a religion, anyreligion. Those who believe in it will continue to cling to it as one might cling to a piece of driftwood when drowning. Oh, religions will come and go, of course. Some will become fashionable (for lack of a better term) and others will fade into history just as the pantheons of the Greek or Roman religions have been abandoned today (mostly and with all respect to the minority who still practice those faiths). Perhaps, in time, Islam will fade from teh world and become something studied only by historians. Perhaps Christianity will or Judaism or, well, pick a religion.

And then again, those who take the time to think it through may begin to realize the truth. Knowledge is the key to understanding reality, but the truth that sets you free is responsibility. Whether it be a Jew or a Hindu, Buddhist or Christian, and in Islam it's the same also. You must take responsibility for your actions, & what you believe in too, if you HOPE to make the CHANGE to a better place. Whether you call it Utopia, Heaven, Paradise, Nirvana, or a return to a better station, it's all part of the same conceptual reality. Survey's have determined that the happiest people on earth are those with a strong belief in this future, but I wouldn't bother imagining a world that's never been.

Before you can have peace on earth my friend, you must know how to find your own peace of mind.

Nov 29, 2012 -- 3:31AM, Ebon wrote:

But what you can't do is surpress it. Firstly, the American Bill of Rights, the European Convention on Human Rights (which does much the same for EU nations) and the UN Decaration of Human Rights all guarantee freedom of religion. Yes, some nations ignore that, that doesn't mean we can ignore it for exactly the same reasons that, although some countries torture, we cannot: Because we are better than them and better than that. Secondly, the USSR tried to surpress religion. It didn't work and it can't work because people who believe will always find ways to practice their faith. While the Roman Empire was persecuting Christians, the Christians continued to meet and practice their faith in private.

And it wasn't too long ago when Christians of one Sect or another persecuted those of another Christian sect. Division happens in every cooperative effort of ours as the effects of space & time progress for all mankind, but there's a truth that never CHANGES regardless what anyone believes, no matter what you HOPE for in the end. 

We are finite beings with a beginning & end, with nothing but time on our hands. Religion gives you something to do while you wait for everything to come to it's natural end. If you take the time to think it through.

Nov 29, 2012 -- 3:31AM, Ebon wrote:

You can't surpress faith. You can try to convince people of it's error by reason and logic but if you try and tear it away from them by force, they will find ways to fight you and, if you're either very stupid or unlucky, that fight turns into a holy war. Now, that's not to say that we should just ignore atrocities like this but we cannot respond in kind, we cannot beat barbarism by becoming barbarians ourselves.

Funny thing you should mention faith in the same statement as reason & logic, because in reality they're not all that far apart. Mind you, I know my reason for being here, & thank Allah for giving me life. In Islam, God is not some anthropomorphic being at all, regardless what you might think. This Deity that goes by many names, is the Divine Reality that Created everything. The Infinite Reality that transcends both time & space, that Nothing can compare too. In Islam it's not a battle between God & the devil whatsoever, it's the devil that resides within your mind that the Jihad is all about.

Now there's a guy who goes by the name of Stephen Hawking, who spends his time sitting in a chair thinking all the time. If you're curious to know what this man of reason & logic believes, simply watch this show on the Discovery Channel, but this is essentially what he's saying, as he apologizes to those who use a different word for the Creator of the world, and all of reality also:

There's this thing Stephen is Hawking, that he calls Nothing, where time & space doesn't exist at all. It's the Creator of everything there's ever been, the reason for all that exists today. Everything that's happened up to this moment in time, has a logical reason for being is what he's saying - until we arrive at Nothing in the beginning.

It don't matter if you say it's the Master's plan, or some sort of master plan following the laws of physics. When the plan unfolds between your ears, it will come together in front of your eyes. That's when you'll find your peace of mind, and accept reality for what it is. When all is said & done, we'll be gone before you know it, so get over it already my friends.

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6 years ago  ::  Nov 29, 2012 - 11:47AM #22
Posts: 33,858

Nov 29, 2012 -- 3:31AM, Ebon wrote:

One cannot simply abolish a religion, any religion.

Perhaps not, but you can't stop us from dreaming.

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6 years ago  ::  Nov 29, 2012 - 2:01PM #23
Posts: 11,236

Nov 29, 2012 -- 9:17AM, TemplarS wrote:

Right, Ebon. It is not the role of government to suppress religion (neither is it the role of government to promote religion).  Further, it is not the role of government to try to force everybody to love black people, or gays, or Muslims, or any other minority; in any case this will likewise prove impossible (Goldwater was right, you cannot legislate morality).

What government in a liberal democracy can legislate, and enforce, is equal treatment under the law.  This means not only enacting tolerance and civil rights laws, it means vigorously acting against personal acts of bias and violence; regarding lynchings in the US and the like, this is why the feds had to step in in the South back in the 50s and 60s; because the  local sheriff in many cases was one of the guys under the hoods.


"If you aren't confused by quantum physics, you haven't really understood it."
― Niels Bohr

"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality."
-- Albert Einstein

"If one is going to engage with the primordial forces of darkness, one must expect a bit of social awkwardness."
-- Penny Dreadful, season one, episode two
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 07, 2012 - 1:04AM #24
Posts: 16,967

This thread was moved from the Hot topics Zone.

The topic is about an event in the Middle East so let's keep comments at least somewhat related to that.


Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 07, 2012 - 6:03AM #25
Posts: 9,063

When you are beheaded you are dead, with torture you wish you were dead.

I am not making light of it, it is shocking. But we (the civilized westerners) are just as inhuman.

Moderated by rangerken on Dec 09, 2012 - 12:31AM
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