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Switch to Forum Live View "Castle" law likely to stay
3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 2:28PM #1
Stardove
Posts: 15,996

'Castle' law is likely to stay


I decided to bring the debate about the "stand your ground law" to a new thread.  So we can continued to debate that particular issue on it's own.

SAN ANGELO, Texas — AUSTIN — The shooting death of unarmed Florida teenager Trayvon Martin is drawing attention to Texas' self-defense and deadly force laws and prompting a state lawmaker to call for changes when the Legislature meets.

But the author of the co-called "Castle Doctrine" law, which is taking center stage in the Texas debate and eases the rules on when deadly force can be used in the home, said it wouldn't even apply under the circumstances of the Martin case because the 17-year-old was killed on the street.

The Texas law is being misconstrued as being the same as Florida's "stand your ground" law, said Sen. Jeff Wentworth, R-San Antonio.

"That's not what it is," he said.

The Texas law passed in 2007 was patterned after the English common-law notion that a man's house is his castle. The law states that a person has no duty to retreat from an attack in one's home, vehicle or place of business. It provides a presumption that the force was "reasonable" if certain criteria are met, making deadly force more easily justified.
......


In the Texas penal code, force is justified if the person using the force "reasonably" believes it's "immediately" necessary to protect against the use or attempted use of unlawful force, said defense attorney Richard Segura, an instructor and supervising attorney in the criminal defense clinic at the University of Texas Law School.

The person using the force cannot have provoked the confrontation. "You cannot start something and then go grab a gun," Segura said. And the use of force isn't justified in a simple verbal dispute as a result of "talking trash," he said.

Force also can be used to prevent a serious crime such as murder, sexual assault or robbery. One section of the law allows use of deadly force in preventing burglary or theft at nighttime.

The "Castle Doctrine" law passed in 2007. It says that one does not have to retreat in his or her home, vehicle or place of business and can use "deadly force" if the other person entered unlawfully and with force, Segura explained.




See more at the link above.

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The sun rises every morning and sheds light, vanquishing the night's darkness. The rooster also rises every morning only, unlike the sun, he simply makes noise. But the darkness of the night is dispelled by sunshine, not by the rooster's crowing.The world can use more light and less noise. Where I can, I want to be light.

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 2:42PM #2
Stardove
Posts: 15,996

Here is a source about some state's Castle laws.


Today most states have some kind of castle law. The stronger laws do not require homeowners to attempt to retreat before using force to protect their domicile, and there are a select few states that have very strong stand-your-ground laws allowing citizens to use force in their car or at work without first trying to retreat.



Beliefnet Community Wide Moderator ~ Peace Love Stardove
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The sun rises every morning and sheds light, vanquishing the night's darkness. The rooster also rises every morning only, unlike the sun, he simply makes noise. But the darkness of the night is dispelled by sunshine, not by the rooster's crowing.The world can use more light and less noise. Where I can, I want to be light.

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 2:45PM #3
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,790

I do not entirely have a problem with people being able to Protect their own property from criminals. What I don't like and should be changed, is someone being able to leaving their home and killing someone on someone else's porperty. Or chasing someone down in the street.


This country is supposed to be moving away from the wild wild west. Not falling backwards

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 3:29PM #4
teilhard
Posts: 52,261

The "Castle Law" is GOOD Law and makes Sense ...


In Sentencing Guidelines, e.g., if a Crime is perpetrated against you in your HOME, that Fact increases the Level of Severity of The Offense, and so calls for a harsher Sentence (because the Crime was performed agsainst you in your (presumed) "Zone of Safety") ...


THAT is a DIFFERENT Question, however, than expanding The "Castle Doctrine" to include Cars, Trains, Buses, Airplanes, Phone Booths, Shopping Malls, Beaches, Museums, Sidewalks, Apple Orchards, Cafes, etc., etc. ...

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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 3:57PM #5
rabello
Posts: 22,235

Florida -- the hee-haw state that ran Ryan White and his family clear out of the state because he was a hemophiliac with AIDS, and burned down another family's house because 2 of the kids had AIDS, and that is second in the nation for exections -- if not currently the first in the nation -- and which just elected a criminal to take Jeb's place at the seat of power -- they extend to right to anywhere a gunslinger feels belongs to his "castle".   And it doesn't appear that it's history or the killing of an innocent teenager is going to change things in Wild Wild Wild West Florida, especially since the Republicans there are doing all they can to disenfranchise voters.

Black Lives Matter
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 4:12PM #6
mountain_man
Posts: 40,599

Apr 1, 2012 -- 2:45PM, mainecaptain wrote:

...This country is supposed to be moving away from the wild wild west. Not falling backwards


You have to remember that to these people a TV is worth more than a persons life. They have no problems killing someone that wants to steal their TV, car, or other piece of property. People with that kind of attitude will be running this country if the Republicans have their way.


I'll move to Nepal.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 5:06PM #7
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,790

Apr 1, 2012 -- 4:12PM, mountain_man wrote:


Apr 1, 2012 -- 2:45PM, mainecaptain wrote:

...This country is supposed to be moving away from the wild wild west. Not falling backwards


You have to remember that to these people a TV is worth more than a persons life. They have no problems killing someone that wants to steal their TV, car, or other piece of property. People with that kind of attitude will be running this country if the Republicans have their way.


I'll move to Nepal.




Yes this is true.


I hand around with people who feel if their property is stolen the thief obviously needed it more then themselves. They would not be happy at the loss, but have a sensible view of it. And nothing material is worth killing over.


I wonder how many of those who love these laws are good Christians. And would berate non Christians for being materialistic?


A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 6:21PM #8
mountain_man
Posts: 40,599

Apr 1, 2012 -- 5:06PM, mainecaptain wrote:

I hang around with people who feel if their property is stolen the thief obviously needed it more then themselves. They would not be happy at the loss, but have a sensible view of it. And nothing material is worth killing over.


It's sad that someone would kill a fellow human being over a TV. How could they place so little value on a human life?


I wonder how many of those who love these laws are good Christians. And would berate non Christians for being materialistic?


Every single one of them.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 6:23PM #9
teilhard
Posts: 52,261

The Picture DOES add up, doesn't it ... ???


Apr 1, 2012 -- 3:57PM, rabello wrote:


Florida -- the hee-haw state that ran Ryan White and his family clear out of the state because he was a hemophiliac with AIDS, and burned down another family's house because 2 of the kids had AIDS, and that is second in the nation for exections -- if not currently the first in the nation -- and which just elected a criminal to take Jeb's place at the seat of power -- they extend to right to anywhere a gunslinger feels belongs to his "castle".   And it doesn't appear that it's history or the killing of an innocent teenager is going to change things in Wild Wild Wild West Florida, especially since the Republicans there are doing all they can to disenfranchise voters.





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3 years ago  ::  Apr 01, 2012 - 7:30PM #10
Ironhold
Posts: 11,670

The thing to remember about Texas is that, due to the sheer size of the state and its various counties, many homes are often so far away from the nearest police station that if the homeowner had to wait for the cops to show up they'd be dead.


I live in an area where there are a lot of farms and ranches; this means that there can actually be several miles between clusters of houses. There just aren't enough cops and enough cruisers to reasonably deal with such distances.


Instead, by going "castle law", these people can legitimately protect themselves without becoming martyrs or abandoning everything.

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