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Switch to Forum Live View Strong Support for Gay Marriage Now Exceeds Strong Opposition
13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 7:52PM #251
karbie
Posts: 2,865

Basing some of your claims on the Bible--does that include the Gospels that have come to light recently? That Mary Magdalene was not the "woman at the well", but instead a wealthy woman who chose to follow Jesus? One of the Popes circa 900 A.D. decided that women might get ideas from a woman having both money and freedom so he identified her as a prostitute.


One of the things that caused the schism between the RC church and the Orthodox Church was which books to leave out in the first place.


There have been enough idiocies done in the name of religion.


Marriages continue without sex. If you care only about sexual gratification and not about your partner as a person, it isn't a marriage regardless of gender. I know that the "In sickness, in health" clause in our vows has certainly gotten a workout. I've undergone 11 surgeries during our almost 35 years of marriage, and that doesn't count nerve blocks on my lower spine or broken bones. We are friends--a vital component to any relationship.


When someone keeps proclaiming that something isn't "moral", or is against "Christian morality" repeatedly, all that comes through is that it just isn't something you will ever agree with.


So, is it more moral if they just "shack up"? Perhaps that isn't good enough and some same-gender couples want to have their relationship witnessed and blessed by God. To be "given" the right to make a life-long commitment legal by allowing them to be married if they have a church or religion willing to permit them to finalize their relationship.


I commend couples who want to be married and become spouses in a religious ceremony. I think that a civil union is better than nothing but not the same as a marriage.


After presenting the same arguments over and over, it's obvious that your mind will not change. It should be obvious that if your presentations were going to change anyone else's minds, they would have long ago done so.


I just see no reason to deny total strangers the right to be married because some "Christians" are violently opposed to it.

"You are letting your opinion be colored by facts again."
'When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you."
these are both from my father.
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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 8:06PM #252
mainecaptain
Posts: 20,491

Jun 6, 2012 -- 7:52PM, karbie wrote:



I just see no reason to deny total strangers the right to be married because some "Christians" are violently opposed to it.




Thank you Karbie. Great post. Not just that part.






A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 9:32PM #253
Thetwofish
Posts: 442

Jun 6, 2012 -- 8:06PM, mainecaptain wrote:


Jun 6, 2012 -- 7:52PM, karbie wrote:



I just see no reason to deny total strangers the right to be married because some "Christians" are violently opposed to it.




Thank you Karbie. Great post. Not just that part.










Now there's an analogy that I can sink my teeth into Cool


Peace


<'{{><

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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 9:33PM #254
Thetwofish
Posts: 442

Jun 6, 2012 -- 9:32PM, Thetwofish wrote:


Jun 6, 2012 -- 8:06PM, mainecaptain wrote:


Jun 6, 2012 -- 7:52PM, karbie wrote:



I just see no reason to deny total strangers the right to be married because some "Christians" are violently opposed to it.




Thank you Karbie. Great post. Not just that part.









Now there's an analogy that I can sink my teeth into Cool


Peace


<'{{><





Awwwwww...the pic didn't come through on my post.  That is what I was commenting on in Maine's post.


Just so you know...lol!


Peace


<'{{><

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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 9:47PM #255
mainecaptain
Posts: 20,491

Thank you Thetwofish, :))

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 10:01PM #256
mountain_man
Posts: 34,161

Jun 6, 2012 -- 6:25PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Again, your arguments fail -- as do the attempts to compare this to struggles against discriminations[sic] based upon skin pigmentation.


And your argument fails since that is not what anyone is doing.


Whether Homosexuality is a choice, and its existance[sic] in animal species, aren't relevant.


It is when someone is claiming that homosexuality is not natural.


Regardless, there is no objective equality between heterosexuality and homosexuality. Hence, there is no objective equality between gay unions and man-woman marriage.


No one is making such a comparison.


Being predisposed to homosexual attractions might not be a choice. But following through on them, and "being gay," so to speak, absolutely is a choice.


So what? It's legal when consenting adults are involved. So, that makes it none of your business.


Once again, marriage laws based upon skin pigmentation violated an actual, underlying equality -- based upon an arbitrary appeal to a difference of instance.


That's a strawman argument that has failed in the past. Try a new one.


The rest made no sense.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 10:02PM #257
mountain_man
Posts: 34,161

Jun 6, 2012 -- 6:38PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

"Marriage equality" is an essentially empty buzz term. Just rhetoric to throw around.....


Thanks for your opinion. Got any rational arguments? I keep asking and you refuse to provide any. Why?

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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13 months ago  ::  Jun 06, 2012 - 10:11PM #258
mountain_man
Posts: 34,161

Jun 6, 2012 -- 6:32PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

It's called poisioning[sic] the wells.


All non sequiturs. Got any rational arguments?

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 07, 2012 - 7:33AM #259
karbie
Posts: 2,865

The bit about being having a homosexual attraction, but acting on it is a "choice" has some possibilities.


It works if you substitute being attracted toa heterosexual, but acting on that attraction is a choice


Or being tempted by looking at food, but giving in to that temptation and eating it is a choice.


However, it still doesn't top my favorite, attributed to an anonymous Cavalier in answer to being questioned on why he did not see that Oliver Cromwell and his Puritans were the only correct religion. "I guess that God just predestined me not to be a good Puritan."

"You are letting your opinion be colored by facts again."
'When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you."
these are both from my father.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 07, 2012 - 12:53PM #260
mainecaptain
Posts: 20,491

Jun 7, 2012 -- 7:33AM, karbie wrote:


The bit about being having a homosexual attraction, but acting on it is a "choice" has some possibilities.


It works if you substitute being attracted toa heterosexual, but acting on that attraction is a choice


Or being tempted by looking at food, but giving in to that temptation and eating it is a choice.


However, it still doesn't top my favorite, attributed to an anonymous Cavalier in answer to being questioned on why he did not see that Oliver Cromwell and his Puritans were the only correct religion. "I guess that God just predestined me not to be a good Puritan."




Just what I wanted to say, but better. Thank you.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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