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8 years ago  ::  Aug 10, 2009 - 12:17PM #81
ToujoursDan
Posts: 1,065

No. I didn't promise you a survey. I said articles (amongst other things) and that was the first one I grabbed after a whole 15 second search, just like I said.


Now that I have showed you how to Googlesearch (and it really isn't that hard. Just try it!) and where to look in the local bookstore, the rest is up to you. Go. Read. Learn. Grow.


The fact that many men feel unable to form close bonds with other men and find this a problem isn't a well kept secret. It's discussed in many venues regularly, mostly by heterosexual men.


Your ignorance - willful or otherwise - and your evident unwillingness to follow up when shown where you can find the data, doesn't invalidate others' points. It only demonstrates a lack of good will on your part to debate honestly and responsibly. It only shows that you care more about not backing down in an argument than finding out whether you are actually correct or not. There is nothing I can say that will overcome that kind of self-pride.


Secondly, the fear of being perceived as homosexual is not the fault of the homosexual lobby. The goal of the homosexual lobby, as you put it, is to end fear of the perception of homosexuality so that heterosexual men can become secure enough of their own sexuality to reach out and form emotionally vulnerable relationships with other men without fear of being perceived as homosexual. Because ultimately what a 3rd party thinks won't matter.


 


God. Staring into the stupid burns. It's like looking at the sun too long.

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8 years ago  ::  Aug 10, 2009 - 1:48PM #82
ToujoursDan
Posts: 1,065

All I get is some lady professor who thinks male friendships should be more like woman's friendships.  Why should I credit her with knowing what male friendships should be like?  Men are not like women, they have different emotional needs and different motivations.  I find all this more liberal gender bending hogwash.



 


She is a therapist. Her clients are male. Her clients come in and discuss their problems. Evidently one reoccurring theme is the lack of intimacy many of her male clients feel when it comes to same sex friendship. She wrote about it. Many others have too.


What you are saying is that no third party should ever put two and two together and make a connection and draw conclusions based on what they are told by many other people. Only people who are experiencing it themselves are in a position to talk about it and only they can draw conclusions (and only if they agree with your experience). I seriously doubt you would apply this (wingnut) logic in other circumstances, like in courts of law.


Again, this is not a well kept secret. It is acknowledged by many men. It's a topic of discussion in men's groups.There are books about it. It's on the radio and TV.


I feel like I am arguing with someone who denies that the moon landing took place because he hasn't heard about it. And when I show him where to go get information about it he insists that unless I show him the moon rocks myself it's did happen.



Why don't YOU go to Mombassa and look for Obama's birth certificate.

Moderated by RJMcElwain on Aug 10, 2009 - 02:05PM
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8 years ago  ::  Aug 10, 2009 - 3:45PM #83
SeraphimR
Posts: 12,687

Aug 10, 2009 -- 1:48PM, ToujoursDan wrote:


All I get is some lady professor who thinks male friendships should be more like woman's friendships.  Why should I credit her with knowing what male friendships should be like?  Men are not like women, they have different emotional needs and different motivations.  I find all this more liberal gender bending hogwash.



 


She is a therapist. Her clients are male. Her clients come in and discuss their problems. Evidently one reoccurring theme is the lack of intimacy many of her male clients feel when it comes to same sex friendship. She wrote about it. Many others have too.


What you are saying is that no third party should ever put two and two together and make a connection and draw conclusions based on what they are told by many other people. Only people who are experiencing it themselves are in a position to talk about it and only they can draw conclusions (and only if they agree with your experience). I seriously doubt you would apply this (wingnut) logic in other circumstances, like in courts of law.


Again, this is not a well kept secret. It is acknowledged by many men. It's a topic of discussion in men's groups.There are books about it. It's on the radio and TV.


I feel like I am arguing with someone who denies that the moon landing took place because he hasn't heard about it. And when I show him where to go get information about it he insists that unless I show him the moon rocks myself it's did happen.



Why don't YOU go to Mombassa and look for Obama's birth certificate.




She has clients.  Unhappy people.  She sees only the dysfunctional cases.  You can't draw generalizations from exceptions.


And, yes, one doesn't draw conclusions from anecdotal data.  That is like a very important principal.  It might be a clue to start an investigation, but not to draw conclusions.  Or if one does, my anecdotal data is as good as anybody elses.


And there is alot of bizarre stuff on TV and in books.


Bob promised me surveys, hopefully done with a bit of statistical rigor.


Where are these surveys?

“So long as there is squalor in the world, those obsessed with social justice feel obliged not only to live in it themselves but also to spread it evenly.”

http://takimag.com/article/the_ugly_truth_theodore_dalrymple
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8 years ago  ::  Aug 10, 2009 - 3:49PM #84
ToujoursDan
Posts: 1,065


And one doesn't draw conclusions from anecdotal data.  Or if one does, my anecdotal data is as good as anybody elses.


 


And there is alot of bizarre stuff on TV and in books.



 


...and you're not going to make the effort to find out whether it is bizarre or not because you might learn something. Gotcha.


 


 


I think we're finished here. And Bob didn't promise you anything. You made that up as well.


 


 


 

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8 years ago  ::  Aug 10, 2009 - 3:51PM #85
SeraphimR
Posts: 12,687

Aug 10, 2009 -- 3:49PM, ToujoursDan wrote:



And one doesn't draw conclusions from anecdotal data.  Or if one does, my anecdotal data is as good as anybody elses.


 


And there is alot of bizarre stuff on TV and in books.



 


...and you're not going to make the effort to find out whether it is bizarre or not because you might learn something. Gotcha.


 


I think we're finished here. And Bob didn't promise you anything. You made that up as well.


 


 


 




Bye.

“So long as there is squalor in the world, those obsessed with social justice feel obliged not only to live in it themselves but also to spread it evenly.”

http://takimag.com/article/the_ugly_truth_theodore_dalrymple
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