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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 6:54PM #71
solfeggio
Posts: 9,352

Why would Chari say that I undermine credibility when describing sodium nitrite as dangerous?  Everything I've read about it says that this stuff is dangerous for human consumption.


www.nationalreview.com/the-feed/248644/p...

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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 7:11PM #72
solfeggio
Posts: 9,352

Why would Yavanna avoid canola oil like the plague? 


It's true that olive oil is the best choice, but canola oil is a good source of monounsaturated fats and can help reduce LDL cholesterol levels.  And, it is the best source of alpha-linolenic acid, which is an omega-3 fatty acid. 


The American Heart Association recommends its use.


www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/Fa...


What's interesting, though, is the Bill Clinton's doctor, Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, says that people shouldn't eat any oil at all!


www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_o4YBQPKtQ

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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 8:03PM #73
IreneAdler
Posts: 2,849

May 30, 2012 -- 7:11PM, solfeggio wrote:


Why would Yavanna avoid canola oil like the plague? 


It's true that olive oil is the best choice, but canola oil is a good source of monounsaturated fats and can help reduce LDL cholesterol levels.  And, it is the best source of alpha-linolenic acid, which is an omega-3 fatty acid. 


The American Heart Association recommends its use.


www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/Fa...


What's interesting, though, is the Bill Clinton's doctor, Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, says that people shouldn't eat any oil at all!


www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_o4YBQPKtQ





From some quick reading:


High degree of unsaturation which makes canola oil, and most veggie oils, unstable. This means they go rancid quickly (as compared to saturated oils) and tend to encourage free radical formation within the body.  Extra virgin olive oil is an exception as it is cold pressed (and contains lots of antioxidants). Note that most other veggie oils are processed via high heat, or pressure and/or or the use of solvents to extract the oil (hexane anyone?).  Such processes render the final veggie oil to be unhealthy. Said processed oils tend to encourage inflammation reaction within the body. With canola oil specifically, the processing creates trans-fats to a significant degree.


 


Irene.

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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 9:40PM #74
mountain_man
Posts: 39,707

May 30, 2012 -- 1:46AM, solfeggio wrote:

...However, I have to say that comments about vegans being 'missionary zealots' really annoy me.


Zealous vegans annoy everyone else too.


Since I am the only vegan posting on Beliefnet (that I know of), and being well aware that anybody who dares to go against the accepted cultural food beliefs is regarded as a kook, I am very sensitive where this sort of thing is concerned.


That's not true, and you know it. No one has called you a kook for going against your strawman of "accepted cultural food beliefs."


Vegetarians and vegans are just people who are trying to live a healthier life, and vegans in particular are also trying to live a more animal-friendly life.


Not one person here has said that you should not eat the way you choose. No one has attacked you for being a vegan. In all sincerity; it's not what you say, but how you say it.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 9:43PM #75
mountain_man
Posts: 39,707

May 30, 2012 -- 1:18AM, Yavanna wrote:

I can't argue with emotion.


Or with dead animals that got evicted in order to plant palms. I do not use palm oil or coconut oil products. Killing an animal for food is one thing, but killing off millions of them because they're in the way is immoral.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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2 years ago  ::  May 30, 2012 - 9:48PM #76
mountain_man
Posts: 39,707

May 30, 2012 -- 2:16AM, solfeggio wrote:

...You can fry eggs in bacon grease every morning for breakfast, as most people do, of course, but you will be eating a processed meat product containing the highly carcinogenic sodium nitrite.  In fact, a high consumption of processed meat has been positively linked with prostate and pancreatic cancer.


And a vegan diet has been positively linked to colon cancer. The amount of nitrates in SMOKED meats, not all "processed" meats contain sodium nitrate, is so small that it's not going to give you cancer just by eating it.


As well, eating 50g of processed meat every day increases a person's risk of developing both heart disease and diabetes.  What is 50g?  That would be one sausage or two medium rashers of bacon, or a slice of salami.


Got a scientific study to back that up with? Not a claim from some vegan website; a real scientific study by real doctors and published in a peer reviewed journal. You made a strong claim so you back up needs to be as strong.


With all the evidence we now have that processed meats are lethal, it is surprising that people still indulge.


Because they are not lethal.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 1:31AM #77
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

May 30, 2012 -- 7:11PM, solfeggio wrote:


Why would Yavanna avoid canola oil like the plague? 


It's true that olive oil is the best choice, but canola oil is a good source of monounsaturated fats and can help reduce LDL cholesterol levels.  And, it is the best source of alpha-linolenic acid, which is an omega-3 fatty acid. 


The American Heart Association recommends its use.


www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/Fa...


What's interesting, though, is the Bill Clinton's doctor, Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, says that people shouldn't eat any oil at all!


www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_o4YBQPKtQ




I don't know. God forbid you ask her. Maybe you should just ignore her and do everything in your power to find ways to credit your way of thinking instead of learning about someone different than you.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 1:32AM #78
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

May 30, 2012 -- 8:03PM, IreneAdler wrote:


May 30, 2012 -- 7:11PM, solfeggio wrote:


Why would Yavanna avoid canola oil like the plague? 


It's true that olive oil is the best choice, but canola oil is a good source of monounsaturated fats and can help reduce LDL cholesterol levels.  And, it is the best source of alpha-linolenic acid, which is an omega-3 fatty acid. 


The American Heart Association recommends its use.


www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/Fa...


What's interesting, though, is the Bill Clinton's doctor, Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, says that people shouldn't eat any oil at all!


www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_o4YBQPKtQ





From some quick reading:


High degree of unsaturation which makes canola oil, and most veggie oils, unstable. This means they go rancid quickly (as compared to saturated oils) and tend to encourage free radical formation within the body.  Extra virgin olive oil is an exception as it is cold pressed (and contains lots of antioxidants). Note that most other veggie oils are processed via high heat, or pressure and/or or the use of solvents to extract the oil (hexane anyone?).  Such processes render the final veggie oil to be unhealthy. Said processed oils tend to encourage inflammation reaction within the body. With canola oil specifically, the processing creates trans-fats to a significant degree.


 


Irene.




Thank you, Irene. Precisely. Particularly since I suffer from arthritis I need to avoid inflammation. That includes sugars and wheat.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 1:39AM #79
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

May 30, 2012 -- 9:43PM, mountain_man wrote:


May 30, 2012 -- 1:18AM, Yavanna wrote:

I can't argue with emotion.


Or with dead animals that got evicted in order to plant palms. I do not use palm oil or coconut oil products. Killing an animal for food is one thing, but killing off millions of them because they're in the way is immoral.




You should probably avoid any and all food then. In fact you shouldn't buy anything of any sort. Paying taxes would be bad too.


It'd be immoral to continue existing because of what other people do with your money.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 2:03AM #80
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

May 30, 2012 -- 6:54PM, solfeggio wrote:


Why would Chari say that I undermine [my own] credibility when describing sodium nitrite as dangerous?



If you're honest to yourself and others, you will notice that in fact you described sodium nitrite as "highly carcinogenic", not merely as "dangerous", and that my post pinpointedly addressed only your unscientific claim of carcinogenicity, which of course undermines your credibility.


But then, this may be a very big "if", right?

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