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Switch to Forum Live View Can non-Christians go to heaven?
4 years ago  ::  Jul 15, 2010 - 11:37AM #11
Mysty101
Posts: 2,020

Yes, I believe the parable of the rich man is the most telling, but there was no timeline given. 


It was before Jesus died, so he could have been saved when Jesus descended to the dead.


SuZ

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 15, 2010 - 11:55AM #12
steve123
Posts: 610

Jul 15, 2010 -- 11:37AM, Mysty101 wrote:


Yes, I believe the parable of the rich man is the most telling, but there was no timeline given. 


It was before Jesus died, so he could have been saved when Jesus descended to the dead.


SuZ





True......Boy, I'm glad I'm not in charge of who goes where when we die.  I'm soooo very glad for our Saviour Jesus who is omnicient, omnipresent, and omni-powerful

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 15, 2010 - 12:08PM #13
Mysty101
Posts: 2,020

Also, there is no demention of time in eternity, and Jesus did die for us all.


One thing I'm sure---we can't understand the infinite with a finite mind Wink


SuZ

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 15, 2010 - 12:27PM #14
Bezant
Posts: 1,338

Jul 15, 2010 -- 10:56AM, Mysty101 wrote:


Jul 15, 2010 -- 9:34AM, Bezant wrote:


Jul 15, 2010 -- 8:19AM, steve123 wrote:


Jul 14, 2010 -- 7:24PM, Bob_Bennett wrote:


Yes, all can go to heaven.      See Acts 10:34-36.





Yes, all can go to heaven.  But will all go to heaven.  Based on God's word in the Bible, the answer is no.




Hello Steve


Keep in mind that "can"'s highly enabling; we've no guarantee there's a single person in Hell.




Hi Bezant,


We've really no guarantee of anything.  If we believe scripture there are fallen angels in hell, so I suppose others may have made damning choices.


I truly believe we are given chances to correct poor choices.  Certainly those who do horrible things have something wrong with their thought process.


SuZ




Hello Myst


I agree. For all Christianity's detail on death, the afterlife remains mysterious. I never denied any "person" (rather than "angel") is in hell. And neither I nor the Church (I'll later post the catechismal evidence) affirm the contrary though I think it likely.


My bottom line: we too often take hell for granted, as a football match: "lose" a "game" and you're out of the "Cup" (like Nigeria); "win" X "games" and you'll make "X" place.


I'm a good judge, but God is The Perfect Judge. He alone knows the most despicable souls, and He'll deal with them accordingly.

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 15, 2010 - 12:34PM #15
steve123
Posts: 610

Bezant,


 


Amen!

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 19, 2010 - 11:59AM #16
Bezant
Posts: 1,338

Jul 15, 2010 -- 12:34PM, steve123 wrote:


Bezant,


 


Amen!





Wink

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 24, 2010 - 3:41PM #17
soma77
Posts: 256

Yes, all go to heaven. Jesus said, love your brother so why do we condemn others and express love as if it is a competition? There is nothing to fear, if we walk with the Lord. We don't have to worry so much about others, just about our relationship with the Lord. One God is not going to beat up another God.
     As Christians we define narrow limits for our love and understanding instead of expanding our horrizons together. Many people think Christians are obnoxious ego dominated people haters and not the loving understanding believers in Christ that we are.
Jesus is our Lord and savior so with love we should stop throwing stones at other people without reflecting on ourselves. Jesus died for sinners and people of all types and from all religions. Some Christians want to stone anyone who is different.


Christian Mysticism

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 26, 2010 - 9:34AM #18
steve123
Posts: 610

Jul 24, 2010 -- 3:41PM, soma77 wrote:


Yes, all go to heaven. Jesus said, love your brother so why do we condemn others and express love as if it is a competition? There is nothing to fear, if we walk with the Lord. We don't have to worry so much about others, just about our relationship with the Lord. One God is not going to beat up another God.
     As Christians we define narrow limits for our love and understanding instead of expanding our horrizons together. Many people think Christians are obnoxious ego dominated people haters and not the loving understanding believers in Christ that we are.
Jesus is our Lord and savior so with love we should stop throwing stones at other people without reflecting on ourselves. Jesus died for sinners and people of all types and from all religions. Some Christians want to stone anyone who is different.


Christian Mysticism





Soma, "we define narrow limits for our love and understanding instead of expanding our horrizons together."


 


Jesus himself defined the way as narrow (see Matthew Chapter 5 and 6 and 7), and broad is the way of destruction and many go that way instead of going the narrow way.


 


"we should stop throwing stones at other people without reflecting on ourselves."


Amen!


 


"We don't have to worry so much about others, just about our relationship with the Lord. One God is not going to beat up another God."


Amen.  I dont' think anywone here was implying otherwise.


 


"Yes, all go to heaven."


 


Jesus says otherwise.  See John 8:44 -


 


"You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies."


 


Here Jesus is speaking to the people who said their father is God.  He told them otherwise.


 


Or consider Matthew 7:21 -


 


""Not everyone who says to Me, `Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter."


 


If we take the plain text as it is written, we easily come to the realization that not all will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven.

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 27, 2010 - 4:40AM #19
soma77
Posts: 256

The Bible tells us not to judge so everyone is in heaven, we just have to awaken to the fact. I think judging keeps our mind occupied so we don't feel the Bliss heaven has to offer.

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4 years ago  ::  Jul 27, 2010 - 9:57AM #20
Bezant
Posts: 1,338

Jul 27, 2010 -- 4:40AM, soma77 wrote:


The Bible tells us not to judge so everyone is in heaven, we just have to awaken to the fact. I think judging keeps our mind occupied so we don't feel the Bliss heaven has to offer.





That's not the Church's teaching on judging others and certainly not its teaching on salvation.


Secondly, the Church rejects Sola Scriptura. In case you were unaware.


And thirdly, we only reach heaven when we die. Darn.


The Church distinguishes between "judging actions" and "judging men." However, if anyone can dig up the Koine Greek term, it would serve better.


Without "judging actions" we essentially set our own moral rules. As a Christian human you have a civic and ethical responsibility to report a child molester to the authorities -- if it's within your power. You can't say, "Well, we're not supposed to judge..."


What's none of our business is "judging people." (John 8:1-11).


As I said before--God alone is The Perfect Judge. He alone knows each of us intimately and alone knows our personal culpability in our sins. You and I at best have an impression and are ignorant of outside circumstances that drive X to do Y.


www.catholic.com/thisrock/2007/0702btb.a...

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