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Switch to Forum Live View Religious extremists at it again.....
3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 10:33AM #1
mountain_man
Posts: 39,684
Don't these people know that denying the fact of evolution is like denying the Earth is round? Apparently not. Now Tennessee wants teachers to express their backwards, religiously based, opinions in school classrooms.

Here's the news story.

Here's a quote: The measure passed by the Tennessee General Assembly would protect teachers who allow students to criticize evolution and other scientific theories, such as global warming. Republican Gov. Bill Haslam said this week he would likely sign it into law.

This is just more "teach the controversy" BS. There is no controversy in the scientific community about evolution. Evolution is a fact. It's been proven beyond a doubt. The ONLY objections are from religious extremists.

Religion is fine if that's what you want, and your choice. Just keep it out of the public school classroom. It is immoral to force religious beliefs on others and forcing them on vulnerable children in school is about as low as one can get.
Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 10:59AM #2
gregarious
Posts: 30

The measure passed by the Tennessee General Assembly would protect teachers who allow students to criticize evolution and other scientific theories, such as global warming.


uh, where's the religious extremism in this?

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 11:30AM #3
Girlchristian
Posts: 11,388

Apr 4, 2012 -- 10:59AM, gregarious wrote:


The measure passed by the Tennessee General Assembly would protect teachers who allow students to criticize evolution and other scientific theories, such as global warming.


uh, where's the religious extremism in this?




I agree. Schools are supposed to teach critical thinking and encourage debate and discussion, which this would allow. Unless one wants no discussion on things like evolution and no criticism of the theories surrounding it, I'm not sure I understand the issue. In my science class we discussed evolution and we discussed the holes in the theories and we discussed the controversy surrounding evolution.

"No matter how dark the moment, love and hope are always possible." George Chakiris

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.” Stuart Chase
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 12:13PM #4
mountain_man
Posts: 39,684

Apr 4, 2012 -- 10:59AM, gregarious wrote:

uh, where's the religious extremism in this?


That should be readily apparent; the ONLY objections to evolution come from religious extremists.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 12:17PM #5
mountain_man
Posts: 39,684

Apr 4, 2012 -- 11:30AM, Girlchristian wrote:

I agree. Schools are supposed to teach critical thinking and encourage debate and discussion, which this would allow.


It would allow no such thing. There is no debate over the fact of evolution. They are not interested in any debate or critical thinking skills, in fact religious extremists discourage such things. They only want to be able to force their extremist religious views on school kids.


Unless one wants no discussion on things like evolution and no criticism of the theories surrounding it, I'm not sure I understand the issue.


Those "criticisms" are nothing but religious extremist no different than demanding that teachers be able to teach the "controversy" about the Earth being flat or round.


In my science class we discussed evolution and we discussed the holes in the theories and we discussed the controversy surrounding evolution.


There are no holes and there is no controversy. Evolution is a fact.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 12:18PM #6
Girlchristian
Posts: 11,388

Apr 4, 2012 -- 12:13PM, mountain_man wrote:


Apr 4, 2012 -- 10:59AM, gregarious wrote:

uh, where's the religious extremism in this?


That should be readily apparent; the ONLY objections to evolution come from religious extremists.




So, you want teachers that encourage debate, discussion, and critical thinking to get in trouble for doing so? Allowing a student to question or criticize evolution (or any other theory) is how they learn and how they become adults that can think critically. Otherwise, you're just teaching them "this is the right answer and there will be no discussion" which is the same thing religious extremists do.

"No matter how dark the moment, love and hope are always possible." George Chakiris

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.” Stuart Chase
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 12:27PM #7
mountain_man
Posts: 39,684

Apr 4, 2012 -- 12:18PM, Girlchristian wrote:

So, you want teachers that encourage debate, discussion, and critical thinking to get in trouble for doing so?


No, I want teachers to keep their religious extremism out of the classroom. This is not about critical thinking but about not protecting religious extremism in the classroom.


Allowing a student to question or criticize evolution (or any other theory) is how they learn and how they become adults that can think critically.


No, it is not. Evolution is a fact. There is nothing there to criticize. They should be taught how to counter religious dogma with scientific facts. They should also learn what most creationists and other religious extremists utterly fail to comprehend; the scientific definition of "theory".


Otherwise, you're just teaching them "this is the right answer and there will be no discussion" which is the same thing religious extremists do.


False equivalency. Teaching scientific facts is not the same as imposing religious dogma.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 12:40PM #8
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,786

Apr 4, 2012 -- 10:33AM, mountain_man wrote:

Don't these people know that denying the fact of evolution is like denying the Earth is round? Apparently not. Now Tennessee wants teachers to express their backwards, religiously based, opinions in school classrooms.

Here's the news story.

Here's a quote: The measure passed by the Tennessee General Assembly would protect teachers who allow students to criticize evolution and other scientific theories, such as global warming. Republican Gov. Bill Haslam said this week he would likely sign it into law.

This is just more "teach the controversy" BS. There is no controversy in the scientific community about evolution. Evolution is a fact. It's been proven beyond a doubt. The ONLY objections are from religious extremists.

Religion is fine if that's what you want, and your choice. Just keep it out of the public school classroom. It is immoral to force religious beliefs on others and forcing them on vulnerable children in school is about as low as one can get.



Another step towards turning the United States into a theocracy. Those in power critisen Iran, while turning the U.S. into Iran.


Although I do not know if they are so caught in their ignorance as to teach creationism

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 1:08PM #9
mecdukebec
Posts: 14,715

I think children need to learn what is fact, and not what is fantasy, fiction, or fable.  I view the GW opponents as precisely the same located opponents as those churchmen in the CE who opposed Darwin or those in the fundamentalist American South who are, ironically, repeating the Scopes "Monkey Trial" of 1912.  When people are dummed down, they fall for a Quack who says "God wants me to bomb Iraq." or "God put me into Office to bomb Iran." 

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 04, 2012 - 2:31PM #10
rabello
Posts: 21,676

Apr 4, 2012 -- 1:08PM, mecdukebec wrote:


I think children need to learn what is fact, and not what is fantasy, fiction, or fable.  I view the GW opponents as precisely the same located opponents as those churchmen in the CE who opposed Darwin or those in the fundamentalist American South who are, ironically, repeating the Scopes "Monkey Trial" of 1912.  When people are dummed down, they fall for a Quack who says "God wants me to bomb Iraq." or "God put me into Office to bomb Iran." 




Agree


If students, who are actually not knowledgeable enough to actually challange legitimate scientific theory: that's why they're students, but if they want to "criticize" evolution, they should take philosophy class, or better yet, a religion class, and to be academically relevant, a world's religion class.


Not in a science class because that impedes their learning of science.  That's probably the one of the biggest reasons so many Americans are 'anti-science' and don't know and won't learn the scientific meaning of the word "theory"

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