Apr 6, 2012 -- 5:47PM, mountain_man wrote:

Apr 6, 2012 -- 4:41PM, Cesmom wrote:

No one is suggesting that creationism be taught in schools.  That's not what this bill is about.

That is exactly what this bill is about. They are trying to get creationism into the classroom in any way they can. A student asking a question will be an opening for the teacher to start preaching creationism. These christian extremists will do anything they can to force their dogma on unsuspecting and impressionable children. They have proven they cannot be trusted.

Students learn by questioning.  If the teacher is not allowed to facilitate a discussion or debate questioning evolution or any other scientific theory, then they are not doing their job.

Apr 7, 2012 -- 7:00PM, Cesmom wrote:

Apr 6, 2012 -- 5:47PM, mountain_man wrote:

Apr 6, 2012 -- 4:41PM, Cesmom wrote:

No one is suggesting that creationism be taught in schools.  That's not what this bill is about.

That is exactly what this bill is about. They are trying to get creationism into the classroom in any way they can. A student asking a question will be an opening for the teacher to start preaching creationism. These christian extremists will do anything they can to force their dogma on unsuspecting and impressionable children. They have proven they cannot be trusted.

Students learn by questioning.  If the teacher is not allowed to facilitate a discussion or debate questioning evolution or any other scientific theory, then they are not doing their job.

Creationism is a religious concept--period. Many Christian faiths reject creationism as science.

When she was in the 5th grade my younger daughter was reading TRINITY by Leon Uris. She had a fool for a teacher. Said teacher was an anglophile of a peculiar sort. I tend to be rather pro-Brit but the Brits treated the Irish very badly. My daughter did question the teacher about this on her own and in private; I applauded my daughter for her courage. My heritage is Irish and English; our children were more English than Irish. As are my grandchildren. And not all ten-y-olds read Uris, etc. Our home had books and magazines everywhere.

Apr 7, 2012 -- 8:04PM, IreneAdler wrote:

Apr 7, 2012 -- 7:18PM, solfeggio wrote:

Evolution is not a 'theory' in the sense that it is nothing more than speculation.  In scientific terminology, a theory is an explanation of a tested and verified scientific observation, such as the theory of gravity, for example.

Creationism and intelligent design are not scientific theories by any stretch of the imagination.  That is why they have no place in the science curriculum.

And literal readings of the bible or any other holy book do not belong in any classroom.

Of course, all subjects should be approached with an open mind and critical thinking, but there is no need to debate the origins of life on this planet because they have been scientifically veried literally millions of times.

You don't debate creationism for the same reason that you don't debate whether or not the earth is flat or that women were created from a man's rib.

If the subject of creationism or intelligent design should come up in a classroom, the teacher can simply say that it has not only not been verified, but has been thoroughly debunked by reputable scientists, and then just move on to whatever was on the curriculum.

Not disagreeing, but I wonder if, in young people's minds, it (i.e. creationism, ID) all sounds credible and 'scientific' because adults have told them so.   Parents, religious figures stand pretty tall in the eyes of youngsters.  Kind of startling when one discovers some of the things parents, religious figures said don't stand up to reason. 

And, it takes some thinking to stand back and ask, "so where's the data supporting creationism, Evolution, ID?".   When it is learned that the substantiated data supports Evolution, and there "ain't none" for creationism,  well, that too, can fly into the face of what one's elders told us was the absolute truth. 

 

Irene.

 

 

Some children, but not all are raised by parents who don't think the clergy, pastors, etc. walk on water. If my parents thought a Sunday sermon was hogwash they would discuss it at length at the Sunday dinner table.

But I was raised in an intellectual Irish/English Catholic household. My private Catholic education in high school and college supported my parents' outlook. I give thanks that I have never been influenced by Provincialism.

I totally disagree with what has been going on in Rome for more than thirty years. Neither John Paul II nor Benedict XVI ever lived in true freedom and both disdained it. And now we have a Cardinal Archbishop of New York who went to seminary for high school. How weird. I do wonder how long those in NYC will take him seriously--he doesn't even know his cognacs.

Apr 7, 2012 -- 7:00PM, Cesmom wrote:

Students learn by questioning.

They learn by paying attention to the teacher.

If the teacher is not allowed to facilitate a discussion or debate questioning evolution or any other scientific theory, then they are not doing their job.

Bringing up religious dogma is not debating a scientific theory. Sure, they can debate and ask questions, just leave the religious dogma out of it. Ask questions about the hox genes and how they define body form and all that. Ask questions about recessive or dominant traits. Just leave the religious dogma out of it. Those questions have no place in a science classroom.

Apr 7, 2012 -- 7:00PM, Cesmom wrote:

Students learn by questioning.  If the teacher is not allowed to facilitate a discussion or debate questioning evolution or any other scientific theory, then they are not doing their job.

you must have gone to a special school. I went to several different schools in different towns, and states. never did we ask questions. Nor were we encouraged to ask questions. You learned what you were told. Period.