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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 12:32AM #1
solfeggio
Posts: 8,914
What do Penelope Cruz, Jude Law, Robert Redford, Sir Paul McCartney, Emily Blunt and many other celebrities have in common?  They've all joined forces with Greenpeace to call for a global sanctuary in the arctic and a ban on offshore oil drilling.

entertainment.msn.co.nz/article.aspx?id=...

www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012/06/21/r...

www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jun/21/gre...

As Greenpeace executive director Kumi Naidoo stated:

'A ban on offshore oil drilling would be a huge victory against the forces ranged against this precious region.'

www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/apr/12/llo...

And what would those forces be?  The U.S., of course, and also Russia, Canada, Denmark and Norway.

articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/04/nation/...    

Will the Greenpeace initiative do any good?  Nah.  President Obama has already given the green light to Shell to drill, and the other countries will soon follow suit.

Bye, bye, arctic.  Nice to have known ya. 
    

       
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 12:14PM #2
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782


Wait a second...


I thought the radical socialist/communist, secret Muslim President Obama was in the pocket of the liberal/socialist/pinko/communist/tree-hugger/earth bunny/hippy/anti-America/Baby Jesus-hating Hollywood elites.


And now you're telling me, he went against them?


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2 years ago  ::  Jun 23, 2012 - 7:06PM #3
solfeggio
Posts: 8,914

Well, Mouse, from what I've read about the U.S., over the past forty years or so, the country has made a perceptible slide towards the Right, and that the government is under the control of the military, the bankers, and the oil men.  As well, it appears that the Christian evangelical movement is well established and has a voice in government policies, too.


This is the tried and true recipe for fascism, of course, and fascists don't like or want change in any form.  And that means they will continue to drill for oil wherever they can find it, including the fragile arctic, and the environment be damned.  If this means a melting of the sea ice and other catastrophes, your leaders couldn't care less, could they?


It's all about money, and those sorts of people can never have enough.


Therefore, even though you so flippantly make a joke out of the whole thing, the U.S. is, indeed, a big part of the decline of not only your own country, but the planet itself.


 

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 23, 2012 - 8:16PM #4
jane2
Posts: 14,295

Jun 23, 2012 -- 7:06PM, solfeggio wrote:


Well, Mouse, from what I've read about the U.S., over the past forty years or so, the country has made a perceptible slide towards the Right, and that the government is under the control of the military, the bankers, and the oil men.  As well, it appears that the Christian evangelical movement is well established and has a voice in government policies, too.


This is the tried and true recipe for fascism, of course, and fascists don't like or want change in any form.  And that means they will continue to drill for oil wherever they can find it, including the fragile arctic, and the environment be damned.  If this means a melting of the sea ice and other catastrophes, your leaders couldn't care less, could they?


It's all about money, and those sorts of people can never have enough.


Therefore, even though you so flippantly make a joke out of the whole thing, the U.S. is, indeed, a big part of the decline of not only your own country, but the planet itself.


 


 


Get a grip, Solf. The US is a wealthy nation and many of us live well. Many of us are also concerned about the environment. Are you concerned about the flotsam and jetsam washing up on our west coast from the mess in Japan? Who will drill in the arctic? I see a certain fascism at work in Europe over the Euro right now.


I thought Mouse's rebuttal WAS funny.




 

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2012 - 1:01PM #5
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Jun 23, 2012 -- 7:06PM, solfeggio wrote:


Well, Mouse, from what I've read about the U.S., over the past forty years or so, the country has made a perceptible slide towards the Right, and that the government is under the control of the military, the bankers, and the oil men.  As well, it appears that the Christian evangelical movement is well established and has a voice in government policies, too.


This is the tried and true recipe for fascism, of course, and fascists don't like or want change in any form.  And that means they will continue to drill for oil wherever they can find it, including the fragile arctic, and the environment be damned.  If this means a melting of the sea ice and other catastrophes, your leaders couldn't care less, could they?


It's all about money, and those sorts of people can never have enough.


Therefore, even though you so flippantly make a joke out of the whole thing, the U.S. is, indeed, a big part of the decline of not only your own country, but the planet itself.


 





Most Americans are in the middle, Solf.


 The noise on the fringe tends to swing from left to right, depending upon the time period, and the issue.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2012 - 1:34PM #6
rabello
Posts: 20,396

Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:01PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Most Americans are in the middle, Solf.


The noise on the fringe tends to swing from left to right, depending upon the time period, and the issue.




What does that mean?  That most Americans don't have an opinion about establishing a global sanctuary in the Arctic.  That's probably true.  Judging from what's on the roadways and the parking lots, the great American Middle will undoubtedly come down on the side of cheap gas and lowered emission standards for their SUVs and monster trucks, when push comes to shove.   "Whichever way the wind blows....doesn't matter much to me" -- is that what you mean?


As for Obama, he has never been particularly eco-friendly.  He knows the jargon but it's really not on his radar.  He is up to his eyeballs in agreements with the oil men and the drillers, it just doesn't get reported.   He got a grade of "F" on environmental issues by at least one environmental group.  


Still, the great American Middle still thinks he's a liberal.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2012 - 10:02PM #7
solfeggio
Posts: 8,914

Rabello -


Why does the American middle class think President Obama is a hero?  I can understand some of this sort of thinking - to a point. 


Before he was president, Mr. Obama seemed to have been able to willingly take up the many practical truths of liberalism, and he may even have imagined himself to be a transformative figure, but his record does seem to show that this has not happened.


For instance, nowadays, the president seems to have changed from being an anti-oil president to eagerly embracing the oil-drilling industry as much as he can.  He is probably just playing along with the general public's willingness to exploit any and all oil and gas resources, whether on or offshore, because most people are afraid of having to pay higher petrol prices.


Many people must worry that his policies will make the U.S. more dependent upon foreign oil.  And high petrol prices are a major worry these days, and seem to be the president's weakest issue.


So, I suppose, if he wants to win the support of the public and be reelected, the logical thing for him to do is to increase domestic oil production.


Alternative fuels don't seem to enter the equation.


 


 

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2012 - 11:45PM #8
jane2
Posts: 14,295

Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:34PM, rabello wrote:


Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:01PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Most Americans are in the middle, Solf.


The noise on the fringe tends to swing from left to right, depending upon the time period, and the issue.




What does that mean?  That most Americans don't have an opinion about establishing a global sanctuary in the Arctic.  That's probably true.  Judging from what's on the roadways and the parking lots, the great American Middle will undoubtedly come down on the side of cheap gas and lowered emission standards for their SUVs and monster trucks, when push comes to shove.   "Whichever way the wind blows....doesn't matter much to me" -- is that what you mean?


As for Obama, he has never been particularly eco-friendly.  He knows the jargon but it's really not on his radar.  He is up to his eyeballs in agreements with the oil men and the drillers, it just doesn't get reported.   He got a grade of "F" on environmental issues by at least one environmental group.  


Still, the great American Middle still thinks he's a liberal.




I don't think Obama is a progressive; never thought President Clinton was either. Clinton left office with a budget surplus.


I don't see a great American Middle at this time either. I'll vote for Obama but my vote won't count in Georgia. And I don't have a real problem with the production of more American crude and not because I drive much and worry about gasoline prices; there is an international component afoot here. I drive a BMW 328i.


This week  I'll be watching what SCOTUS does about health care : I favor what has been passed and not on my own account. I favor what our First Lady was done to bring childhood obesity front and center. I watch neighbors in my ranch condo group separate their trash for pick-up. I'm a youngster here at 72.



 

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 25, 2012 - 3:05PM #9
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:34PM, rabello wrote:


Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:01PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Most Americans are in the middle, Solf.


The noise on the fringe tends to swing from left to right, depending upon the time period, and the issue.




What does that mean?  That most Americans don't have an opinion about establishing a global sanctuary in the Arctic.  That's probably true.  Judging from what's on the roadways and the parking lots, the great American Middle will undoubtedly come down on the side of cheap gas and lowered emission standards for their SUVs and monster trucks, when push comes to shove.   "Whichever way the wind blows....doesn't matter much to me" -- is that what you mean?


As for Obama, he has never been particularly eco-friendly.  He knows the jargon but it's really not on his radar.  He is up to his eyeballs in agreements with the oil men and the drillers, it just doesn't get reported.   He got a grade of "F" on environmental issues by at least one environmental group.  


Still, the great American Middle still thinks he's a liberal.




I was speaking in general terms, regarding Solf's observation that America, as a whole, has swung way to the political right. In general term, most Americans are middle-of-the road.


Most "environmental groups" don't impress me.


I favor boots-on-the ground organizations that, instead of engaging in scornful pontification, actually work at consensus building, to make a real difference. 


The Nature Conservancy is one that comes to mind.


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2 years ago  ::  Jun 25, 2012 - 3:16PM #10
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Jun 24, 2012 -- 11:45PM, jane2 wrote:


Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:34PM, rabello wrote:


Jun 24, 2012 -- 1:01PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Most Americans are in the middle, Solf.


The noise on the fringe tends to swing from left to right, depending upon the time period, and the issue.




What does that mean?  That most Americans don't have an opinion about establishing a global sanctuary in the Arctic.  That's probably true.  Judging from what's on the roadways and the parking lots, the great American Middle will undoubtedly come down on the side of cheap gas and lowered emission standards for their SUVs and monster trucks, when push comes to shove.   "Whichever way the wind blows....doesn't matter much to me" -- is that what you mean?


As for Obama, he has never been particularly eco-friendly.  He knows the jargon but it's really not on his radar.  He is up to his eyeballs in agreements with the oil men and the drillers, it just doesn't get reported.   He got a grade of "F" on environmental issues by at least one environmental group.  


Still, the great American Middle still thinks he's a liberal.




I don't think Obama is a progressive; never thought President Clinton was either. Clinton left office with a budget surplus.


I don't see a great American Middle at this time either. I'll vote for Obama but my vote won't count in Georgia. And I don't have a real problem with the production of more American crude and not because I drive much and worry about gasoline prices; there is an international component afoot here. I drive a BMW 328i.


This week  I'll be watching what SCOTUS does about health care : I favor what has been passed and not on my own account. I favor what our First Lady was done to bring childhood obesity front and center. I watch neighbors in my ranch condo group separate their trash for pick-up. I'm a youngster here at 72.



 




I heard a political scientist being interviewed on NPR state that his view was, Obama and Romney are both essentially moderates. Obama is a liberal moderate, Romney a conservative moderate.


I think that was accurate. 

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