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2 years ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 12:21AM #1
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 12,189

This is from post #1486 of a discussion on the World News forum. As the speaker (historian Humphrey McQueen) mentioned conspiracy theories, readers on this forum might be interested.

Last Wednesday in Canberra, Australia, I attended a forum. It was titled "Don't Shoot the Messenger: WikiLeaks, Assange and Democracy in Australia. Below I transcribe part of an address on the Part 1 video of this event.


After their meeting in Sydney, he was at a farewell party. And he was introduced to a senior Australian Labor Party (ALP) official. And the latter had asked what he'd been doing. So Humphrey promoted Julian. And he mentioned the Sydney meeting. The official denounced the people as conspiracy theorists! Humphrey retorted about a businessmen price-fixing. No, the ALP left doesn't think that's a conspiracy. The official turned away to find someone more congenial.


But tonight, Humphrey will talk about conspiracies. Yes, there are conspiracies. He will examine the terms "conspiracy" and "conspiracy theory". These relate to WikiLeaks, because there are many dots to connect. And so explain what goes on in the world. At his previous two meetings with Christine Assange, there were Congolese refugees. One of their leaders, who had been a mining engineer, was granted refugee status in Australia. He and his fellow Congolese enthusiastically supported WikiLeaks and Julian. That's because they've got more information about why twelve million Congolese have been murdered in the 50 years since their independence. And why their first Prime Minister, Patrice Lumumba was murdered. There is that side to the connection between WikiLeaks and conspiracy.


And then there is the conspiracy between the Australian, Swedish and US governments.


The ignorant and cynical will bleat "That's just a conspiracy theory."! No, that's a conspiracy fact. What are conspiracy facts? He won't bother discussing a conspiracy of the Knights Templar.


The audience laughs.


Such a grand conspiracy, destroys the credibility of documented conspiracies. He will give examples of those. There is an attack on the idea that information can be collated and explained. That is the "This is just a conspiracy theory." attack. It is also an attack on historical memory. 

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 6:23AM #2
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 12,189

This is from post #s1488 and 1490, in a discussion on World News. As the speaker was on about conspiracy, I thought that might also interest people here.


I continue to transcribe historian Humphrey McQueen's talk from last Wednesday's forum.


When politicians have been caught with their hand in the till or lying, they say "That's ancient history; that happened yesterday; we're moving on; I'm putting that behind me."! This is the political no-blame game. No-one's responsible for anything, because it all happened yesterday! So all our politicians have become born-again liars.


The audience laughs.


No-one's going to ask "Who did it?". Because if you do ask that, it proves that you're a conspiracy theorist!


The word means "to breathe (or whisper) together". It's simply that. But in practice, there's how they use it--and how we use it. They will use it for any activity that's aimed at them! And they have laws to prove that if you try to attack them or take power away from them, then you are conspiring. They want us to believe that they don't conspire. Rather, they perform normal government and law-and-order.


When business people conspire--they're just employing masters of business administration to do organisation and methods--in price-fixing and collusive tendering!


Do you believe in conspiracies? How did you get here? Did you wake up with the thought that it would be a good idea to have a protest meeting tonight about WikiLeaks? And you turned up here at 7 o'clock, on the off-chance that such a meeting might take place. Did it come to you in a dream, that you should be here? For this to happen, people had to send out messages, put up posters, and organise the meeting place. And that amount of organisation is needed for this.


So what must the US government do daily, to try to run the world?


The audience laughs.


They're not whispering--they're sending round cyclones! That's what they have to do to get their views out. Did all those financial companies spontaneously decide to cut off WikiLeaks? That's as likely as the news that they should do that, being delivered to them by an angel!


Conspiracy law has been around for six hundred years. The police find it useful. If they arrest you for being a petty thief--they'll also throw in "and conspiring to be a petty thief"! And if they particularly don't like you, they'll also throw in "resisting arrest". And if they have a real set on you, they might add a charge of "conspiring to resist arrest"!


Bradley Manning is going to be charged with "conspiring with person or persons unknown". Will one of these "known unknowns", be Julian Assange?

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 7:52AM #3
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 12,189

In case conspiracy enthusiasts here might be interested, I continue to post here from a talk by historian Humphrey McQueen. The last paragraph, I thought reminiscent of the recent "legal coup" in Paraguay!


Adam Smith added that the rich combined, to preserve for themselves, the inequality of goods. So governments are by nature, conspiracies, of the rich, against the poor!


The Tolpuddle Martyrs were an example of that. In 1834, six agricultural labourers in Dorchester, were charged--not with forming a trade union, which they'd done; not with taking an oath; but with taking an oath to conceal the fact that they'd formed an organisation to take an oath! They were convicted of conspiring. Then unions were legal in England. Like today, you can form a union, and it's legal--if you don't do anything!


The audience laughs.


So then they were transported to Australia. In that case, the lawyers concocted a way of convicting these people--when they should never have been convicted! And that's what's going to happen in all these cases. Doc Evatt wrote a book about it, titled "Injustice Within the Law". That was his account of what happened.


There was a conspiracy to change the Prime Minister of Australia. In 1931, Joe Lyons moved from the Labor Party, to lead the anti-labour party. A group of six people in Melbourne, got together to change the leadership of the conservative party, and bring across a Labor leader, to take charge of the government during the depression.

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 04, 2012 - 11:27PM #4
Hatman
Posts: 9,634
To me, there are really only two possibilities in re: human history:  Things happen by accident, or they happen on purpose.

i am firmly convinced that most of human history happens on purpose.

Anytime any two or more people plan for something to happen to someone (or a group of someones) else, in secret, without their knowledge or consent, this is a conspiracy.
Every war---heck, every battle---is therefore a conspiracy.

But the PTB have a vested interest in discounting conspiracies or a conspiracy theory of history, to wit:

"It is also important for the State to inculcate in its subjects an aversion to any outcropping of what is now called 'a conspiracy theory of history.' For a search for 'conspiracies,' as misguided as the results often are, means a search for motives, and an attribution of individual responsibility for the historical misdeeds of ruling elites. If, however, any tyranny or venality, or aggressive war imposed by the State was brought about not by particular State rulers but by mysterious and arcane 'social forces,' or by the imperfect state of the world -- or if, in some way, everyone was guilty -- then there is no point in anyone's becoming indignant or rising up against such misdeeds. Furthermore, a discrediting of 'conspiracy theories' will make the subjects more likely to believe the 'general welfare' reasons that are invariably put forth by the modern State for engaging in aggressive actions."
-- Murray N. Rothbard(1926-1995) Dean of the Austrian School of Economics
Source: For a New Liberty (New York: Macmillan, 1973), p. 6

"The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweighed the dangers which are cited to justify it...
...there is very grave danger that an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment...
...For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy that relies primarily on covert means for expanding its sphere of influence--on infiltration instead of invasion, on subversion instead of elections, on intimidation instead of free choice, on guerrillas by night instead of armies by day. It is a system which has conscripted vast human and material resources into the building of a tightly knit, highly efficient machine that combines military, diplomatic, intelligence, economic, scientific and political operations.
Its preparations are concealed, not published. Its mistakes are buried, not headlined. Its dissenters are silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed. It conducts the Cold War, in short, with a war-time discipline no democracy would ever hope or wish to match."
~John F. Kennedy

...and, of course, a conspiracy killed his ass, and his brother, and MLK, and the list goes on and on and on.

More power to those who expose the lies, pull back the covers over the cover-up, and shine light on the cockaroaches who destroy Liberty every chance they get.

With goodwill to all the People(save oathbreaking scum)-

Hatman
"History records that the moneychangers have used every form of abuse, deceit, intrigue, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and it's issuance."
-- James Madison(1751-1836), Father of the Constitution for the USA, 4th US President
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2 years ago  ::  Jul 24, 2012 - 6:40AM #5
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 12,189

Hatman:


I find your testament self-contradictory. For you denounce secrecy--and then those who expose it! Perhaps in your world view, everyone is to be condemned? 

Moderated by Jcarlinbn on Aug 12, 2012 - 10:45AM
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2 years ago  ::  Jul 24, 2012 - 3:05PM #6
Hatman
Posts: 9,634

Jul 24, 2012 -- 6:40AM, Karma_yeshe_dorje wrote:


Hatman:


I find your testament self-contradictory.


Be specific.

For you denounce secrecy--and then those who expose it!


A ridiculous assertion; please specify from whence you draw or upon what you base such an erroneous conclusion.

Perhaps in your world view, everyone is to be condemned?


More ridiculosity.


More ridiculosity.

 With goodwill to all the People(except greedy, useless, lying, oathbreaking scum)- Hatman

Moderated by Jcarlinbn on Aug 12, 2012 - 10:44AM
"History records that the moneychangers have used every form of abuse, deceit, intrigue, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and it's issuance."
-- James Madison(1751-1836), Father of the Constitution for the USA, 4th US President
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 12, 2012 - 9:23AM #7
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 12,189

WikiLeaks reveals Trapwire, a US government spy network that uses ordinary surveillance cameras.

So: those spooky new "circular" dark globe cameras installed in your neighborhood park, town, or city-they aren't just passively monitoring. They're plugged into Trapwire and they are potentially monitoring every single person via facial recognition.


Currently it's pretty hard to reach Wikileaks to read the papers yourself, because the site has been crushed under an onslaught of DDOS attacks — which, how convenient is that, conspiracy theorists?


io9.com/5933966/wikileaks-reveals-trapwi...

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2 years ago  ::  Nov 11, 2012 - 3:20AM #8
Aka_me
Posts: 11,894

people disliking wikileaks...


love, absolutely LOVE being fed nitrates by the chronically habitually lying government. and have no clue how bad the government has been lying to them for several generations.


because if they DIDN'T love gorging on the government manure they would realize there is no alternative to making the lies stop.

internet troll... anyone who won't stop posting about bad spelling.
the government KILLS and EXPERIMENTS and TORTURES people, without ever apologizing, being held accountable or punished. and you expect me to believe they've automagically grown a conscience to not continue? like bloody hades they have.
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