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Switch to Forum Live View Gantz: Israel must protect Jews at home, abroad
2 years ago  ::  Apr 16, 2012 - 3:21PM #1
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,032
Gantz is right and this is just one of the reasons we need Israel

Gantz: Israel must protect Jews at home, abroad
By JPOST.COM STAFF
04/16/2012 12:38
Speaking at annual IDF ceremony at Yad Vashem, Chief of Staff says Israel must defend its borders as well as Jews worldwide.

Israel can and must protect its own borders as well as Jews around the world, IDF Chief of Staff Lt.- Gen. Benny Gantz said Monday at an IDF seminar at Yad Vashem Holocaust museum three days ahead of Holocaust Remembrance Day.

"Today we stand against any threat with an army that is capable of beating all its enemies. We must defend the borders of Israel and all its communities, but we must also look around and pay attention to every place where a Jew is harmed for being guilty of nothing but his Jewish identity," Gantz said.
. . .
 full article:
www.jpost.com/Defense/Article.aspx?id=26...
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 3:56AM #2
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

Two facts that this stance conveniently ignores are these:


(1) The policies pursued by the state of Israel put at risk the lives of Jews worldwide.


(2) Israel today is less safe for Jews to live in than, say, Germany.


It is tribal / mafia"family" stances like general Gantz' that create this sorry state of affairs.

tl;dr
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 6:49AM #3
habesor
Posts: 5,687

Char,


Are you sure about points one and two in your previous message?


www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16678772


forward.com/articles/134143/why-anti-sem...


Habesor


Edited for making the second link work

Moderated by CharikIeia on Apr 17, 2012 - 08:47AM
Habesor
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 8:29AM #4
Dostojevsky
Posts: 7,447

Habesor, the heading of your second link - why the anti-semitism is growing in Germany.


The earth would be better for it if it was in Germany alone (if it is at all). The more I read and find out about things the more I fear for the Jews. I could not have believed it I had not lived through it. 

Moderated by CharikIeia on Apr 19, 2012 - 02:23AM
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 8:45AM #5
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

Apr 17, 2012 -- 6:49AM, habesor wrote:


Char, are you sure about points one and two in your previous message?



I am not fully sure of course, but that's the direction many developments seem to point to.


Your second link states, "A New Strain [of anti-Semitism] Is Emerging, Related to Attitudes About Israel"; this is illustration - not refutation - of my point #1, right? As Dos says, this phenomenon is not limited to Germany at all.


Statistically speaking, it is the main effect of Israeli policy - not anything related to the country under study - that puts Jews worldwide at higher risk. I wonder if there are any analyses out there about changes in anti-semitism over time & its relation to Israeli government decisions. Given all the watchdog organisations, it should be easy for the anti-Semitism monitors to do such an analysis.


In Europe, to draw a parallel, there is an overall increase in anti-German feelings due to the way the Merkel government handles the Eurozone currency & national debt crisis.

tl;dr
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 10:18AM #6
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,032

Chari


It has zippo to do with actual Israeli policy and everything to do with the inaccurate reports found in European (and World)  media and pronouncements by European politicans about Israeli policies. Please do not confuse the two. The first is reality the second is a European political/media fantasy. Israel is not responsible in any way for the European political/media fantasy, but you are.   

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 12:47PM #7
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

It's funny how Dos & Co. complain about pro-Jewish mainstream media, and you, Squirrel & Co. complain about anti-Jewish mainstream media. I guess as usual, the truth lies somewhere in-between... but then, truth may be something that only I care for, as several admissions to open partisanship & bias have proven.

tl;dr
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 1:56PM #8
LeahOne
Posts: 16,385

Chari, part of the problem with your idea is that 'Israeli policy' is only ONE factor in the situation.


You'd need to have some way to separate the influence of ACTUAL Israeli policy from that of Pal propaganda , from that of REPORTED israeli policy, etc, etc.


Or put it this way:  How much of that 'intifada' was due to the LIE put out by the PA that israel was planning to demolish the Al Aqsa mosque?


How much influence do those Israel-erased textbooks have on students' perceptions about Israeli policy?


How do the videos we find from HAMAS TV influence people who watch them?


 


I'm not buying it.  Nobody forced the PLO to board the cruise ship and murder an old American in a wheelchair.  Nobody forced them to hijack numerous planes, blow a few up, attack the Munich Olympics.Nobody forced them to hijack a bus full of schoolchildren, to target a shopping center where kids were 'trick-or-treating' (at Purim), to target hotels and airplanes and embassy buildings to murder civilians.


 


When is everyone else going to stop their anti-Arab racism and allow the PLO/PA /whoever to be responsible for their own CHOICES, their own actions?


 


 


 

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 4:21PM #9
Shusha
Posts: 4,614

(1) The policies pursued by the state of Israel put at risk the lives of Jews worldwide.



Char,


I don't know how you intended this, but it sure strikes me as victim-blaming. 


You seem to be saying that it is the responsibility of the state of Israel to act in such a way, or put policies in place, that don't make others want to or attempt to or succeed at killing Jews.  If Jews are at risk in the world, the responsibility lies squarely on the shoulders of those who would harm Jews.  Period. 

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 17, 2012 - 4:32PM #10
BDboy
Posts: 5,659

Apr 17, 2012 -- 12:47PM, CharikIeia wrote:


It's funny how Dos & Co. complain about pro-Jewish mainstream media, and you, Squirrel & Co. complain about anti-Jewish mainstream media. I guess as usual, the truth lies somewhere in-between... but then, truth may be something that only I care for, as several admissions to open partisanship & bias have proven.




 


>>>>>>> I agree with you. These counter claims are made simply to "Respond" to valid criticism of Israeli policies!!


Which often mislead people.


Here are some facts...


Jews lived in many parts of Arabia, Iran for thousands of years in relative peace with Christians and Muslims of those areas. Life of Arab Jews became risky once local population saw violence by the state of Israel. As a result many Jews from different arab countries were forced to migrate from their own lands.


There are serious allegations against Israel for helping fanatics. During 80's Israelis worked with the CIA, Saudi and Pakistanis to block Russia in Afghanistan. Inspired from initial  success they helped launching the Hamas movement to block more secular PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization). Both of those initiatives did not work well in the long run and back fired on USA, Saudis, Pakistanis and Israel.


While I am sad to watch innocent Jewish people suffering, part of the blame goes to flawed policies of Israel.


 




 

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