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Switch to Forum Live View Unarmed Teen Shot By Neighborhood Watch Who Claims Self-Defense
2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 12:27PM #41
Erey
Posts: 18,594

Mar 20, 2012 -- 4:45AM, CharikIeia wrote:


Mar 19, 2012 -- 11:01PM, Erey wrote:


I suppose none of you considered, even for a nano-second that this Zimerman (who claims to be hispanic) did not shot the boy because of racist sentiments but rather because he was a parinoid nut-job and in his addled brain really felt he needed to do it for some kind of crime prevention measure?  No? 



I don't see why the two would be different explanations, Erey.


I still have to meet a racist who is not a paranoid nut-job. Do you know one?




Yes, LOL  being a racist and being a parinoid nut-job is not the same thing

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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 12:38PM #42
Girlchristian
Posts: 11,125

Mar 20, 2012 -- 4:45AM, CharikIeia wrote:


Mar 19, 2012 -- 11:01PM, Erey wrote:


I suppose none of you considered, even for a nano-second that this Zimerman (who claims to be hispanic) did not shot the boy because of racist sentiments but rather because he was a parinoid nut-job and in his addled brain really felt he needed to do it for some kind of crime prevention measure?  No? 



I don't see why the two would be different explanations, Erey.


I still have to meet a racist who is not a paranoid nut-job. Do you know one?





Sure, there are racists that aren't paranoid nut-jobs. Many older folks that were just raised that way wouldn't be considered paranoid nut-jobs, but they are racist because they still believe that the 'other' race is inferior--a belief that is usually leftover from how they were brought up.


I suspect that this man saw a young, black kid that didn't 'look' like he belonged in the neighborhood and then acted the way he did, which would make him racist or at least one hell of a bigot.

"No matter how dark the moment, love and hope are always possible." George Chakiris

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.” Stuart Chase
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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 12:42PM #43
shmuelgoldstein
Posts: 2,330

Mar 19, 2012 -- 12:22PM, TPaine wrote:

George Zimmerman, a 28-year old self-appointed neighborhood watch captain, shot and killed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in a gated community in Sanford, FL. ....  



Thank you, Second Amendment, which grants the likes of Zimmerman the "right" to bear arms.

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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 12:55PM #44
Larosser
Posts: 413

Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:


I can only recount my own experiences growing up deep in south Georgia and middle Georgia then Augusta and I never witnessed such. I grew up with Native American's, Gypsies, and African-American friends. We were dirt poor, literally, the yards of both my friends and my family didn't have a blade of grass. It was hell after a rain.....


I never witnessed any of that.



I was in a middle class whites only neighborhood and they had to bus little black kids in. In my opinion, that makes a difference.


Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:

I was in engineering, too and never saw such, but at the time, the grade level was such that not many African-Americans enrolled.



My first year, there was one.  He took a look at the graffiti, drew in a deep breath and marched down to the very front and center of the lecture hall and sat down. People got up and moved away, and there were many murmured comments and threats. He ignored them, took copious notes and blew those crackers out of the water GPA wise. He's still one of my heroes. :)


 


 


Mar 19, 2012 -- 9:30PM, Larosser wrote:

Is racism alive and well in the south? Indisputably yes.



Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:


General racism? I don't believe so. Probably no more so as any other pocket of the US of A.



It depends on what you mean by "general racism". I think the percentage of southerners who would don a white hood is pretty low, but there are a whole lot who will cross the street when they see a black man coming, and even more who will sit quiet when others discriminate based on race.


 It's hard for me to assess the "level" of racism in other parts of the U.S., as I've lived in the south most of my life. From the time I have spent in the northeast, it does seem to be a bit different in type. As a black friend of mine summed it up, in the south, they don't care how close we get as long as we don't get too uppity, and in in the north, they don't care how uppity we get as long as we don't get too close.


When I responded to the initial comments, the point I was trying to make is that racism - even in its most brutal expressions - isn't dead in America, and it's wishful thinking to suggest that it is. Is it better than half a century ago? Yes. But that's like saying that scarlet fever is better than bubonic plague. The mortality rate may be lower, but it's still unacceptable.



 

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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 1:05PM #45
mountain_man
Posts: 39,136

Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:42PM, shmuelgoldstein wrote:

Thank you, Second Amendment, which grants the likes of Zimmerman the "right" to bear arms.


It really doesn't, but that's the popular myth. In any case that does not give him the right to kill someone.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 1:45PM #46
TPaine
Posts: 9,304

It seems that a cell phone call by Trevon Martin to a teenage girl just before he died undercuts the story Zimmerman told the police. Zimmerman stated that he had stepped out of his truck to check the street he was on, and as he returned to the truck Martin attacked him from behind. The girl said that Treyvon told her that a man was watching him, so he pulled up his hoodie and walked away. He thought he had gotten away when the man confronted him and, "Trayvon said, 'What, are you following me for,' and the man said, 'What are you doing here.' Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell. I called him again and he didn't answer the phone." Link

"It is always to be taken for granted, that those who oppose an equality of rights never mean the exclusion should take place on themselves." -- Thomas Paine: Dissertations on First Principles of Government (July 7, 1795)
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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 2:31PM #47
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

Mar 20, 2012 -- 1:45PM, TPaine wrote:


It seems that a cell phone call by Trevon Martin to a teenage girl just before he died undercuts the story Zimmerman told the police. Zimmerman stated that he had stepped out of his truck to check the street he was on, and as he returned to the truck Martin attacked him from behind. The girl said that Treyvon told her that a man was watching him, so he pulled up his hoodie and walked away. He thought he had gotten away when the man confronted him and, "Trayvon said, 'What, are you following me for,' and the man said, 'What are you doing here.' Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell. I called him again and he didn't answer the phone." Link




So heart breaking. That nice young man killed for being in the wrong place, at the wrong time with Florida law that allows people to kill innocent people

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 2:57PM #48
DotNotInOz
Posts: 6,833

Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

 As a black friend of mine summed it up, in the south, they don't care how close we get as long as we don't get too uppity, and in in the north, they don't care how uppity we get as long as we don't get too close.


When I responded to the initial comments, the point I was trying to make is that racism - even in its most brutal expressions - isn't dead in America, and it's wishful thinking to suggest that it is. Is it better than half a century ago? Yes. But that's like saying that scarlet fever is better than bubonic plague. The mortality rate may be lower, but it's still unacceptable.



I heartily agree.


What I think more dangerous is that racism for the most part isn't as overt in the U.S. as it was even 30 years ago.


Whites tend to think that there's no more racism since outright, government-sanctioned segregation of the "can't eat or stay the night here" no longer is the norm.


However, look closely in any major city or even small town and there's still a skin-color ghetto in most places. Sure, non-whites who've managed to educate themselves into white-collar professions can live pretty much anywhere they can afford, but the less-educated with lower incomes typically live in a certain area.


Skin color determines who gets traffic-stopped as well as arrested more frequently--that's been proven in many places.


Indeed, the disease is less serious and the mortality rate lower...but it's still there.

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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 3:03PM #49
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

Mar 20, 2012 -- 2:57PM, DotNotInOz wrote:


Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

 As a black friend of mine summed it up, in the south, they don't care how close we get as long as we don't get too uppity, and in in the north, they don't care how uppity we get as long as we don't get too close.


When I responded to the initial comments, the point I was trying to make is that racism - even in its most brutal expressions - isn't dead in America, and it's wishful thinking to suggest that it is. Is it better than half a century ago? Yes. But that's like saying that scarlet fever is better than bubonic plague. The mortality rate may be lower, but it's still unacceptable.



I heartily agree.


What I think more dangerous is that racism for the most part isn't as overt in the U.S. as it was even 30 years ago.


Whites tend to think that there's no more racism since outright, government-sanctioned segregation of the "can't eat or stay the night here" no longer is the norm.


However, look closely in any major city or even small town and there's still a skin-color ghetto in most places. Sure, non-whites who've managed to educate themselves into white-collar professions can live pretty much anywhere they can afford, but the less-educated with lower incomes typically live in a certain area.


Skin color determines who gets traffic-stopped as well as arrested more frequently--that's been proven in many places.


Indeed, the disease is less serious and the mortality rate lower...but it's still there.



Unfortunately I think his is all true. :(((

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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2 years ago  ::  Mar 20, 2012 - 5:00PM #50
Esdraelon
Posts: 5,236

 


Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:


I can only recount my own experiences growing up deep in south Georgia and middle Georgia then Augusta and I never witnessed such. I grew up with Native American's, Gypsies, and African-American friends. We were dirt poor, literally, the yards of both my friends and my family didn't have a blade of grass. It was hell after a rain.....


I never witnessed any of that.



Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

I was in a middle class whites only neighborhood and they had to bus little black kids in. In my opinion, that makes a difference.



Busing to achieve racial integration as opposed to simply attending your neighborhood school was a travesty. The riots in the North however, were far in excess of the south, look back at Boston.


Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:

I was in engineering, too and never saw such, but at the time, the grade level was such that not mavy African-Americans enrolled.



Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

My first year, there was one.  He took a look at the graffiti, drew in a deep breath and marched down to the very front and center of the lecture hall and sat down. People got up and moved away, and there were many murmured comments and threats. He ignored them, took copious notes and blew those crackers out of the water GPA wise. He's still one of my heroes. :) 



OK


Mar 19, 2012 -- 9:30PM, Larosser wrote:

Is racism alive and well in the south? Indisputably yes.



Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:23PM, Esdraelon wrote:


General racism? I don't believe so. Probably no more so as any other pocket of the US of A.



Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

It depends on what you mean by "general racism". I think the percentage of southerners who would don a white hood is pretty low, but there are a whole lot who will cross the street when they see a black man coming, and even more who will sit quiet when others discriminate based on race.



Well, again, as as often as I have watched for it, I have never seen what appears as someone crossing the street to avoid a black man on the sidewalk. Obviously I've never been in the right place at the right time.


 

Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

It's hard for me to assess the "level" of racism in other parts of the U.S., as I've lived in the south most of my life. From the time I have spent in the northeast, it does seem to be a bit different in type. As a black friend of mine summed it up, in the south, they don't care how close we get as long as we don't get too uppity, and in in the north, they don't care how uppity we get as long as we don't get too close.



OK


Mar 20, 2012 -- 12:55PM, Larosser wrote:

When I responded to the initial comments, the point I was trying to make is that racism - even in its most brutal expressions - isn't dead in America, and it's wishful thinking to suggest that it is. Is it better than half a century ago? Yes. But that's like saying that scarlet fever is better than bubonic plague. The mortality rate may be lower, but it's still unacceptable.



'Most brutal expressions'? Can you give some examples?



 


 

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