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In a speech to the Episcopal Communicators' annual convention last week in Salem, Mass. The Hon. Byron Rushing, who has been reelected to the Massachusetts State Legislature two or three dozen times, and to the Diocese of Massachusetts Deputation to the General Convention of the Episcopal Church at least as often said that churches, like towns and cities, states and nations, are inescapably political organizations, and that churches get into trouble when they pretend otherwise.
| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 4:41PM #1 | |
RJMcElwain
Posts: 2,687
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Here's something most of us have always known, but it's still worth keeping in mind. And the politics go all the way back to the first century, as various constituencies vied to shape the Church.
Churches are political institutions, and that's a good thing
Robert J. McElwain
"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." (Supposedly)Thomas Jefferson "He who is not angry when there is just cause for anger is immoral." St. Thomas Aquinas One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors. Plato |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 5:05PM #2 | |
teilhard
Posts: 43,033
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Churches -- as all Religious Faith Organizations -- are SOCIAL Organizations ... and as such, they are by default also "Political" ... |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 5:13PM #3 | |
Kodiacman
Posts: 2,395
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I do agree that with you here. We cannot as religious institutions ignore the fact that we are as concerned, or in some cases, more concerned for what happens in our societies as the political institutions are. This concern does give the church value in the public sector and influence as they endeavor to deal with the same issues, but perhaps from different perspectives. One coming from a more moralistic basis that is founded from thier faith as compared to one that might simply be motivated by political expediency sans any moral considerations. A view that divides the church and the political organizations is IMO a failure to see how similar both institutions are. blessings mark
If someone wants to doubt the existence of Jesus, my experience is that no evidence or argument will change his mind. Such is the nature of skepticism.~Editor fourth R
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 6:43PM #4 | |
Blü
Posts: 21,551
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If we accept that, then it's time to register the churches as either political parties or taxable trading companies, as appropriate. Obviously they have no claim any special status.
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 7:13PM #5 | |
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teilhard
Posts: 43,033
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All Charitable Organizations, Youth Sports Leagues, Public Libraries, Veggies and Free AngleWorms Harvested from The Family Garden, and SunLight Impinging on RoofTop Solar Panels -- let's TAX them all ... !!! |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 7:33PM #6 | |
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Blü
Posts: 21,551
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teilhard let's TAX them all ... !!! If you accept the premise of this thread, you either register them as political parties or as trading enterprises. If they trade, why shouldn't they pay tax? |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 7:35PM #7 | |
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teilhard
Posts: 43,033
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And Public Libraries, Charities, etc., all "trade" ...So ... |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 7:43PM #8 | |
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Blü
Posts: 21,551
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teilhard You keep forgetting to read the conditional premise in the OP. |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 8:30PM #9 | |
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RJMcElwain
Posts: 2,687
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The premise is a good explanation as to how the Church and it's Scriptures got us to where we are today. Politics shaped first century oral tradition. Politics shaped the writing of these oral traditions. And politics shaped the redaction/editing of these Scriptures during the 2nd, 3rd and later centuries of Church evolution. Politics shapes how the RCC deals with sexual scandal. Politics shapes how the Orthodox Churches of Russia dealt with the Soviet Union. Politics shapes how people like Pat Robertson call Katrina a just reward.
Robert J. McElwain
"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." (Supposedly)Thomas Jefferson "He who is not angry when there is just cause for anger is immoral." St. Thomas Aquinas One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors. Plato |
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| 3 years ago :: Mar 24, 2010 - 8:39PM #10 | |
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Kodiacman
Posts: 2,395
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I am perplexed, although I am easily amused but that is besides the point, the premise of this thread does not assert what you are asserting. Would you care to walk me through your reasoning as I have seem to lost my way? blessings mark
If someone wants to doubt the existence of Jesus, my experience is that no evidence or argument will change his mind. Such is the nature of skepticism.~Editor fourth R
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