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Switch to Forum Live View Teen Girl Exorcism Squad
3 years ago  ::  Apr 16, 2012 - 10:51AM #21
smcisaac
Posts: 7,980

Apr 16, 2012 -- 10:22AM, Mostyn32 wrote:


Seraphim, I've come to the conclusion that if we were discussing the joy of living with dogs, you would immediately weigh in with the view that cats make better companions than dogs, not because you have any great love for cats, but merely to state an opposite view!




Next year perhaps we should challenge Seraphim to give up straw men and red herrings for Lent.

"Truth did not come into the world naked, but it came in types and images. The world will not receive truth in any other way."  Gospel of Philip, Logion 72

"Christ will regenerate all things; through Him all things will be purged, and return into eternal life. And when the Son shall deliver up the kingdom to the Father, all things will be God; that is, all things will still exist, but God will exist in them, and they will be full of Him." Fabius Manus Victorinus, c. 350 AD
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 16, 2012 - 4:36PM #22
SeraphimR
Posts: 9,889

Apr 16, 2012 -- 10:22AM, Mostyn32 wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:28PM, SeraphimR wrote:


Are people using "brainwashed" to mean being taught something you all don't believe in?


If that is the case, I could accuse you all of being brainwashed.  But what would  be the point of that?


I am rather suspicious of all this talk of child abuse and brainwashing.  You are setting up the conditions necessary for the State to seize the children of unpopular parents.  But maybe you are OK with that.




 


Seraphim, I've come to the conclusion that if we were discussing the joy of living with dogs, you would immediately weigh in with the view that cats make better companions than dogs, not because you have any great love for cats, but merely to state an opposite view!


Nobody is suggesting that the state "seize" the Larson girls, just that what they've been taught and obviously blindly believe is mediaeval. As for the rest of us being brainwashed, I don't know about you but I have examined my beliefs thoroughly. Brainwashed people don't do that. I'd also venture to say that most of the B'net posters have spent time mulling over the veracity of their beliefs. 




Mostyn:


I am utterly sincere in all my postings.


Cats are much better than dogs.


Why is it obvious that the Larsen girls believe "blindly"?


How thoroughly have you studied demons?  How many exorcisms have you witnessed?  Have you been present at the evocation of demons?


Might I suggest that the Larsen girls know a whole lot more about demons than you do, including practical experience.


I have mulled over the veracity of my beliefs and often come to an opinions very different from yours.  I can only conclude that your ideas are formed uncritically from the cultural milieu you happened to be born in, a milieu that is profoundly warped from my observation.


----------------------


Smc:


Lent is over.


-----------------------


You all (progressive people) don't appreciate just how hostile and threatining your attitudes are to right thinking people like me.


That you all mock my fears just underscores how hostile you are. 


You make no attempt to view our (right thinking people) sympathetically.  You all are not the wonderful people you believe yourselves to be.  I am well acquainted with your ugly side.




People with a mission to save the earth want the earth to seem worse than it is so their mission will look more important.


P.J. O'Rourke
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 11:08AM #23
smcisaac
Posts: 7,980

Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:28PM, SeraphimR wrote:

You are setting up the conditions necessary for the State to seize the children of unpopular parents.  But maybe you are OK with that.




I believe you when you say your beliefs are sincere.  But see, here's the part where you depart from expressing your own sincere beliefs and enter the hall of mirrors that is rhetorical fallacy.  Nothing in this discussion had anything to do with state seizure of children until you introduced the issue.  That's a red herring.  And the implicit premise that anyone here is advocating that, or would, is a straw man. 


In almost every thread on these boards that you join, you eventually try to derail the thrust of the discussion with these sorts of straw men and red herrings.  The intentional use of fallacies in argument is inherently deceptive, and therefore, necessarily insincere. I don't know whether you do this intentionally or merely as an inadvertent consequence of undisciplined thought, but you seem intelligent enough that I suspect the former rather than the latter.  Even if the personal beliefs behind your rhetorical tactics may indeed be sincere, your aggressive use of insincere argumentative techniques undermines our ability to receive your words as a sincere effort to advance the discussion.  In turn, if the insincerity of your motivations for engaging with us is so clearly and consistently evident, then it should be no surprise that the underlying sincerity of your beliefs might also be difficult for others to recognize.

"Truth did not come into the world naked, but it came in types and images. The world will not receive truth in any other way."  Gospel of Philip, Logion 72

"Christ will regenerate all things; through Him all things will be purged, and return into eternal life. And when the Son shall deliver up the kingdom to the Father, all things will be God; that is, all things will still exist, but God will exist in them, and they will be full of Him." Fabius Manus Victorinus, c. 350 AD
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 4:26PM #24
SeraphimR
Posts: 9,889

If one were to make accusations of child abuse and "brainwashing" to a Child Protective Services it might very well result in government intervention and the seizure of children.


If there is no suggestion that the children ought to be seized then less intemperate language ought to be used.  If the accusations are mere grandstanding to show off the high moral character of the posters in question there I suggest you might find insincerity.


People with a mission to save the earth want the earth to seem worse than it is so their mission will look more important.


P.J. O'Rourke
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 4:58PM #25
dblad
Posts: 1,703

Possession and exorcisms in the Christian Scriptures (New Testament)


Numerous cases of demonic possession and exorcisms by Jesus and his disciples are reported in the Gospels and Acts. The Epistles by Paul and other authors and the book of Revelation are silent on these topics. We can gather certain conclusions about the exorcism procedures used in Palestine during the first century CE from the Scriptures:

bullet Cause of possession: In the Bible, victims of possession are never held responsible for their situation. There are no references in the Christian Scriptures which imply that their possession was caused by some sin in their life. None of the victims were criticized for having allowed themselves to become possessed.
bullet Animals can be possessed: Matthew 8:30, and parallel passages, describe that demons can possess pigs.
bullet Multiple possession: Various passages refer to possession of a single individual by multiple demons. Luke 8:30 describes a man who was possessed by many demons; he used the term "legion" which was a unit of 6,000 soldiers.
bullet Gifts of demons: Demons can grant special powers to people. In Acts 16:16 a woman was given the power to foretell the future by her indwelling evil spirit. But this appears to be an exception; other passages describe how demons harm people.
bullet Illnesses and disorders generated by demons: Luke 9:39 apparently describes a case of epilepsy caused by a demon. Luke 11:14 documents a person who was unable to speak because of an indwelling demon. Luke 13:10-13 describes a woman who had been unable to straighten her back for almost 2 decades because of a evil spirit. 1
bullet Demonic speech:  Numerous passages in the Bible describe indwelling demons speaking to the exorcist, presumably by taking control of the individual's vocal chords.
bullet Demons' strength:  Mark 5:4 describes how an indwelling spirit causes its victim to have superhuman strength, so that fetters and chains could not hold him.
bullet Demons vary in wickedness: Matthew 12:45 describes how a spirit left a person, but returned with seven others who were more wicked than the original spirit was.
bullet Exorcisms were usually easy to perform: With one exception, Jesus or an apostle simply ordered the evil spirit to depart, and the demon immediately complied.
bullet Some exorcisms require special preparation: Jesus' disciples were unable to rid a boy of an evil spirit that was apparently causing the child to be both mute and epileptic. Jesus cured the child and explained that the only way to rid a person of this type of demon was through prior prayer and fasting.
bullet Using items of clothing: Acts 19:12 described how items of clothing or facecloths that once been used by Paul had magical powers and were used to cure people suffering from diseases or evil spirits.
bullet Only Christians can perform exorcisms: Acts 19:13 describes how seven non-Christians attempted to exorcise demons in the name of Jesus and Paul. They failed. All were attacked and beaten by the demon-controlled man who ripped their clothes off.
bullet Commanding in the name of Jesus: After Jesus' execution, exorcisms were done in the name of Jesus:
bullet Acts 16:16 described a slave girl who was possessed. Paul exorcised a "spirit of divination" from her. He commanded the spirit to leave "in the name of Jesus."
bullet Acts 19:13 described how some itinerant Jewish exorcists attempted to exorcise a demon   saying "In the name of Jesus, whom Paul preaches, I command you to come out." They were unsuccessful, apparently because they were not  Christian believers.

bullet Danger in exorcism: In Acts 19:13, the demon-possessed man exhibited superhuman strength. He turned on seven Jewish exorcists, beat them, and expelled them from the house with their clothes ripped off. The evil spirit had apparently recognized that the exorcists were not Christian; he refused to follow their commands.
bullet The sick went to the exorcist: The sick were brought to the apostles; the apostles did not seek out the sick. With one exception, all were cured, whether they suffered from demon infestation or physical illness. Nobody in the Bible had a exorcism ministry.
bullet Return of demons: Matthew 12:43 describes a demon who left a man, presumably because of an exorcism. He returned later with seven other evil spirits to repossess the person. However, there is no mention of any of the exorcisms by Jesus or his followers having produced only temporary cures.
bullet

Exorcism is dependent upon the victim's faith: In Mark 9:18, Jesus explained to a man that all things are possible, including the exorcism of his son, to those who believe.


www.religioustolerance.org/chr_exor1.htm


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3 years ago  ::  Apr 20, 2012 - 12:14PM #26
rideronthastorm
Posts: 5,869

This is rediclous Im tired of old Bob when is that freak gonna shut up? When he stops getting paid.Im still tramatized by his brainwashing me and my sister in the 80s great satan scare.

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