" They just fly the old country's flags and eat some of the old traditional foods"

Three cheers for the lingon and the lutefisk. Rokar stokar.

Mar 11, 2012 -- 11:55AM, Roodog wrote:

Mar 7, 2012 -- 6:29PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:

First it was Norway, and then Netherlands and now France.  Anyone see the pattern? the problem?

The fight against religous liberty is continuing in the EU. You would think that they would have more immediate concerns. 

Jews and Muslims outraged at French PM's plan to end religious slaughter in France

Jewish and Muslim leaders in France have reacted angrily at suggestions by Prime Minister François Fillon that certain religions should rethink their "ancestral traditions" of religious slaughter of animals, suggesting they were “outdated” and not in line with “Republican tradition”. The comment came as President Nicolas Sarkozy - seeking re-election in the April-May ballot - and his ministers kept up efforts to woo far-right voters from the anti-immigrant National Front led by Marine Le Pen.

Richard Prasquier, head of the Jewish umbrella organization CRIF, said that he was "shocked" by Fillon's "astonishing" declaration, and added: "The government has no place giving advice about religious traditions." French Chief Rabbi Gilles Bernheim asked: “France's problems are so major, as we are in a period of crisis, so how can the issue of kosher meat and halal meat be a major problem for France?”

. . .

The French Council of the Muslim Faith (CFCM) slammed what it said was the use of Muslims as "scapegoats" in the election campaign in which halal slaughter of animals has become a hot-button issue.

. . .

full article:
www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/1143...[/quote]

 

 

Squirrel,

This is one reason that I support the State of Israel. The Gentiles cannot be trusted to govern Jews without persecuting them. Keep your passport updated and invest in Israeli businesses.

To the Muslim posters: Keep your passports updated and invest in businesses in Muslim countries.

 

>>>>>>>> Thank you for your good advice.

I do understand where you are coming from. However if you look at Jewish and Muslim relationship for last 60+ years, you may not get the bog picture.

Muslims and Jews had pretty good relationship in most parts of 1400 years. Even after second world war tons of Jews were given shelter in Muslims lands. Hunders of thousands Muslims fought against the Nazis as well.

This "Good relationship" tunred sour a bit when the zionist movement started (With some land disputes) and eventual re-creation of Biblical Israel (Which did not exist for around 2000 years).

Unlike Christianity (For most parts of last 2000 years) Islam does not have any religious mandate to go against Jews for simply being Jewish.  Muslims do not blame Jews for killing Jesus son of Mary either.

Despite the headliners from Arabia, Jews and Muslims get along fine in most places. They do not make news but they do. It may be hard to imagine that, there are Jewish communities in places like Iran today.

While it will be wrong to deny problems between these communities but it is NOT as bad as most people think it is. The very topic of the thread shown us there are many "Common grounds" for these two communities and they often stand united to solve them.

Mar 11, 2012 -- 2:57PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:

BDboy

Enough with your revisionist history. There were times and places when Muslims did not abuse Jews and Christians. Those were few and far between. As you know, Jews and Christians were "permitted" to live in lands controlled by Muslims as Dhimmis. Dhimmitude is the original apartheid system and all but insured that neither Jews nor Christians could thrive (it usually meant far worse), despite the fact that they were in almost all circumstances the earlier population of the areas controlled by Muslims.  

I have tried to discuss the Muslim religious apartheid system known as Dhimmitude with you on a number of occasions. Your denial of historical fact speaks loud and clear. 

Roo

I always keep my passport up to date. You never know when the chance for adventurous foreign travel might come up (not to mention that it is a good insurance policy against bad things which may or may not happen). Everyone should have an up to date passport. After all these days you need one just to have lunch in Canada.   

>>>>>>>>> I don't think I denied anything. Simply said relationship was much better than how it is now.

Maybe you misunderstood my posts!

Without getting more into the discussion we had already, the way some of your posts written make it sound like the term "Dhimmi" as something very bad. Literally it means "Protected". Even in 21st century security is the first priority for everyone. Even the state of Israel established that as their prime concern.

There were time when Jews were protected from attacks and abuse by Jew haters. Don't think the idea of giving protection is a bad thing.

Here is a short intro to the term...

Dhimmi

Historically, a dhimmi was a person who is protected under Islamic law by a pact contracted between non-Muslims and authorities from their Muslim government: this status was first made available to non-Muslims who were People of the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians), but was later extended to include Sikhs, Zoroastrians, Mandeans, Hindus^[13] andBuddhists.^[14][15] People of the Book living in non-Islamic nations were not considered dhimmis.

Non-Muslim People of the Book living in an Islamic nation under Sharia law were given a number of rights, such as the right to freely practice their faith in private and to receive state protection. In turn, they had a legal responsibility, the payment of a special tax called jizya ("tribute") in place of zakat. The social structure of the Ottoman Empire would serve as an example of how non-Muslims were treated.

Mar 13, 2012 -- 10:25AM, rocketjsquirell wrote:

BDboy

Americans are familiar with the problems of "Jim Crow" in the Southern States, the Dhimi laws were even worse. The practice of Dhimmitude in the Arab/Muslim world was even worse than was worse than the  Jim Crow south. Your denial of the horrors of the Dhimmi system as practiced by Arab Muslims for 1400 years is nothing short of amazing.  

Rocky, I think the issue here is whether the French  is imposing Jim Crow Dhimmitude on Jews and Muslims.

BDboy, that is very positive description of Isamic teaching.

So where do we get bad bits from like killing the infidels; it might have been taken out of context, but also there would be circumstances when killing an enemy is permitted.

Christians are good at it 'just war doctrine' I think they call it.