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Switch to Forum Live View why is Matthew 17:21 omitted from NIV Bible?
3 years ago  ::  Oct 21, 2011 - 9:34PM #1
Butterflyblack
Posts: 1
I'm reading chapter 17 in Matthew and I see that verse 21 is missing, can someone explain why? Thanks
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3 years ago  ::  Oct 22, 2011 - 2:46AM #2
Namchuck
Posts: 10,821

Oct 21, 2011 -- 9:34PM, Butterflyblack wrote:

I'm reading chapter 17 in Matthew and I see that verse 21 is missing, can someone explain why? Thanks



Verse twenty one of Matthew seventeen is not found in many Bible's, Butterflyblack.


This is because verse 17 is not found in any of the better and older manuscripts of the Gospel of Matthew.

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3 years ago  ::  Oct 22, 2011 - 11:06AM #3
world citizen
Posts: 5,230

Oct 22, 2011 -- 2:46AM, Namchuck wrote:

Oct 21, 2011 -- 9:34PM, Butterflyblack wrote:

I'm reading chapter 17 in Matthew and I see that verse 21 is missing, can someone explain why? Thanks



Verse twenty one of Matthew seventeen is not found in many Bible's, Butterflyblack.


This is because verse 17 is not found in any of the better and older manuscripts of the Gospel of Matthew.


What might be some of the "better and older manuscripts"?  In my "Precise Parallel New Testament" (Oxford University Press), it shows Matthew 17:21 in the Greek New Testament, Amplified Bible, Rheims New Testament, KJV, and New American Standard Bible.  A blurb at the bottom states: "... this is a variant of the better reading of Mk 9:29."


Where this same comment appears in Mark 9:29 (9:28 in the Rheims), some of the versions have included and some omitted the ending words "... and fasting."  This seems arbitrary.  How is one to know which is the correct wording spoken by Christ?  If "fasting" was possibly a specific enjoinment by Christ, should it not be taken more seriously as a means toward having prayers answered?  That was the thrust of Christ's message in both passages as found in Matthew and Mark.

Blessed is he who mingleth with all men in a spirit of utmost kindliness and love. ~Baha'u'llah
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3 years ago  ::  Oct 22, 2011 - 3:27PM #4
Namchuck
Posts: 10,821

Oct 22, 2011 -- 11:06AM, world citizen wrote:

Oct 22, 2011 -- 2:46AM, Namchuck wrote:


Oct 21, 2011 -- 9:34PM, Butterflyblack wrote:

I'm reading chapter 17 in Matthew and I see that verse 21 is missing, can someone explain why? Thanks



Verse twenty one of Matthew seventeen is not found in many Bible's, Butterflyblack.


This is because verse 17 is not found in any of the better and older manuscripts of the Gospel of Matthew.




What might be some of the "better and older manuscripts"?  In my "Precise Parallel New Testament" (Oxford University Press), it shows Matthew 17:21 in the Greek New Testament, Amplified Bible, Rheims New Testament, KJV, and New American Standard Bible.  A blurb at the bottom states: "... this is a variant of the better reading of Mk 9:29."


Where this same comment appears in Mark 9:29 (9:28 in the Rheims), some of the versions have included and some omitted the ending words "... and fasting."  This seems arbitrary.  How is one to know which is the correct wording spoken by Christ?  If "fasting" was possibly a specific enjoinment by Christ, should it not be taken more seriously as a means toward having prayers answered?  That was the thrust of Christ's message in both passages as found in Matthew and Mark.




 


Tischendorf, who was certainly by far the greatest textual scholar of the 19th century, considered Matthew 17:21 authentic until he discovered the famous Sinaiticus. 


"How is one to know which is the correct wording spoken by Christ?"


Or, for that matter, if he even existed to say anything at all.

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3 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2011 - 12:01PM #5
JRT
Posts: 338

There are other problematic verses as well.


 


If you have been paying attention to more recent translations of the Gospel of John, you will have noticed that John 7:53–8:11—the story of the woman caught in adultery of whom Jesus says, “Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her”—has been getting some interesting treatment by the scholars. The evidence that it was not an original part of this gospel is clear. The verses are absent from a wide array of early and diverse witnesses (papyrus 66, papyrus 75, Aleph [Codex Sinaiticus], B [Codex Vaticanus] and a host of others), and there is evidence that some manuscripts of John place these verses after John 7:36, some after John 7:52, some after John 21:25, and one manuscript even has it in the Gospel of Luke after Luke 21:38.

the floggings will continue until morale improves
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2 years ago  ::  Oct 28, 2011 - 10:23AM #6
world citizen
Posts: 5,230

Namchuck,


Or, for that matter, if he even existed to say anything at all.


A subject better suited for one of the Jesus discussion boards and inappropriate for the Bible forum.


World Citizen, moderator

Blessed is he who mingleth with all men in a spirit of utmost kindliness and love. ~Baha'u'llah
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