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Switch to Forum Live View Redneck A-holes with guns
3 years ago  ::  Apr 08, 2012 - 8:52PM #41
jane2
Posts: 14,295

rabello


"-- Jane2 insults solfeggio because of where she lives, and insults anybody who happens to agree with solfeggio and labels them as mindless followers"


Sheer unadulterated nonsense. Solf lives in a small country on the other side of the world. Let her lecture those who live where she does.Solf presents a disdain for many things America but she doesn't live here, pay taxes or vote here.


I have never labelled anyone as a mindless follower of Solf or anyone else.


You and I live in very different worlds. Amen and so be it. I truly enjoy my world : middle-aged children, teen grandchildren and an oldest grandson who is twenty and acing his way through MIT. I'm not fond of the politics where I live but I like the people. Hot summers but all is air-conditioned and mild winters. Graciousness abounds.


Why not shoot a funny one-liner once in awhile? My grandkids shoot them with ease--marvelous senses of irony. They luv it when I shoot one back.


 

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 08, 2012 - 9:14PM #42
arielg
Posts: 9,116

I've also had regular and extensive contact with numerous experts and interested parties on all sides of the wolf issue. I don't think it's a stretch to say I know far more about this topic, from a very direct perspective, than anybody here.  MM


Knowewledge has nothing to do with the morality of destroying life. Serial murderers know a lot about how to  dispose of cadavers.  Hardly something to  give them credit for.


 You are trying to hide behind a supposed expertise to rationalize  your love of shooting animals. The fact of trying to justify yourself makes me believe there is still some  hope for you. Those who are too far gone wouldn't even bother.


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3 years ago  ::  Apr 08, 2012 - 9:46PM #43
rabello
Posts: 22,031

Bravo, arielg!  You DID say it far better than I did. 

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 12:08AM #44
solfeggio
Posts: 9,474

Rabello and arielg -


Many thanks for your insightful and supportive posts.  When people (like mytmouse this time) start to 'get' to me, you pull me back from the brink with your sensible remarks. 


Mytmouse has ALWAYS been on the side of the hunters and trappers of animals - any animals anywhere - but expecially in his part of the States, which is the West, so his reponse was to be expected.  But I don't think that just because you happen to live in an area, and have talked to a few people who purport to know something about the indigenous wildlife, or are a hunter, that automatically makes you an expert on the wildlife of the place.


Have wolves been hunted by humans to the brink of extinction?  A lot of people seem to think so.


www.endangeredwolfcenter.org/content/ext...


blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2009/...


www.graywolfconservation.com/Wild_Wolves...


www.wcs.org/saving-wildlife/other-carniv...


For some reason, Jane seems to have a problem with input from people who don't live in the States.  So, her responses are to be expected as well.


But, anyway, I saw the stories about how wolves were being killed and tortured for sport by hoons, and I felt very sad about that, as would anybody who hates to see pointless cruelty, and so I thought I'd start the thread to raise people's consciousness about this.


If mytmouse doesn't like it - well, tough beans.

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 12:17AM #45
solfeggio
Posts: 9,474

Jane -


I take it you have never visited New Zealand, but I've been to all the English-speaking countries at one time or another for varying periods of time, as well as having lived for years in Europe, and I can tell you with absolute certainty that there is NO difference between people anywhere.


None. Nada.  Nyet.  Nein.


Human beings everywhere are all the same.  We all want the same things.  We all love our families and hope to keep them well and happy.  We all want to stay healthy.  We all want to have a roof over our heads.  And we all want the people running our countries to look out for our welfare.


I live in a Commonwealth country.  I'm a subject of the Queen.  You live in a country that was originally settled to a great extent by the English.  If the British rulers of that day hadn't been such morons, you might well have never had to fight a revolution to get your independence, but might have ended up like Canada, a member of the Commonwealth.


And that wouldn't have been so bad. 


But we all speak English, we all have very similar cultures, we all think a lot alike, and of course we all fought on the same side in WWII. 


Keep a little perspective, please.


 

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 1:22AM #46
rabello
Posts: 22,031

Thanks, solfeggio!  I did not appreciate the condescending tone as if those of us who abhor hunting and trapping are ignorant "city slickers" or some such stereotype and are supposed to just change our priniciples when graced with the so-called expert knowledge of those who didn't even take the time to read the articles and then post to the topic.  Now that's "biased" in my book.  The blurb about pepperspraying or shooting grizzly bears dead was off topic and annoying.


I'd rather know what mytmouse, and Jane2 and farragut think should happen to those people who tortured that wolf, starting with the Forest Service employee who put it in motion and let it happen.....and what they think can be done to stop things like that from happening on a routine basis.....rather than get a "lesson" or preaching.


PS...You might be from New Zealand, but you don't say anything that is different than what American liberals have to say, so that's just a straw man.

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 9:51AM #47
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Apr 8, 2012 -- 8:39PM, rabello wrote:


Apr 8, 2012 -- 6:46PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


 Going into grizzly country without first, extensive knowledge of the bears and how to avoid trouble, and second, some sort of defense mechanism is not only going against a basic rule of nature (nature does not regard helplessness as a virture, don't make yourself helpless) -- it's flat out freakin' stupid.


Generally speaking, bear spray (an extremely powerful form of pepper spray) is the best defense, at least for those gutsy and/or experienced enough to travel alone in grizzly country.


Generally speaking again, it's far wiser to go in with at least two people -- three or more is even better.


In that case, to carry both bear spray and a firearm would be a good idea, IMO. In other words, every member of the party should have spray. The one with the most steady nerves and skill with a firearm should carry the firearm -- the best bet being a 12-guage loaded with slugs.





Off-topic. 


Intentionally trying to offend?


Like Marcion said, human beings without their toys are puny




I was merely passing along what some of the most knowlegble people have to say about traveling in bear country. If anybody is taking a hostile stance here, it's you. 


Why some seem to think that a love of nature and respect for wildlife should logically extend to misanthrophy and a revulsion toward technology and civilization baffles me. 

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 9:55AM #48
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Apr 8, 2012 -- 9:14PM, arielg wrote:


I've also had regular and extensive contact with numerous experts and interested parties on all sides of the wolf issue. I don't think it's a stretch to say I know far more about this topic, from a very direct perspective, than anybody here.  MM


Knowewledge has nothing to do with the morality of destroying life. Serial murderers know a lot about how to  dispose of cadavers.  Hardly something to  give them credit for.


 You are trying to hide behind a supposed expertise to rationalize  your love of shooting animals. The fact of trying to justify yourself makes me believe there is still some  hope for you. Those who are too far gone wouldn't even bother.





So, in other words, you're ignorant of this subject, and interested only in attempting to chastise those who might disagree with you. Your sanctimonius assumptions mean less than nothing to me.


Pony up with some substantial arguments, or forget it. 


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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 10:00AM #49
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Apr 9, 2012 -- 12:08AM, solfeggio wrote:


Rabello and arielg -


Many thanks for your insightful and supportive posts.  When people (like mytmouse this time) start to 'get' to me, you pull me back from the brink with your sensible remarks. 


Mytmouse has ALWAYS been on the side of the hunters and trappers of animals - any animals anywhere - but expecially in his part of the States, which is the West, so his reponse was to be expected.  But I don't think that just because you happen to live in an area, and have talked to a few people who purport to know something about the indigenous wildlife, or are a hunter, that automatically makes you an expert on the wildlife of the place.


Have wolves been hunted by humans to the brink of extinction?  A lot of people seem to think so.


www.endangeredwolfcenter.org/content/ext...


blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2009/...


www.graywolfconservation.com/Wild_Wolves...


www.wcs.org/saving-wildlife/other-carniv...


For some reason, Jane seems to have a problem with input from people who don't live in the States.  So, her responses are to be expected as well.


But, anyway, I saw the stories about how wolves were being killed and tortured for sport by hoons, and I felt very sad about that, as would anybody who hates to see pointless cruelty, and so I thought I'd start the thread to raise people's consciousness about this.


If mytmouse doesn't like it - well, tough beans.




Solf, like it or not, I've been in the same room with some of the world's top experts on wolves on more than one occassion. I know this topic very well, from several angles. 


Now, woul you like my -- very well informed -- perspective? Or, are you just going to continue to bluster?

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 10:24AM #50
arielg
Posts: 9,116

So, in other words, you're ignorant of this subject, and interested only in attempting to chastise those who disagree with you.


Thanks for clarifying that.



Nope, that is not what I am doing. I am  pointing out that your "expertise" is used to rationalize your lack of empathy for living things.


 It is an expertise at  the service of those who want to  manipulate the environment and the life of other creatures for the aggrandizement and benefit of humans.  It is not intended to learn to live in harmony with all forms of life.   See the difference? 


 It is a matter of how one perceives  the place of humans  in the world.


 


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