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Switch to Forum Live View Palestinians Champion Jesus’ Birthplace to Boost Statehood Bid
2 years ago  ::  Jun 21, 2012 - 2:56PM #1
BDboy
Posts: 5,789

Palestinians are turning to non-violent ways to make their points to the world. Check out the article in TIME magazine.


Palestinians Champion Jesus’ Birthplace to Boost Statehood Bid


Read more: world.time.com/2012/06/21/palestinians-c...


A bid to have Bethlehem's Church of the Nativity declared a World Heritage site by Unesco may not be driven simply by cultural concerns
By VIVIENNE WALT | @vivwalt | June 21, 2012 |


Exactly 10 years ago, Palestinian gunmen barricaded themselves inside the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem and waged a five-week battle with the surrounding Israeli tanks and soldiers. Now, the site widely held to be the birthplace of Jesus has become the center of a new political battle, this one pitting Palestinians against the guardians of the church, among others.


At issue is the Palestinian effort to have the ancient Basilica declared a World Heritage site by the U.N.’s cultural agency,Unesco, into which “Palestine” was voted as a full member state last October. The World Heritage designation might sound harmless enough, given that it spans more than 900 culturally significant sites ranging from the Grand Canyon to Moscow’s Red Square, and that its purpose is to preserve unique natural and man-made treasures. And the resultant cachet often boosts local economies by attracting tourists, although veneration of the Church of Nativity in Christianity already does that.


“There is intense government interest in the [designation] process every year,” says a Western diplomat at Unesco. “This is a big deal.”


-- edited for formatting by Chari --

Moderated by CharikIeia on Jun 21, 2012 - 07:12PM
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 21, 2012 - 3:17PM #2
browbeaten
Posts: 3,193

Jun 21, 2012 -- 2:56PM, BDboy wrote:


Palestinians are turning to non-violent ways to make their points to the world. Check out the article in TIME magazine.


Palestinians Champion Jesus’ Birthplace to Boost Statehood Bid


Read more: world.time.com/2012/06/21/palestinians-c...


A bid to have Bethlehem's Church of the Nativity declared a World Heritage site by Unesco may not be driven simply by cultural concerns
By VIVIENNE WALT | @vivwalt | June 21, 2012 |


Exactly 10 years ago, Palestinian gunmen barricaded themselves inside the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem and waged a five-week battle with the surrounding Israeli tanks and soldiers. Now, the site widely held to be the birthplace of Jesus has become the center of a new political battle, this one pitting Palestinians against the guardians of the church, among others.


At issue is the Palestinian effort to have the ancient Basilica declared a World Heritage site by the U.N.’s cultural agency,Unesco, into which “Palestine” was voted as a full member state last October. The World Heritage designation might sound harmless enough, given that it spans more than 900 culturally significant sites ranging from the Grand Canyon to Moscow’s Red Square, and that its purpose is to preserve unique natural and man-made treasures. And the resultant cachet often boosts local economies by attracting tourists, although veneration of the Church of Nativity in Christianity already does that.


“There is intense government interest in the [designation] process every year,” says a Western diplomat at Unesco. “This is a big deal.”


-- edited for formatting by Chari --



No organization can claim anything to landmark that does'nt not belong to them.  The corrupt Unesco has no authority to declare anything.  Saying so, doesn't make it so.  It's just so idiotic.

Moderated by CharikIeia on Jun 21, 2012 - 07:13PM
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 21, 2012 - 6:16PM #3
KindredSai
Posts: 5,740

No organization can but a State can by heart.


The birthplace of Jesus is not Jewish, Christian or Muslim but Palestinian.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 21, 2012 - 6:59PM #4
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,147

KS


Jesus was born in Bethlehem in JUDEA which was a Jewish Kingdom. Jesus was a Jewish boy born of a Jewish mother and a Jewish father. He lived his entire life as a Jew. He preached only to Jews. During the entire life of Jesus the area in which he was born, in which he lived, and in which he died was known as JUDEA and was a Jewish Kingdom which, at the time, was a vassal state of the Roman Empire.


Now, where was Jesus from again?  

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 6:00PM #5
BDboy
Posts: 5,789

Jun 21, 2012 -- 6:59PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:


KS


Jesus was born in Bethlehem in JUDEA which was a Jewish Kingdom. Jesus was a Jewish boy born of a Jewish mother and a Jewish father. He lived his entire life as a Jew. He preached only to Jews. During the entire life of Jesus the area in which he was born, in which he lived, and in which he died was known as JUDEA and was a Jewish Kingdom which, at the time, was a vassal state of the Roman Empire.


Now, where was Jesus from again?  




>>>>>>>>> It is also true Jesus son of Mary was rejected by most Jews of his time. It is also true that the time you are talking about is over two thousand years ago!!


Since then most Jews converted to different faiths and most Jews LEFT the Biblical Israel. It is ALSO true that, non-Jews ruled and protected birthplace of Jesus since Jews left beit-laham. It is ALSO true that, followers of Jesus are NOT Jews (Christians and Muslims).


Therefore, it is NOT important for the state of Israel to colonize the holy ground. Since it belongs to a person who was REJECTED (also strong alleligation by Christians of killing him) by Jews without any doubt.


I think it is silly to use excuse after excuse to gobble up more lands from native population who are not Jews. Israel needs to learn to restrict itself from becoming the New saddam hossain of the holy land. These are policies and attitudes commonly seen in brutal dictators not in democracies run by civilized people.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 7:08PM #6
KindredSai
Posts: 5,740

Jun 21, 2012 -- 6:59PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:


KS


Jesus was born in Bethlehem in JUDEA which was a Jewish Kingdom. Jesus was a Jewish boy born of a Jewish mother and a Jewish father. He lived his entire life as a Jew. He preached only to Jews. During the entire life of Jesus the area in which he was born, in which he lived, and in which he died was known as JUDEA and was a Jewish Kingdom which, at the time, was a vassal state of the Roman Empire.


Now, where was Jesus from again?  




This is only according to Judeo-Christian beliefs. This holds as much substance as you believing in Hindu or Shinto gods.


I'm neither a Jew or Christian, don't expect me to take your beliefs as gospel.


What I know now that his birthplace is currently in a State under occupation that is Palestine. Thus it would be not incorrect to say his birthplace is Palestinian.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 10:52PM #7
habesor
Posts: 5,721

Kindredsai,


Whether there is a State of Palestine or not is debatable. But for argument's sake let's say that there is. Bethlehem is a town where Jesus, according to Christian sources, was supposed to have been born. There is some debate about this but again for arguments sake, let's say that this is true as well. Let us finally agree, for the moment that Bethlehem is located in the territory of the Palestinian State. What has been argued is that all of the above leads one to conclude that Jesus was a Palestinian. That doesn't follow and in fact Jesus was a Judean who if you had met him and told him he was a Palestinian, not only would have disagreed with you but would have taken such a statement as an insult.


Habesor 

Habesor
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2012 - 10:56PM #8
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

Luckily, the Christian scriptures make it unequivocally clear that it is completely irrelevant who the historical Jesus was, the Jesus "according to the flesh". As mainstream Christians, we need not care, more even: we should not care - and can leave this dispute to others...

tl;dr
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2012 - 4:26AM #9
BDboy
Posts: 5,789

Jun 22, 2012 -- 10:52PM, habesor wrote:


Kindredsai,


Whether there is a State of Palestine or not is debatable. But for argument's sake let's say that there is. Bethlehem is a town where Jesus, according to Christian sources, was supposed to have been born. There is some debate about this but again for arguments sake, let's say that this is true as well. Let us finally agree, for the moment that Bethlehem is located in the territory of the Palestinian State. What has been argued is that all of the above leads one to conclude that Jesus was a Palestinian. That doesn't follow and in fact Jesus was a Judean who if you had met him and told him he was a Palestinian, not only would have disagreed with you but would have taken such a statement as an insult.


Habesor 




>>>>>>>> It is true Jesus son of Mary was born into "Bene Israel" or "Bani Israel".


Thousands of years ago, followers of Moses lived in Beit-laham back in those days. So it does not contradict a least bit saying Jesus was sent to the tribe of "Children of Israel". Bible clearly says that. During his lifetime, Jesus focus on "Educating" his tribe as per direction from our Maker.


People who lived in ancient Judea are known as Jews. Jew is not a name of any religion rather refers to people who once upon a time lived in a place call Judea (Bible, Qur'an and hisotry books supports that).


Our collective history ALSO says, Jesus was rejected by his own people (Except a few). There are narratives (In the Bible) claiming Jews also tried to kill him or caused his alledged "Death on cross".


Therefore, that city should not have any religious relations to Jews. ONLY to Christians and Muslims who follow Jesus as important part of their respected faiths.


Therefore both of you are corrent. Jesus was a pracrticing Jew but he was also stoned by Jews!!


Jews spent a lot of time expalining why they "Had to" reject Jesus ( I call it a misunderstanding). So no logical reason to occupy Beitlaham anymore.

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