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Switch to Forum Live View SEX ABUSE SCANDAL CONFRONTS RATZINGER PERSONNALY
4 years ago  ::  Mar 21, 2010 - 5:55PM #21
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

Ratzinger's message to the Irish  bishops was basically saying, "Allright, you all better start behaving or I will do nothing!"

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 21, 2010 - 7:05PM #22
Jupiter6208
Posts: 2,361

 i wouldn't equate what the TEC is going through to what the RCC is dealing or not dealing with....

"A person who is nice to you, but rude to the waiter, is not a nice person."  Dave Berry



You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger. Buddha.

What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies.”


― Thomas Cranmer
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 24, 2010 - 3:20PM #23
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

At last, John Magee has resigned as bishop in Ireland AND Joe Ratzinger has accepted the resignation. 


Maybe the Holy Spirit is at workand will soon uncover more secrets about Joe.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 26, 2010 - 1:01AM #24
angpuppy
Posts: 520

Mar 12, 2010 -- 6:45PM, TVaskoACT wrote:


According to the news links on Yahoo's home page, the sex abuse scandal is now dogging Joe Ratzinger.  It was reported that while he was archbishop of Munich, he knew of, kept silent about, and possiblt authorized the transfer of priests accused of sexual abuse without informing parishioners of the allegations surronding the priests.  Now, Joe is Pope Benedict 16!


What do atou think about this?




While the Pope was Archbishop of Munich, a priest there was accused of sexual abuse. He was pulled out of ministry and sent off for counseling. Then-Cardinal Ratzinger was involved in the decision to remove the priest from his parish assignment. He also approved a decision to house the priest in a rectory while he was undergoing counseling. Then the vicar general of the Munich archdiocese made the decision to let the accused priest help out at a parish. That vicar general, Msgr. Gerhard Gruber, says that he made that decision on his own, without consulting the cardinal. The future Pope never knew about it, he testifies.


The media is questioning whether or not the Pope actually didn't know or whether this is a cover up.  The fact is, we don't know. 


I, for one, am not for bankrupting our Church over this.  I think too many people use the scandal in the Church to compare to their own moral lives and to say "How can I listen to the Church's moral law on sexual morality, when those people in the hierachy are so much worse than I am?"  There is a lot of mixed anger that seems to come out that is more than just a reaction to protect the children.  A lot of the comments I see on yahoo news stem also from a resentment of Catholic moral teaching.  There a lot of other anger attached to this that isn't associated with our desire to protect our children.  What good does it due to sue the Church for covering up a case where the priest is dead? 


What I can say is this.  Priests hear other people's confessions all the time.  They know how people truly are underneith and as such I'd say they have a completely different and unique perspective of the sinfulness of humanity and the call to mercy.  Our role is not to be throwing stones at sinners.  Our role is not to remove the plank from other's eyes.  While we should look for active ways to prevent such things from happening in the future, we need to be merciful.  True mercy and forgiveness is not the dismissal of sin.  It is recognizing that something cries out for justice, but we forgive the debt owed.    As such, I say we need to look for ways to purify our Church, to encourage honesty and better policies and to deminish such coverups.  But, when I start hearing people inappropriately say that priests perpetrators should be castrated (I have read that online), excommunicated (in a misunderstood sense of the word, used only to mean that we bar them from Catholic life permenantly and thus prevent them from receiving the sacraments, thus seemingly condemning them to Hell), I say we truly need to learn a lesson from Christ on mercy and forgiveness.  It is especially important for the victims, as resentment hurts the victim more than the perpetrator.  If you want to find peace and come to terms with your past, you have to forgive everyone who has ever hurt you in your life.  Our goal should be to wish to see even the people we dispise the most on earth in Heaven with us.  We want to see them made holy by the grace of God.  In fact, we should be praying that they might become holier than we are.   

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 26, 2010 - 7:42AM #25
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

"I say we truly need to learn a lesson from Christ on mercy and  forgiveness.  It is especially important for the victims, as resentment  hurts the victim more than the perpetrator.  If you want to find peace  and come to terms with your past, you have to forgive everyone who has  ever hurt you in your life.  Our goal should be to wish to see even the  people we dispise the most on earth in Heaven with us."


 


Angpuppy,


Even Christ got pissed off at times.  Just look at what he did to the moneychangers who were doing business as usual.  The handlong of sexual abuse by Ratzinger and the other bishops seems also to be "business as usual" which may have to be corrected, possibly even like Christ handled the moneychangers. 


We can pray all we want to for divine intervention.  But if these perverts never see the light, ot is our responsibility to protect innocent shildren.  Christ said that if anyone should harm a child it would be better for him to drowned with a millstone around his neck/


It is time for us to syart demanding change beginning with Ratzinger's resignation!

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 27, 2010 - 11:39AM #26
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

It was reported by the Associated Pres on Yahoo today that Cardinal Walter Kasper said the criticisms of Ratzinger's handling of the sex abuse crise are"beyond any limit of justice and loyalty."


I say where has the Rat's justiceand loyalty been to the victims?

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 27, 2010 - 2:36PM #27
Bob10
Posts: 374

Only God Can Fire Pope Benedict After Scandals


As outrage mounted over the latest Catholic Church sex scandal, writer Christopher Hitchens called for the arrest of Pope Benedict XVI, and singer Sinead O'Connor said the pope should face a criminal investigation.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 27, 2010 - 4:46PM #28
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

As long as the Rat doesn't step out of Vatican City where he is the absolute monarch, he is safe from arrest and prosecution.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 28, 2010 - 1:30PM #29
angpuppy
Posts: 520

In response to this, I read a blog that reviewed the book "The Shack" and it had some very good points that I think really pertain to this. Full review here:  www.rev-know-it-all.com/2010/2010---04-0...


==========================================


What is excellent about 'The Shack'? Its treatment of God’s universal love and forgiveness is very good. In classic Protestantism and Islam, God loves some and hates others. It is called predestination. In Judaism, God’s justice demands punishment for heinous crimes. On the other hand Catholicism and in the New Testament teach that God is universally just, universally merciful and universally loving.


...[This] is why Catholicism is so universally hated when it is fully Catholic.The world wants thing to be good or bad, black or white, up or down. That is why God describes himself as a parent. For a parent who loves his children nothing is all one thing or the other. While acknowledging the bad, a father -- a real father -- still sees the good. ...


These have been hard times for Mother Church, the Bride. The world the flesh and the devil say that there are some who are beyond her maternal embrace. There are some whom the Father should not forgive. The Father, the true Father, the Father who is God punishes in order to heal, not to delight in the pain of the punished.


The children of Luther have never quite understood the universal love of God because their father, Martin Luther never did. He stands solidly with the world saying that a very human, a very incarnate, church should be destroyed. Only the perfect church as Luther defines it, should be left. And so says all the modern world. They cannot understand how universal love can be reconciled with justice.


A case in point. Despite what you may have heard, Pope Pius XII is credited with saving 700,000 Jews from the Nazi ovens in the Second World War. (If you don’t believe me, read “The Myth of Hitler’s Pope” by Rabbi David Dahlen, “Special Mission” by Dan Kurzman and “Triumph, the Power and the Glory of the Catholic Church” by H. W. Crocker III). Shockingly, the Church has been implicated in the flight of some Nazi criminals from justice after the war. How can a church which saved Jews then turn around and save Nazis? That is the wrong question. The real question is how can a God who loved and chose the Jews allow them to suffer so hideously and then, if He really loved them, how can He also love the fiends who tortured and killed them?  The idea that God’s love is universal sounds good on paper, but its demands enrage savage, fallen humanity.


Here’s an example of the problem. The world wants full disclosure. The Church offers the Holy Seal of Confessional. Untold numbers of priests have gone to their death rather than betray criminals. This is unacceptable to a blood thirsty world. Criminals should be betrayed -- unless of course that criminal is your son or daughter whom you love.


We don’t really want a God who is love, a God who is Father, loving both victim and perpetrator. We want a God who will take just revenge on those who have hurt us. That is why God allowed us to brutally kill His own beloved Son and then heard His son’s prayers that his “Papa,” His “Abba” forgive them.


Sometimes the Catholic Church fails to punish evildoers in the way that the world believes they should be punished. The church, or rather the weak and sinful people in whose hands God has placed the Church, tries to imitate their Lord. Sometimes they get it wrong. Most parents get it wrong, but often they get it wrong for the right reason. The pastors of the Church are compelled to see the common humanity of victim and perpetrator, indeed more than that. They see the potential divinization of both!


That is part of the reason why the Catholic Church opposes the death penalty. The death penalty is not necessarily forbidden. It must simply be administered with perfect justice. And who is the perfect, just judge in this sorry world? The death penalty is abhorrent to us partly because it ends the possibility of repentance, and God does not wish the death of a sinner, even though the world longs for it.  


What about all those people consigned to the flames by the Inquisition etc. etc. When the state has masqueraded as the Church it has done horrible things wearing clerical vestments, but when the Church has done the right thing and has been truly Herself, she has always struggled to love the sinner as Christ Himself loves the sinner. For this, she has been hated more than for any other thing. She holds up the high moral standard of Christ that Young’s book seems to brush away. She is hated for reminding people of their sins. At the same time holds out the hope of complete forgiveness, and she is hated all the more for doing so. May she always stand with her Lord at the cross which was intended for His shame but has become His sign of victory and the very emblem of God’s glory.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 28, 2010 - 2:43PM #30
TVaskoACT
Posts: 20

Angpuppy,


How does your most recent post spefically apply to this thread?  All I see is another attempt to spin the facts by ignoring what is relevant.

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