We are wandering...searching for divine guidance

BIRK

Posts: 1,912

Identify your desire, and let every step of your journey be in the direction to the fulfillment of that desire.

Watch for it, as it seems to manifest,from nothingness, into beingness.

Repeat as often as necessary until mastered..

BIRK

Posts: 1,912

This duality thing rocks, once you get a handle on how this game is played.

stardustpilgrim

Posts: 5,135

Aug 12, 2011 -- 9:11AM, BIRK wrote:

Identify your desire, and let every step of your journey be in the direction to the fulfillment of that desire.

Watch for it, as it seems to manifest,from nothingness, into beingness.

Repeat as often as necessary until mastered..

True. But, then you have to ask what the origin of your desires are. Do they come from your essential nature, or from culturally formed self?

sdp

The purpose of words is to convey ideas. When the ideas are grasped, the words are forgotten.
Where can I find a man who has forgotten words? He is the one I would like to talk to.
The Way of Chuang Tzu by Thomas Merton

A map is not the territory. Alfred Korzybski

When supposedly skeptical atheists and scientists pick on monotheistic religion in books, speeches and debates, they are simply beating up a court jester in a clown crown. They think that by clobbering the clown of religion, they have overthrown the kingdom of transphysical reality, but such arguments cannot sway anyone established in the integrated, co-creative state, which is the serious reality underlying the circus of religion.
Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything: The Enlightened Perspective, 57%

BIRK

Posts: 1,912

Why does it matter if it is an ego generated desire or one based from a perception of unconditional love?

What is there. that we must guard against?

stardustpilgrim

Posts: 5,135

Aug 13, 2011 -- 6:50AM, BIRK wrote:

Why does it matter if it is an ego generated desire or one based from a perception of unconditional love?

What is there. that we must guard against?

Wayne Dryer tells the story of the little boy walking on a beach where there were thousands of starfish washed up on shore. The little boy was picking them up one at a time and throwing them back into the sea.

A passerby told him that what he was doing was meaningless, that he could never throw them all back into the sea before they died.

The little boy picked up another and throwing it into the sea, said: It matters to T-H-A-T one...

If you don't know the difference between an ego generated desire and a desire based upon unconditional love, you are not a mystic, know nothing about mysticism..........

Ego cannot 'walk through the door'. Ego cannot exist, 'on the other side'.

For ordinary life, it doesn't matter. That's the whole point.

sdp

The purpose of words is to convey ideas. When the ideas are grasped, the words are forgotten.
Where can I find a man who has forgotten words? He is the one I would like to talk to.
The Way of Chuang Tzu by Thomas Merton

A map is not the territory. Alfred Korzybski

When supposedly skeptical atheists and scientists pick on monotheistic religion in books, speeches and debates, they are simply beating up a court jester in a clown crown. They think that by clobbering the clown of religion, they have overthrown the kingdom of transphysical reality, but such arguments cannot sway anyone established in the integrated, co-creative state, which is the serious reality underlying the circus of religion.
Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything: The Enlightened Perspective, 57%

Seefan

Posts: 2,767

Aug 13, 2011 -- 9:52AM, stardustpilgrim wrote:
If you don't know the difference between an ego generated desire and a desire based upon unconditional love, you are not a mystic, know nothing about mysticism..........

Ego cannot 'walk through the door'. Ego cannot exist, 'on the other side'.

For ordinary life, it doesn't matter. That's the whole point.

sdp

I agree and have know that for some time. And I'm not a mystic ...

So what is your understanding of what makes a mystic?

The sciences of this world are droplets of reality; if then they lead not to reality, what fruit can come of illusion? By the one true God! If learning be not a means of access to Him, the Most Manifest, it is nothing but evident loss. (Baha'i Faith) As to life's problems Einstein said it well - we can't solve a problem using the same consciousness that created it ...

BIRK

Posts: 1,912

No. The point is that it really doesn't matter where the desire originates from.

You can only create your own physical life experience.

Good ,bad or otherwwise, every lesson has value.

Evenually everyone awakens from the illusion of an absense of Love which is what fuels the ego into making you believe that your life is the product of someone elses evil plan.

Labels in effect can be our own worst enemy. Everyone has their own perpective, so just because mine is different from yours doesn't make either of us wrong.

Knowing the difference between truth and illusion constitutes a Mystic by my awareness but of all the connected people I interact with, none have ever choosen that title to describe themselves.

I am a Healer of me, and nothing more.

stardustpilgrim

Posts: 5,135

Aug 14, 2011 -- 7:17AM, BIRK wrote:

No. The point is that it really doesn't matter where the desire originates from.

  You can only create your own physical life experience.

Good ,bad or otherwwise, every lesson has value.

   Evenually everyone awakens from the illusion of an absense of Love which is what fuels the ego into making you believe that your life is the product of someone elses evil plan.

   Labels in effect can be our own worst enemy. Everyone has their own perpective, so just because mine is different from yours doesn't make either of us wrong.

  Knowing the difference between truth and illusion constitutes a Mystic by my awareness but of all the connected people I interact with, none have ever choosen that title to describe themselves.

   I am a Healer of me, and nothing more.

Your post inevitably leads us to ask what constitutes self? You say it doesn't matter where desires originate from. I say it matters. If desires originate from within, that's one thing (good). But desires can originate from outside of us (most do). These can be anything, desire for things, money, power, fame, houses, cars, etc., all useless.

You say that everyone eventually awakens. How can you possibly make this claim? If our desires originate from outside, and these desires are fulfilled, that's the end of the journey. There is no reason for movement upward or inward. No awakening.

With wrong desires fulfilled, there is no reason to to turn from illusion to truth, we're quite happy with illusion.

If we have a false sense of self, then what constitutes that self becomes the source of its goals and aims. This is a form of addiction. If we get our "fix", we are content.

So the real question is, on what basis do we judge reality from illusion? Or better yet, why should we choose, why should we care?

I think your post gets us nowhere.

sdp

The purpose of words is to convey ideas. When the ideas are grasped, the words are forgotten.
Where can I find a man who has forgotten words? He is the one I would like to talk to.
The Way of Chuang Tzu by Thomas Merton

A map is not the territory. Alfred Korzybski

When supposedly skeptical atheists and scientists pick on monotheistic religion in books, speeches and debates, they are simply beating up a court jester in a clown crown. They think that by clobbering the clown of religion, they have overthrown the kingdom of transphysical reality, but such arguments cannot sway anyone established in the integrated, co-creative state, which is the serious reality underlying the circus of religion.
Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything: The Enlightened Perspective, 57%

BIRK

Posts: 1,912

By my perception, We are not our thoughts or what we create. So ...

What are we guarding against?

Namchuck

Posts: 9,457

Aug 14, 2011 -- 8:28PM, BIRK wrote:

By my perception, We are not our thoughts or what we create. So ...

What are we guarding against?

Then your perception is wrong. We are our thoughts and our thoughts are us. I would like to know how you would go about separating the thinker from the thought?

And there is no point in throwing the kind of non-question ("What are we guarding against?) that you like to throw out to mask the fact that you don't know what you're talking about.

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