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Switch to Forum Live View .... holy movement....
5 years ago  ::  Mar 22, 2010 - 7:22PM #1
Leight
Posts: 1,438

...yesterday, I got with the dancing in Church... it really adds a new dimension... dancing with God..

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 23, 2010 - 12:55PM #2
sincerly
Posts: 4,049

Mar 22, 2010 -- 7:22PM, Leight wrote:


...yesterday, I got with the dancing in Church... it really adds a new dimension... dancing with God..





I don't doubt it adding a new dimension. But holy or unholy? Some things man has added to the Worship of GOD falls into the Prov.14:12 category. "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof [are] the ways of death."

Peace,   Sincerly.      As long as sin is practiced, one will search for a means to validate the continuing therein. ANON

The greatest want of the world is the want of men--men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.---- ANON  (Ellen G. White. 1882)
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 23, 2010 - 3:30PM #3
Leight
Posts: 1,438

....and many things man has subtracted from the worship of God... loving Him with all our mind, body, soul and spirit....  check out psalm 150...  our bodies have breath do they not?  And too in the Psalm it mentions the tamborine and the dance....  and is every thing in heaven rejoicing when a soul is saved except God?....  belive me, this form of worship, I have long resised, being by nature a wall flower... but God is the author of dance, of movement,..


...  and think of this too, perhaps a play on words, but it may have some utility... the Shepherd, ... Him who guides us with guidance    gui   dance      guy  dance...   and good guidence causes one to rejoice.. to "move with pleasure"   ergo   to dance...  David danced...  and I remember being touched by Jesus, and I danced....  truly danced for the first time in my existance... soo..  I wonder if we all ain't missin out on something by not dancing, even by faith in worship...

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 23, 2010 - 5:43PM #4
Kodiacman
Posts: 2,541

Mar 22, 2010 -- 7:22PM, Leight wrote:


...yesterday, I got with the dancing in Church... it really adds a new dimension... dancing with God..





Leight,


I am of the persuasion that we can be expressive in how we worship God. From what I can determine in the Bible is that worship is to be orderly and we are to be respectful of the other members of the body. I do not have an issue with a shout or dancing, or any other means of expressive worship. I read where David danced before the Lord and many passages indicate praising God with a loud voice.


I love the freedom to worship expressively. I do feel a great need to make sure I am not distracting from worship of God, and to be orderly but otherwise I would say "Go for it!" I am to be lead my the Spirit and not by my emotions or feelings or the desire to be noticed.


Expressive worship may not be for everybody and my post contains many of my own opinions that support it but they are just how I interpret the Bible and not intended to be dogmatic. Hopefully this does not offend you and if I have I am sorry.


blessings


mark


 

If someone wants to doubt the existence of Jesus, my experience is that no evidence or argument will change his mind. Such is the nature of skepticism.~Editor fourth R
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 23, 2010 - 8:34PM #5
Leight
Posts: 1,438

...we do not dance because the child in us has been chained by someone(s) or somethings, light is free, and who the Son sets free is free indeed...

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 23, 2010 - 11:01PM #6
sincerly
Posts: 4,049

Mar 23, 2010 -- 8:34PM, Leight wrote:


...we do not dance because the child in us has been chained by someone(s) or somethings, light is free, and who the Son sets free is free indeed...





Mark your post expresses what I see in the Scriptures.


Leight, The "light" of the Scriptures doesn't set one free to not do things decently and in order.  As Mark expressed, and you just posted, there is a "setting forth of emotionalism" which is contrary to these scriptures.


Matt. 18:4, "Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven."


Isa.57:15, "For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name [is] Holy; I dwell in the high and holy [place], with him also [that is] of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones."


1Peter 5:5, "Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all [of you] be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble." 


Yes,  there are times and places for giving praise and dancing before he LORD. Does one have to be seen of men??  This is the same principle as the Pharisee praying on the street corner.

Peace,   Sincerly.      As long as sin is practiced, one will search for a means to validate the continuing therein. ANON

The greatest want of the world is the want of men--men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.---- ANON  (Ellen G. White. 1882)
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 24, 2010 - 4:37PM #7
Anesis
Posts: 1,543

When we look at dancing as a form of worship, we need to look at biblical contexts and see when it is and is not appropriate.


The only time it is appropriate is as a form of worship, but when we look at biblical examples of worshipful dancing, we see it is not in services or in the temple. Miriam danced over God's power at the Red Sea, and David danced to celebrate the return of the Ark to Jerusalem.


Biblical references include Psalm 149:3 and 150:4, which suggest we can worship God through dance, and 1 Cor. 6:19-20 suggests that everything we do with our body must be honouring to him. Take that into context of orderly worship, and avoiding all kinds of evil, including the appearance of evil, and you likely have a liberty to dance before God in worship, but generally at a time of special acknowlegement and worship for what he does, and it is likely more personal than one would do in a church service.


The other thing to consider is the flip side. There are appropriate ways and times to dance, but there are inappropriate ones, too, such as dancing to bring attention to yourself or to your body to avoid temptations, out of control dancing like the Israelites when Moses was on the mountain, or when dancing might cause another to sin. The best rule of thumb, imo, is that if it looks like it might be sinful or lead someone to sin or be turned off to faith, then it is not glorifying to God.


If we can dance in a way that brings glory to God, does not tempt self or others, and is for the right motive, then it is appropriate....imo.


 


Sincerely, I wonder - sometimes we do have an overwhelming emotional response. Is it wrong to express that? The day my son was saved was a very emotional time for me and I wanted to dance and shout praise, but the church we were in was quiet and stifled....is it so wrong to express our emotional response to something the Lord has done?

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 24, 2010 - 7:03PM #8
Kodiacman
Posts: 2,541

Mar 24, 2010 -- 4:37PM, Anesis wrote:


If we can dance in a way that brings glory to God, does not tempt self or others, and is for the right motive, then it is appropriate....imo.


 Sincerely, I wonder - sometimes we do have an overwhelming emotional response. Is it wrong to express that? The day my son was saved was a very emotional time for me and I wanted to dance and shout praise, but the church we were in was quiet and stifled....is it so wrong to express our emotional response to something the Lord has done?





Anesis,


I absolutely love the tenderness that just oozes from your posts...It is a pleasure to read them. I would like to add an second thought to this if I may, it struck me as I read your post. I find that a good "methodology" is when I sense a desire to shout, jump or dance is this 'test.' The test is this: Can I still worship God and let the joyous praise eminate from my heart as I am quieter and more demure without the need for having to express it in such an expressive manner that may draw attention to myself? In this test I say no to the desire the first time I sense it as I need to verify from whence the desire came. If I find that I as I am still worship traditionally and the desire or sense comes back I usually will then act upon it provided I am in order, not distracting or drawing attention to myself, and doing it with a proper attitude. Do I have peace? Do I have an assurance from God (a greeen light)? If there are no's to these answers then these are flags to stop and check further before proceeding. For me it really comes down to hearing the Spirit and being lead by the Spirit. I do it for God and God alone.


I do tend to get emotionally charged up and so I want to ensure I am not following my emotions...but the Spirit. There are times I want to act and by testing the 'spirits' I find that I am sometimes pulled by emotions rather than the Spirit of God so I end up worshipping more traditionally. I should equally be able to worship traditionally as well as expressively, for where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom.


I have even been in service where I did boistrously shout an "Amen" in the service and I had some persons turn around and look at me. I did go and seek them out after service to make sure I was not distracting them and apologize to them if I had been a distraction; to a person they were all encouraging and they did not feel it detracted but added to the service. I do think they were as surprised as I was!! In other words the Spirit confirmed in them what He had already confirmed in me by giving me a 'green light'. I am a firm beleiver that if Spirit is encouraging me He will confirm that desire through others in my fellowship, particulary the leadership as they are the overseers of the flock and are there to protect all the sheep.


I wholeheartedly agree that this means of worship is a heart issue that is reflected in my attitude towards God and my fellow saints.


this went longer than I had anticipated and so I will stop here. thanks for patience..


blessings all


mark

If someone wants to doubt the existence of Jesus, my experience is that no evidence or argument will change his mind. Such is the nature of skepticism.~Editor fourth R
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 24, 2010 - 9:10PM #9
sincerly
Posts: 4,049

Mar 24, 2010 -- 4:37PM, Anesis wrote:

 Sincerely, I wonder - sometimes we do have an overwhelming emotional response. Is it wrong to express that? The day my son was saved was a very emotional time for me and I wanted to dance and shout praise, but the church we were in was quiet and stifled....is it so wrong to express our emotional response to something the Lord has done? 



Hi Anesis, When I looked up Dancing/danced in the commentary, I found emotion associated with it---sometimes. "leaping for Joy" or "twirling around"(Assoc. with David's).    Like you I didn't find it associated with Worship in a service.  A Random hearty AMEN isn't very disruptive. But it could be if there were more "amens" than sentences in the sermon. The Same with "Shouts of Praise."IMHO, "Decently and in Order" was admonished by Paul for a good reason.
Paul was saying the Prophesying and tongues/with interpreters was for the edification of the Church. Personally, Dancing in church would edify no one, but, the individual,----unless it is a dancing tongue in the telling of the gratifying experience.

Peace,   Sincerly.      As long as sin is practiced, one will search for a means to validate the continuing therein. ANON

The greatest want of the world is the want of men--men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.---- ANON  (Ellen G. White. 1882)
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 25, 2010 - 1:57AM #10
Anesis
Posts: 1,543

I had to really consider the idea of edification because it seems to me that edification has to do with encouragement and building up of the Body. And the absence of edification does not necessarily mean tearing it down.


How Mark and Sincerely put it seems to reflect what my theological dictionary says about edification. It says, "Self edification by tongue-speaking is not enough. It is not directed to the community as prophecy is. Prophecy builds up both by strengthening believers and winning unbelievers, although this, too, must be understood in terms of Christ, the Spirit, and faith."


This suggests to me that when we are alone or not participating in orderly worship, how we express our love for God is betwee us and him. But when we are in a service or fellowship, we need to focus on edification, and that means building up by both strengthening believers and winning any unbelievers who may be present. Using Mark's "methodology" we can ask "is dancing as a form of worship in church going to strengthen believers and win unbelievers?" If you can answer yes, then dance away. If there is any hesitation, then it is better not to.


Yes, we should be free in our worship, but imo, we need to be careful about context. We also need to be aware of the fruit of the Spirit having one segment called self control. Still, just because I'm not inclined to, doesn't mean it is necessarily "sin" either. imo.

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