May 17, 2012 -- 11:30AM, arielg wrote:

It is a known fact that one of the early signs of disturbance in  many serial killers and other criminals , is that  as children, they  liked torturing and killing animals.An instinctive expression of  lack of respect for life left over from our animal past.

 If those instincts of aggression are not outgrown,  they become  career criminals, hunters or  join the military.

Wow, you're really getting desperate, aren't you?

What's next, comparisons to Nazis?

Wow, you're really getting desperate, aren't you?

What's next, comparisons to Nazis?

Nazism is the political institutionalizing of that tendency. Chew on that.

May 17, 2012 -- 1:48PM, arielg wrote:

Wow, you're really getting desperate, aren't you?

What's next, comparisons to Nazis?

Nazism is the political institutionalizing of that tendency. Chew on that.

Okay, that covers good old Adolf and the gang.  

What about Joseph Stalin? Can we drag him into this too?

May 17, 2012 -- 2:52PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

May 17, 2012 -- 1:00PM, Yavanna wrote:

May 17, 2012 -- 1:26AM, solfeggio wrote:

Why do some posters persist in throwing out nonsequiters as if they were pearls of wisdom? ( I guess it is just too much fun to deride any and all substantive points that some of us make.)

Is it such a joke to try to talk about the rights of sentient beings?

 

Not at all! Let's stop discussing animals and discuss humans! Then we'll finally be discussing sentient beings.

Animals are sentient. They value their own lives, can feel pain and experience terror. Therefore, there are unavoidable moral considerations that come into play when we choose to raise them as livestock or hunt them.

However, they are not sapient.

And, I think, the vegan/animal rights mentality takes the aforementioned moral considerations way too far, by trying to suggest animals should have the same moral consideration as human beings. 

Using that reasoning, plants should have the same level of moral consideration as animals.

That's not to say we should not also have moral consideration toward plants. But obviously, it does not bear the same weight as that toward animals, which in turn, should not bear the same weight as that toward human beings. 

The AR/vegan mentality fails to see the fundamental difference in kind, upon which the weight of moral consideration rests. Therefore, it can not, or refuses to, recognize the nonsensical irrationality of, for example, giving a horse or a pig "personhood" in a court of law -- or suggesting that hunting is "murder."

That was a good, thoughtful post. So I will think about it and  answer later.

Okay, that covers good old Adolf and the gang. What about Joseph Stalin? Can we drag him into this too?

Yes, we can. It is the same mentality of aggression and the attempt to impose certain outcomes by force. Shooting someone, person or animal, or going to war are all acts  of aggression.

(Which in very few cases could even be justified, but as an exception that should not even be considered as an option.  Circumstances will dictate)