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6 years ago  ::  Sep 27, 2008 - 10:55AM #1
Shaner
Posts: 1,596
I wanted to do this in the form of a Poll, but I couldn't find that feature, so.........

Do you believe one Candidate emerged as a winner over the other?

Given the state of the economy right now, did one Candidate's position appeal to you more?
(I realize this is a tough question to answer, until Congress puts their package together) so I'm referring to the current state......re tax cuts, tax increases, etc.

Which candidate appealed to you more with their stance on the Iraq war, Afghanistan? 

If you're one of the undecided, did the Debate help you to make a choice? 

There may be other questions not posted here that you'd like to bring up, please do so.

Look forward to your comments!

Peace
Sandy
"Lord, to whom shall we go?  You have the Words of Eternal Life"
"Philippians 4:13. "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me."
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 27, 2008 - 10:55AM #2
Shaner
Posts: 1,596
I wanted to do this in the form of a Poll, but I couldn't find that feature, so.........

Do you believe one Candidate emerged as a winner over the other?

Given the state of the economy right now, did one Candidate's position appeal to you more?
(I realize this is a tough question to answer, until Congress puts their package together) so I'm referring to the current state......re tax cuts, tax increases, etc.

Which candidate appealed to you more with their stance on the Iraq war, Afghanistan? 

If you're one of the undecided, did the Debate help you to make a choice? 

There may be other questions not posted here that you'd like to bring up, please do so.

Look forward to your comments!

Peace
Sandy
"Lord, to whom shall we go?  You have the Words of Eternal Life"
"Philippians 4:13. "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me."
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 27, 2008 - 3:53PM #3
gilg
Posts: 5,200
Sandy,


[COLOR="Blue"]Do you believe one Candidate emerged as a winner over the other?[/COLOR]

The consensus here was Obama is the winner thought one hard-core Limbaugh follower insists McCain slaughtered Obama. What I found interested here were the women, they thought McCain was condescending and worse because he didn’t look at Obama during the debate, I didn’t notice that until they brought it up. I think only one vote changed, it was a Ron Paul female that was leaning towards McCain but the security issue moved her to Obama.
[COLOR="Blue"]
Given the state of the economy right now, did one Candidate's position appeal to you more?
(I realize this is a tough question to answer, until Congress puts their package together) so I'm referring to the current state......re tax cuts, tax increases, etc.[/COLOR]

No, they both avoided the issue & I wished they had discussed it; I am against the bailout so it would have been good to hear reasons why we should support it. Most of us here (6 out of 8) didn’t like McCain’s response that he would freeze spending, it didn’t seem like a thoughtful solution, it was using a hatchet instead of a scalpel as remarked by his opponent.

[COLOR="Blue"]Which candidate appealed to you more with their stance on the Iraq war, Afghanistan? [/COLOR]

Obama, I thought he could have done a better job especially if he would 1) answered the question about lessons learned from Vietnam, one is the Powell Doctrine which was ignored in the invasion of Iraq; 2), we are aren’t winning and the Iraq government is closer to Iran than us, and the Shiites and Sunnis, including the government want a timetable and want us out. McCain basically repeats the Neocon doctrine and I think that is morally wrong and over the long run it is counter productive.
[COLOR="Blue"]
If you're one of the undecided, did the Debate help you to make a choice?
[/COLOR]
Not me. It did move one person towards Obama.
[COLOR="Blue"]
There may be other questions not posted here that you'd like to bring up, please do so[/COLOR].

A quick response, there is a party going on and I gotta run, perhaps tomorrow or the next day I'll respond to the last question.
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 27, 2008 - 9:14PM #4
newsjunkie
Posts: 5,748
[QUOTE=Shaner;788434]I wanted to do this in the form of a Poll, but I couldn't find that feature, so.........

Do you believe one Candidate emerged as a winner over the other?

Given the state of the economy right now, did one Candidate's position appeal to you more?
(I realize this is a tough question to answer, until Congress puts their package together) so I'm referring to the current state......re tax cuts, tax increases, etc.

Which candidate appealed to you more with their stance on the Iraq war, Afghanistan? 

If you're one of the undecided, did the Debate help you to make a choice? 

There may be other questions not posted here that you'd like to bring up, please do so.

Look forward to your comments!

Peace
Sandy[/QUOTE]

Disclosure: I support Obama.

That said, I thought McCain did a little better than Obama because most of the debate was on foreign policy. Obama's answers on the economy were better than McCain's, but neither one was terrific on that. Overall, I think McCain won but by a very small margin.

I think Obama's stance on the economy is far better than McCain's. McCain's  still singing the same "trickle down" tune that Reagan did almost 30 years ago. Deregulation got us into a huge economic mess, and McCain has been right there with the other deregulating republicans for 25 years.

Regarding the bail-out, I really do think something has to be done. The Bush plan was a non-starter, calling for no oversight of the Treasury Secretary's decisions at all, ever. That's ridiculous. I think Obama had the right approach, calling for bipartisan oversight, giving taxpayers the profits (if there are any) from investments they're bailing out, and calling for no "golden parachutes" for execs. McCain seemed to have been in agreement with those basic points, but when he went to Washington, he did not seem to have had much to contribute to the negotiations. The House Republicans went their own way, not caring if they threw McCain under the bus in doing so. A lot of details need to be worked out, but something has to be done.

I've always been against the Iraq war, so of course I'm with Obama there. I'm not sure what can be done in Afghanistan. That is a very difficult area. Problem with McCain's views is I don't know what, in his view, "winning" in Iraq is. He says we shouldn't leave until we've won, but you have to have some idea of what winning looks like or you're setting yourself up for a never-ending occupation.

I think McCain needed a big win in that debate, as foreign policy is his strong suit. I think he did well, but did not knock it out of the park. Therefore, I don't think it will be a game changer. Will be interesting to see whether independents were moved by the debate. Since there was no big winner/big loser, I'm not sure we'll see much movement.
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 12:11AM #5
jane2
Posts: 14,295
I'm for McCain for reasons I've stated on the Catholic Discussion board several times. If Hillary were heading the Dem ticket I would be for her.
McCain will carry my state no matter how I vote. This will be the first time I've ever voted for a Republican for president.

Obama had a chance to knock McCain out of the ballpark with the initial presentations on the economy but he couldn't do it. I'd give the edge in the debate to McCain. (But I like McCain's style better than Obama's.)

I was against going into Iraq but the surge did do pretty much what it was intended to do. Unfortunately, after the fall of Bagdad, Bush did not persue Colin Powell's advice to go in with overwhelming force. We should have.
In answer to the question about what we learned from Vietnam McCain pointed out the difficulties of just leaving..

This is a strange year politically and I don't know how it will turn out.
But given what's happened to the economy Obama should have buried McCain and he hasn't. I think race is a bigger issue than many want to believe.

I disagree with both candidates about raising taxes. They need to be raised. Our national infrastructure is a mess. Our military needs to be rebuilt and we need to take care of veterans, especially those who have fought in foreign wars with mental and physical ministration. Education is a mess, especially in poorer areas. Even in good suburban districts it takes saavy
parents to get all that children need.

In the end I don't think the debates will make much difference. I did think Obama was rude more thasn once; McCain does better zingers. Again, I don't know what will happen between now and election day.
discuss catholicism
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 2:24AM #6
Jwbidwell
Posts: 173
[QUOTE=friendofsaints&angels;789682]... I did think that both candidates showed their true colors, just before the debate started. Mccain wants to reapir the economy, and Obama wants to keep campaining and debating. I personally thought that Mccain showed a true denial of self and put the interest of the people of this country first, I feel Obama did the exact opposite. ...[/QUOTE]

McCain's actions were pure politics, and obviously so given that he's done this kind of thing before.

Matt Welch, "McCain resurrects an old stunt", Los Angeles Times (9/26/08)

Here's one of the most insightful line's in Welch's article: "This is not an election about ideas or policy; it's an election about a Great Man, facing down an interloper."

This attitude was on full display at the debate. McCain was embarrassingly condescending towards Obama. (What Jane called "zingers".) While this may play well to our reality TV culture, it isn't something we should be proud of, nor should we continue to reward this kind of behavior.

What I took from the debate is that McCain may have the experience, but Obama has vision. You can easily work around a lack of experience, but you can't fake vision. And that to me is the real job of President, to chart the course for our nation, and to hire the best people to get us there.

How can I trust McCain in that role, when he can't even select a VP of his own choosing? When he talked about Gen. Petraeus during the debate, it was unclear who would be the boss of whom. The Republican Party loves McCain's maverick image but they reject his ideas. Theirs is a marriage of convenience for the sake of attaining power, but it's painfully obvious that McCain is the weaker partner.

I don't have these reservations about Obama, and I like the vision he's articulated. It may not be perfect, but it's a lot better than what the Republican Party will give us, which is little different than what they've given us the last eight years and we all know how well that's turned out.
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 11:46AM #7
RAFFEY
Posts: 49
Up until fridays debate i was undecided and now am unfortunatly leaning towards OBAMA,i say unfortunatly because i liked mccain/palins faith but this election cant be about faith intirely its got to consist of much more in ways of helping us out of the mess the republicans have gotten us into economicaly and militarily obama made alot of good points left unanswerd by mccain even in regards to our military were i was sure mccain would win was left with egg on his face with the question of why we took are eye off binlauden and jumped into iraq spending twice as much money each month on a country with a trillion dollar surplus able to foot the bill on their own.(i m still woozy from that remark)
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 12:05PM #8
RAFFEY
Posts: 49
Has anyone heard all the sexist remarks from other world leaders to palin and the comments about her being attractive is why the american people are behind her,thats an insult even though were all aware a vote for mccain is a vote for palin knowin mccain wont last 4yrs cognitively reminds me of the california gov,election with the porn star and people voting for her because of her looks,are people that shallow?she,s a soccer mom just like you/me but i dont want a soccer mom to be my pres,i want someone better than me intilectualy/politicaly able to not only govern a state but lead a nation.someone hwo knows what the heck is going on in the world not only in their state but in the hole world not only able to relate because they have problems but able to solve those problems not just manage them i want a person to take the lead in world economics,this maybe asking abit much but at least come close to my expectations.
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 1:10PM #9
gilg
Posts: 5,200
[QUOTE=jane2;789700]

Obama had a chance to knock McCain out of the ballpark with the initial presentations on the economy but he couldn't do it.

[COLOR="Blue"]i agree, he didn't score a home run.[/COLOR]

]I was against going into Iraq but the surge did do pretty much what it was intended to do. Unfortunately, after the fall of Bagdad, Bush did not persue Colin Powell's advice to go in with overwhelming force. We should have.
[COLOR="Blue"]
The Powell Doctrine is based on lessons learned from Vietnam, it discusses criteria the military feels is necessary BEFORE invading another country and overwhelming force is only one of the factors and it was obviously ignored as the rest of the doctrine. After the fall of Baghdad, the only elements left of the Powell Doctrine that were applicable were: having a clearly defined exit plan and the support of the American people and of course that did not happen (See also the Weinberger Doctrine which is similar to the Powell Doctrine that was operative during the Gulf War and why Iraq wasn’t occupied.[/COLOR]


In answer to the question about what we learned from Vietnam McCain pointed out the difficulties of just leaving.
[COLOR="Blue"]
He didn’t answer the question, from other interviews and article written, the lesson that McCain seems to have learned is that we could have won Vietnam if Democrats had been more supportive of the war, I would say he missed the military lessons learned and he obviously did not learn what Weinberger, Powell, and many military leaders did learn[/COLOR].

This is a strange year politically and I don't know how it will turn out
[COLOR="Blue"]
I don’t either but I seriously doubt Iraq will turn out the way envisioned by the Neocons. The Shiite majority government is closer aligned to Iran than to us, the Iraqi do not want us and us there & they want a timetable for our withdrawl, we are arming the Sunnis (that is a key component of the surge) and giving them money to fight Al-Queda but once we leave they may use those arms to fight the Shiites that are controlling the oil money; if the Shiites share the money with the Sunnis and respect the religious differences perhaps the Iraqi will get along – in the end, it will be the Iraqi and not us that decides their fate.

I don’t know how the economy will turn out but I am against the bailout, it is rewarding corruption and sticking the taxpayers with the sins of Wall & K Streets.
[/COLOR]



But given what's happened to the economy Obama should have buried McCain and he hasn't.

[COLOR="Blue"]I agree.[/COLOR]

[/QUOTE]

[COLOR="Blue"]
I think race is a bigger issue than many want to believe.[/COLOR]

Jane,

I agree.

If Obama wasn't ½ white, race would not be an issue & most likely he would be way ahead, the young may not be as color blind as the older generations but the old are the most reliable voters and less likely to change. I see it in the voter demographics and most clearly I saw it during our family reunion. Most of the young were for Obama and the parents for McCain.
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6 years ago  ::  Sep 28, 2008 - 1:15PM #10
gilg
Posts: 5,200
friendofsaints&angels

[COLOR="Blue"] Mccain was at the White House, trying to hammer out problems.[/COLOR].

LOL!

But I do agree that he has a hammer approach to problem solving.
[COLOR="Blue"]
Mccain wants to reapir the economy[/COLOR]…

Repair?  Freezing spending except for the military, giving the super rich big tax breaks sound like more McBush economic-ideology than “repairing” the economy to help the common man.


RAFFEY,

You may have a point.  Yesterday, at a party, the priest said he was supporting the McCain ticket. He didn’t believe McCain was really pro-life but he thought Palin had a good chance of becoming President and he thought she was pro-life and so all other issues were secondary.


Now, back to football.
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