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Switch to Forum Live View Jews and Muslims Outraged at French PM's Plan to End Religious Slaughter in France
3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 6:29PM #1
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,214
First it was Norway, and then Netherlands and now France.  Anyone see the pattern? the problem?

The fight against religous liberty is continuing in the EU. You would think that they would have more immediate concerns. 

Jews and Muslims outraged at French PM's plan to end religious slaughter in France

Jewish and Muslim leaders in France have reacted angrily at suggestions by Prime Minister François Fillon that certain religions should rethink their "ancestral traditions" of religious slaughter of animals, suggesting they were “outdated” and not in line with “Republican tradition”. The comment came as President Nicolas Sarkozy - seeking re-election in the April-May ballot - and his ministers kept up efforts to woo far-right voters from the anti-immigrant National Front led by Marine Le Pen.

Richard Prasquier, head of the Jewish umbrella organization CRIF, said that he was "shocked" by Fillon's "astonishing" declaration, and added: "The government has no place giving advice about religious traditions." French Chief Rabbi Gilles Bernheim asked: “France's problems are so major, as we are in a period of crisis, so how can the issue of kosher meat and halal meat be a major problem for France?”

. . .

The French Council of the Muslim Faith (CFCM) slammed what it said was the use of Muslims as "scapegoats" in the election campaign in which halal slaughter of animals has become a hot-button issue.

. . .

full article:
www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/1143...
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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 6:33PM #2
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,214

And speaking of Europe and religious liberty and infringements thereon . . .

Scottish independence: Saturday referendum may prohibit Jewish vote

THOUSANDS of Jewish voters may be “forbidden” from taking part in the independence referendum if it is held on a Saturday, religious leaders are expected to warn.

The Scottish Council of Jewish Communities (Scojec) said “a Saturday ballot would disadvantage Jewish voters, since those who observe Shabbat (the Jewish Sabbath) would not be able to vote on the day of the referendum”.
. . .
“We therefore urge that the referendum should not be held on a Saturday, or at least not only on a Saturday, and also not on any religious festival that would similarly prevent full participation by any faith community.”
,. . .

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-...

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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 7:27PM #3
karbie
Posts: 3,329

IF the French Government wants to rethink any "ancient traditions", I think that "religious intolerance" would be a good place to start. It isn't a government's place to trry to dictate whether or not women can wear scarves as part of religious observation--again, that was hitting both the Muslim and Jewish communities since orthodox Jewish women cover their heads as well with scarves or wigs.  I'm amazed that with all the other major problems facing  France, it's these non-issues they are wasting time on. Persecution of "them"--whoever the  victim du jour is wastes more time, money, and resources best spent on other things.


To be really picky, I'd consider Kosher meat a lot safer than that from a large meat packing facility.


Scotland should be ashamed to deliberately plan the referendum vote on the Sabbath to disenfranchise Jewish voters.  I hope they have a lot of absentee ballots ready if they are so blatantly displaying prejudices that should not be part of an independent Scotland. For all their machinations,  how can they be sure that the deciding votes for freedom wouldn't come from the Jewish Scots? Bad planning, ridiculous bigotry.


It's like how the "gay marriage" controversy is always a red herring to lead people away from issues like the economy or a candidates voting record. During the blitz of phone calls before the primary in Ohio yesterday, I received 9 political calls a day, ranging from 7 AM to 2 AM. Very few of the calls came from within my state.We have a secret ballot for a reason; I am under no obligation to tell anyone how I'm going to vote.


Too bad they just don't outlaw bigotry and government interference in issues that should never have come up in the first place.


People with closed minds and racial/religious/orientation bigotry  scare me.


We don't need more hatred or bigotry in the world; we have a several generations worth of backlog as it is.

"You are letting your opinion be colored by facts again."
'When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you."
these are both from my father.
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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 9:12PM #4
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,214

I am pretty sure that in Scotland it was a thoughtless omission rather than a purposeful commission. I understand that there are not a lot of Jews involved with  the Scottish independence movement. I am not sure if there are any.


France has lots of problems with "Frenchness" and there is a strong bias in favor of "Frenchness" which is both understandable and frequently annoying. I hope they remember that foi gras was invented by French Jews. :-)

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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 10:37PM #5
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

Mar 7, 2012 -- 9:12PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:


France has lots of problems with "Frenchness" ...



I don't think so at all.


But President Sarkozy has a lot of problems with his presidency...

tl;dr
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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 10:43PM #6
jane2
Posts: 14,295

Mar 7, 2012 -- 10:37PM, CharikIeia wrote:


Mar 7, 2012 -- 9:12PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:


France has lots of problems with "Frenchness" ...



I don't think so at all.


But President Sarkozy has a lot of problems with his presidency...




Agree, Chari


But France is France for better and for worse. I always expect France to be a little "nutty" but it is okay for me. I have an affection for France--some of my Irish forbears were French Hugenots.


 




 

discuss catholicism
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3 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2012 - 11:34PM #7
Erey
Posts: 18,940

I think the Scotland issue was just an oversight like Rocketsquirell said.  France might be having mroe profound immigrant issues.  It seems they are.


What I want to know is most of the jews in France what nationality are they?  Are there so very few jews that are from old french families still in France?  If not what nationality are they considered to be?   I am thinking at this point the Algerian community should be pretty french, right?  Where are most of these "questionable" immigrants that need to be limited comming from?


What nationality can the Roma in France claim?  I would like to be brought up to date.

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3 years ago  ::  Mar 08, 2012 - 9:35AM #8
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,214

Mar 7, 2012 -- 10:37PM, CharikIeia wrote:


Mar 7, 2012 -- 9:12PM, rocketjsquirell wrote:


France has lots of problems with "Frenchness" ...



I don't think so at all.


But President Sarkozy has a lot of problems with his presidency...




Chari


But Sarkozy has a very talented wife. Smile


www.youtube.com/watch?v=Me7wlASiKUg


What do you think the campaign against English and Franglish is all about? It is part of French Nationalism.  I do not expect French Nationalism to die out any time soon.  

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3 years ago  ::  Mar 08, 2012 - 12:49PM #9
vra
Posts: 6,403

Mar 7, 2012 -- 11:34PM, Erey wrote:


What I want to know is most of the jews in France what nationality are they?  Are there so very few jews that are from old french families still in France?  If not what nationality are they considered to be?   I am thinking at this point the Algerian community should be pretty french, right?  Where are most of these "questionable" immigrants that need to be limited comming from?




Behind Israel and the U.S., France has the largest Jewish population worldwide.  And there used to be more, but the Dreyfus Affair made many Jews realize that anti-Semitism was quite strong there, so many left, especially for Israel.  Over the last decade, several synagogues were attacked, and yet the Frnech government for quite a while kept saying that they didn't have an anti-Semitic problem there, so some more Jews left.


There's an increasingly strong anti-immigrant emotion in France, and many other European countries as well, and projections have it that the M.E. population in France, not including Jews, will exceed the rest of the population around 2050.  The French are very concerned about losing the "Frenchness", and the political right there continues to get stronger and reflect more nativistic tendencies.  

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3 years ago  ::  Mar 08, 2012 - 1:04PM #10
vra
Posts: 6,403

I just posted something similar on another thread to what I'm going to post here, but let me mention that all the countries that are considering ending kosher/halal slaughter because it's "too inhumane" do allow hunting.  Go figger.

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