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Switch to Forum Live View North Carolina Pastor: Put Gays And Lesbians In Electrified Pen To Kill Them Off
3 years ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 8:56PM #41
Roodog
Posts: 10,168

May 22, 2012 -- 6:52PM, TemplarS wrote:


May 22, 2012 -- 3:40PM, Do_unto_others wrote:


Sorry, but the man is a Baptist pastor. The Baptist Church is NOT "fringe" (with the possible exception of the Westboro Baptist congregation). Just last week, there was another Baptist pastor who told his congregation to give their effeminate sons "a good punch", and to "crack their [limp] wrists".


Seems this is mainstream for the Baptist "church" nowadays, seeing how regularly the anti-gay message gets preached from the pulpit. Certainly not "fringe" (but agreed, most definitely "vile").




You are quite wrong. There is in fact no "Baptist Church." There is not even a Southern Baptist Church.


Baptists are not like Catholics or Methodists or Anglican/Episcopals, who do indeed have central Churches.


Baptists are congregational, meaning that each local church is in fact an independent entity (the SBC is in fact the Southern Baptist Convention, a collection of these local churches).  Which, though, now that I think about it,   certainly does not discourage the emergence of these nutty pastors.


That aside, there are  hundreds of flavors and varieties of Baptist, including Baptist congregations which are affirming of gays. 


Not all Baptists, or local Baptist churches, are neanderthals.  Jimmy Carter made headlines by renouncing the Southern Baptists; but, he is still a Baptist, and teaches Sunday School every week, from what I understand.  Bill Clinton is a Baptist.  Cornell West is a Baptist.  I could go on.


The Southern Baptist Convention is surely the largest and most politically powerful of the Baptist groups.   But they are not alone.  They speak for a lot of Baptists, but not all.





I am a Baptist.
This is why this call to exterminate gays and lesbians appalls me so much. Are we really that far removed from the time when Christians persecuted each other in the Name of Christ? Are we that far removed from the Inquisition and the Star Chamber? It was only a few centuries ago when Baptists themselves were harassed, whipped and even hanged for their faith by other Christians. Now some of our ministers are crying out for blood. We have really learned nothing at all.

For those who have faith, no explanation is neccessary.
For those who have no faith, no explanation is possible.

St. Thomas Aquinas

If one turns his ear from hearing the Law, even his prayer is an abomination. Proverbs 28:9
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3 years ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 10:20PM #42
Do_unto_others
Posts: 9,318

May 22, 2012 -- 4:00PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


May 22, 2012 -- 3:48PM, Do_unto_others wrote:


Jerry Falwell


Pat Robertson


Ted Haggart


Jimmy Swaggart


Billy Graham


Jim Bakker


He11, mouse, these aren't the "fringe" - these are mainstream "Christian" America blatherskytes.


But yes, still "vile". (Kind of our point.)




There's a longer list of T.V. shows, movies and prominent people promoting a "positive" view of homosexuality.



But we aren't talking TV shows; my list pertained to what we were talking about - public representatives of mainstream "Christianity". Good attempt to side-step the issue again (and as usual), but the discussion is about what pastors say, not actors


May 22, 2012 -- 4:00PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


So, what's your point?




No offense, mouse, but you don't really seem interested in talking about 'the point'.

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3 years ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 10:25PM #43
Do_unto_others
Posts: 9,318

May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Continual anal sex might indeed cause some people to need diapers -- straight or gay.  Having sizable things shoved up the old tailpipe on a regular basis isn't what the system was really designed for. And yes, I realize many gays have no anal sex, or at least far less of it than some straights do. The point is, it's not really a smart practice, for anybody.



No mouse, that is NOT "the point". The point is the assinine, stoopid, hateful, HARMFUL things said from mainstream "Christian" pulpits.


May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Anybody with even a passing knowledge of it should have been able to instantly peg that woman as suffering from some form of mental illness. I figured that out after about three seconds into her talking -- before I read any of the related text. 



Once again, the actual point is 1.) that she said it, 2.) that, despite your brilliant observation, most people took her seriously, and what she said as 'true'.


May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

But in general the public is woefully ignorant about the subject. 





The subject of homosexuality - yes. Mental illness is NOT the point.

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3 years ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 10:49PM #44
Erey
Posts: 19,423

This is like a tempest in a media pot.  Who is that pastor?  Do any of you know him, heard of him before?  No?  I didn't think so.  But hey let me go out and try to jack up my station's ratings by finding some outrageous people to interview. I don't have enough moral outrage in my life now so I am going to pop a vein over this guy. 



To be fair (it is always important to strive for fairness) the pastor did not say kill off the gays.  He said to confine them and becuase they do not procreate naturally they will over time die off.   He even is willing to hellicopter food into the compound (see no violence). 

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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 8:17AM #45
Cesmom
Posts: 5,385

If you'll notice, there are other videos posted at the link of equally vile statements made by more well-known or mainstream public figures.  If it were just some crazy isolated statement, that would be another story.

Our need to learn should always outweigh our need to be right

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

More people would learn from their mistakes if they weren't so busy denying them.
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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 8:18AM #46
Nepenthe
Posts: 2,723

May 22, 2012 -- 10:49PM, Erey wrote:


This is like a tempest in a media pot.  Who is that pastor?  Do any of you know him, heard of him before?  No?  I didn't think so.  But hey let me go out and try to jack up my station's ratings by finding some outrageous people to interview. I don't have enough moral outrage in my life now so I am going to pop a vein over this guy. 



No, well over 99% of the population never heard of this pastor until this story.  The story itself is designed to push a paticular anti-christian narrative.  The vast majority of Christian churches in this country preach love and tolerance, but it is not sensational, and does not push the particular narrative, so they are not reported on by particular individuals. 


For instance:


www.dailykos.com/story/2012/05/22/109389...-

Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one's life for his friends.
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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 9:36AM #47
TemplarS
Posts: 6,961

Well, this is how things work in the world of Baptists.


There is a Providence Baptist Church in North Carolina, which found it necessary to put out a statement on its website differentiating and distancing itself from Worley's Providence Road Baptist Church.


www.providencebc.org/


No wonder non-Baptists get confused. 


 

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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 10:19AM #48
Do_unto_others
Posts: 9,318

May 22, 2012 -- 10:49PM, Erey wrote:


This is like a tempest in a media pot.  Who is that pastor?  Do any of you know him, heard of him before?  No?  I didn't think so.  But hey let me go out and try to jack up my station's ratings by finding some outrageous people to interview. I don't have enough moral outrage in my life now so I am going to pop a vein over this guy. 


To be fair (it is always important to strive for fairness) the pastor did not say kill off the gays.  He said to confine them and becuase they do not procreate naturally they will over time die off.   He even is willing to hellicopter food into the compound (see no violence). 





If this were an isolated incident, I might be inclined to agree with you. But it isn't. Far from it, in fact.


Multitudes of far-more 'prominent' 'pastors' (like Buchanan, Robertson, Falwell, Haggart, Swaggart, Hagey, Roberts, Bakker, heck - even Billy Graham (never heard of HIM???) use their internationally televised pullly pulpits to promote hatred and yes, violence against God's LGBT children.


You dismiss them so readily and ignore the very palpable harm their message causes.


And your flimsy excuse "see no violence" is mis-guided at best and inaccurate to be sure (hint: it's an electrified fence "to kill them off"), but ignores the fact that, for the most part, it is NOT lesbians and gay people who create lesbians and gays, but heterosexuals. To have no more gay people in this world, you betterosexuals would have to stop having sex yourselves. Shall we put YOU in an electrified compound, separated from the rest of humanity?


Clueless as usual.

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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 10:23AM #49
Erey
Posts: 19,423

May 23, 2012 -- 10:19AM, Do_unto_others wrote:


May 22, 2012 -- 10:49PM, Erey wrote:


This is like a tempest in a media pot.  Who is that pastor?  Do any of you know him, heard of him before?  No?  I didn't think so.  But hey let me go out and try to jack up my station's ratings by finding some outrageous people to interview. I don't have enough moral outrage in my life now so I am going to pop a vein over this guy. 


To be fair (it is always important to strive for fairness) the pastor did not say kill off the gays.  He said to confine them and becuase they do not procreate naturally they will over time die off.   He even is willing to hellicopter food into the compound (see no violence). 





If this were an isolated incident, I might be inclined to agree with you. But it isn't. Far from it, in fact.


Multitudes of far-more 'prominent' 'pastors' (like Buchanan, Robertson, Falwell, Haggart, Swaggart, Hagey, Roberts, Bakker, heck - even Billy Graham (never heard of HIM???) use their internationally televised pullly pulpits to promote hatred and yes, violence against God's LGBT children.


You dismiss them so readily and ignore the very palpable harm their message causes.


And your flimsy excuse "see no violence" is mis-guided at best and inaccurate to be sure (hint: it's an electrified fence "to kill them off"), but ignores the fact that, for the most part, it is NOT lesbians and gay people who create lesbians and gays, but heterosexuals. To have no more gay people in this world, you betterosexuals would have to stop having sex yourselves. Shall we put YOU in an electrified compound, separated from the rest of humanity?


Clueless as usual.




Well I guess for some reason you feel the need to live in offense and outrage.  You enjoy this kind of nonsense.  Whatever!  Isolated incendence???  Really, you throw hundreds of thousands of supportive ministers and priests under the bus so that you can play poor persescuted gay man??  Grow up!  You don't want to see the the support, the positive. If this guy had some kind of power to actually effect gays and lesbians then I might be concerned.  But it is clear to anyone with more than two brain cells he does have any power except for the power to get your drawers in a bunch.  


Frankly, between being a bitter victim or being clueless - I choose clueless, every time

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3 years ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 10:25AM #50
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

May 22, 2012 -- 10:25PM, Do_unto_others wrote:


May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Continual anal sex might indeed cause some people to need diapers -- straight or gay.  Having sizable things shoved up the old tailpipe on a regular basis isn't what the system was really designed for. And yes, I realize many gays have no anal sex, or at least far less of it than some straights do. The point is, it's not really a smart practice, for anybody.



No mouse, that is NOT "the point". The point is the assinine, stoopid, hateful, HARMFUL things said from mainstream "Christian" pulpits.


May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Anybody with even a passing knowledge of it should have been able to instantly peg that woman as suffering from some form of mental illness. I figured that out after about three seconds into her talking -- before I read any of the related text. 



Once again, the actual point is 1.) that she said it, 2.) that, despite your brilliant observation, most people took her seriously, and what she said as 'true'.


May 22, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

But in general the public is woefully ignorant about the subject. 





The subject of homosexuality - yes. Mental illness is NOT the point.




First of all, the public is well versed in slickly marketed information about homosexuality. Legitimizing and mainstreaming homosexuality been one of the best, most effective marketing campaigns of the last 30 years or so.


Is that for good, ill -- or both? Opinons vary, and time will tell.


When the rantings of a mentally ill woman are exploited to try driving a certain narrative, you damn sure betcha mental illness is the point. Again, as the parent of mentally ill child, I find such explotation for political reasons to be revolting and highly offensive. 


Lastly, the views expressed by this pastor are hardly "mainstream." This is yet another broad swipe at the big, easy target of "Christianity." You are attempting, yet again, to cast anybody who might disagree with you even the slightest as a raving lunatic homophobe. 


Most Christians, clergy or congregation, would not agree with what that man was preaching. 


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