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Switch to Forum Live View IDF documents Palestinian using human shield
2 years ago  ::  May 27, 2012 - 5:13PM #1
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,551

  

IDF documents Palestinian using human shield

Censored video shows terrorist use woman as human shield while planting explosives. Soldiers irked by 'censorship'; IDF says not all footage taken by military is published

Yoav Zitun

The IDF imposed an embargo on a video allegedly documenting a Palestinian terrorist using a Palestinian woman as a human shield, Ynet discovered Sunday.

 
Footage taken by IDF cameras in the area clearly shows the terrorist holding the woman hostage, carying her as a barrier between himself and IDF forces.
. . .
The footage shows the terrorists running toward a group of farmers. Then, one of them grabbed a woman and carried her until taking cover behind a building.  

 
Golani Brigade soldiers, who are currently deployed in the sector, and have had the opportunity to see the footage, said it was clear that the woman was forced to run with her assailant until he found cover.

 
"Why don't they give this video to the media? It should be shown to Goldstone," said one of the soldiers

 

The IDF spokesman's unit said in response that,  "The IDF uses the various means in its disposal to document its operational activities for purpose of debriefing, public diplomacy and possible criminal action.

 

"Nevertheless, for security reasons not all documented events are released for publication."

full article:
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-42346...

Moderated by Beliefnet_community on May 28, 2012 - 02:44AM
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:52AM #2
shmuelgoldstein
Posts: 2,479

The IDF is certainly one of the world's best and most efficient armies.


But I'll tell you one thing they don't do well: explain themselves.


"it won't be published because of security reasons"  !?


What kind of nonsense is that? It harms security more by NOT publishing it. And the shame of it all is that the IDF (and most Israelis) don't realize this.

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:59AM #3
Dostojevsky
Posts: 7,708

The man was counting on the idea that IDF would not shoot at the woman.


It makes sense to me.


Luckily for the woman it worked.

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 8:50AM #4
SherriMunnerlyn
Posts: 7,519

This story is hilarious, allegedly a Palestinian man uses another as a human shield, but we cannot see evidence of this, because the Israeli authorities are blocking it????


And I buy all of this, the same way I buy the idea there is gold at the end of a rainbow or a man in the moon or that the cow really did jump over the moon.


Someone show me a human rights group affirming the illegal use of human shields here, and I will believe it.


They keep writing reports, year in and year out, those human rights groups like Btselem and Amnesty, about Israel's use of Palestinian civilians as human shields, that often include children.


And I google Btselem human shields, and the first article I pull up, dated 2011, begins:


Human Shields







On 6 October 2005, Israel's High Court of Justice ruled that it was illegal for the army to use Palestinian civilians during military actions. The judgment was given on a petition that B'Tselem and six other human rights organizations filed in 2002. The petition followed the army's use of Palestinian civilians as human shields since the beginning of the second intifada, primarily during operations carried out in densely populated Palestinian areas, as occurred in Operation Defensive Shield.


The method was the same each time: soldiers picked a civilian at random and forced him to protect them with his body, and do dangerous tasks for them. For example, soldiers have ordered Palestinians to:

  • enter buildings to check if they are booby-trapped, or to remove the occupants;
  • remove suspicious objects from roads;
  • stand inside houses where soldiers set up military positions, so that Palestinians would not fire at them;
  • and walk in front of soldiers to shield them from gunfire, while the soldiers point a gun to their backs and sometimes fire over their shoulders.

The soldiers in the field did not initiate this practice; rather, the order to use civilians as a means of protection was made by senior army officials.


www.btselem.org/human_shields


Sherri






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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 9:00AM #5
SherriMunnerlyn
Posts: 7,519

May 31, 2012 -- 6:52AM, shmuelgoldstein wrote:


The IDF is certainly one of the world's best and most efficient armies.


But I'll tell you one thing they don't do well: explain themselves.


"it won't be published because of security reasons"  !?


What kind of nonsense is that? It harms security more by NOT publishing it. And the shame of it all is that the IDF (and most Israelis) don't realize this.




shmuelgoldstein,


I disagree with you, your statement the IDF does not explain themselves well.


I think their killing acts  explains the IDF very well, they are all about murdering Palestinians, ethnic cleansing, genocide, war crimes, violating the Fourth Geneva Cnvention and other intl human rights laws. 



Data by the date of event, 27.12.2008-18.1.2009
Occupied Territories
Israel
Gaza Strip West Bank Total

Palestinians killed by Israeli security forces
1390 7 1397 0

 


old.btselem.org/statistics/english/casua...


Sherri

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 9:29AM #6
browbeaten
Posts: 3,227

May 31, 2012 -- 6:59AM, Dostojevsky wrote:


The man was counting on the idea that IDF would not shoot at the woman.


It makes sense to me.


Luckily for the woman it worked.




No Sh$t Sherlock.  Guess you approve of his tactic, since it worked.

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 9:55AM #7
shmuelgoldstein
Posts: 2,479

May 31, 2012 -- 9:00AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 6:52AM, shmuelgoldstein wrote:


The IDF is certainly one of the world's best and most efficient armies.


But I'll tell you one thing they don't do well: explain themselves.


"it won't be published because of security reasons"  !?


What kind of nonsense is that? It harms security more by NOT publishing it. And the shame of it all is that the IDF (and most Israelis) don't realize this.




shmuelgoldstein,


I disagree with you, your statement the IDF does not explain themselves well.


I think their killing acts  explains the IDF very well, they are all about murdering Palestinians, ethnic cleansing, genocide, war crimes, violating the Fourth Geneva Cnvention and other intl human rights laws. 



Statements like the above only serve to show that the IDF and most Israeli channels do an appaling job at making their case heard in the international court of world opinion.


Unless of course one believes that the IDF *wants* to be seen as a bunch of child-murdering savages . . . .  


Most of us who have served in the IDF and who have sons and brothers and neighbors who have served are aware that the IDF bends over backwards in most cases to avoid civilian casualties, although at the same time they are human and fallable.


This fact will, of course, fall on deaf ears if the IDF does not explain itself properly, and certainly if those ears are deaf to reality or are prejudiced or bigoted. The former can be remedied by proper public relations, but the latter cannot. It is a shame and quite frankly a disaster that the IDF does not realize this enough.

Moderated by Merope on Jun 01, 2012 - 10:13AM
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 9:57AM #8
shmuelgoldstein
Posts: 2,479

May 31, 2012 -- 8:50AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:

...On 6 October 2005, Israel's High Court of Justice ruled ...


Now it is our turn to "lol" here.


Sherri, you don't recognize the legitmacy of the Israeli High Court of Justice, yet you quote rulings from that same body to support your thesis.


There is a word that describes this stance: hypocritical.

Moderated by Merope on Jun 01, 2012 - 10:15AM
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 11:25AM #9
SherriMunnerlyn
Posts: 7,519

May 31, 2012 -- 9:57AM, shmuelgoldstein wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 8:50AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:

...On 6 October 2005, Israel's High Court of Justice ruled ...


Now it is our turn to "lol" here.


Sherri, you don't recognize the legitmacy of the Israeli High Court of Justice, yet you quote rulings from that same body to support your thesis.


There is a word that describes this stance: hypocritical.




shmuelgoldstein,


A couple of points, that Israeli court itself found the IDF was using Palestinians unlawfully as human shields, and ordered them to stop. That is proof the IDF uses Palestinians as human shields. They have not stopped, according to the human rights groups. I do not know what any of that says about Hypocrisy of any person pointing this ruling out
 


Another point, I am an American citizen, I have no obligation whatsoever to accept the authority or legitimacy of a court in an Apartheid State like Israel.


 


Sherri



 

Moderated by Merope on Jun 01, 2012 - 10:16AM
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 1:36PM #10
LeahOne
Posts: 16,462

May 31, 2012 -- 11:25AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:

A couple of points,


Not hardly:  your entire first "point" is completely off-topic for this thread.  The topic was Palestinians  using human shields - which is documented and which is the item to properly address.


 


May 31, 2012 -- 11:25AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:

They have not stopped, according to the human rights groups. I do not know what any of that says about Hypocrisy of any person pointing this ruling out


The hypocrisy is in the stance of refusing to recognize the authority of a body, yet using that body's rulings as a source.   


 


May 31, 2012 -- 11:25AM, SherriMunnerlyn wrote:

Another point, I am an American citizen, I have no obligation whatsoever to accept the authority .....


Right up until you choose to use that body's rulings as a reference - which you so clearly did. 

Moderated by Merope on Jun 01, 2012 - 10:18AM
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