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Switch to Forum Live View Defender of the faith
3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 6:22PM #1
solfeggio
Posts: 9,470

I'm a subject of Her Majesty, but that doesn't mean I'll always agree with whatever she says.  And this latest speech of hers, in which she defends religion as an important force for good in the world, annoys me no end.
www.ibtimes.com/articles/299626/20120216...

Why is it that whenever somebody takes it upon him/herself to 'defend' religion, the person never stops to take into account all the misery, suffering and death caused by religious beliefs over the centuries?  A short list would, for instance, have to include all those religious wars described in the Old Testament, the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the religious wars of the Middle Ages, the witchcraft trials, and the Nazi Jewish Genocide.

As well, there have been genocides in Africa inspired by believers in Islam, not to mention Islamic jihads.

Throughout history, religion has been used as an excuse for some of the worst atrocities imaginable, or, to quote Thomas Paine:

The most detestable wickedness, the most horrid cruelties, and the greatest miseries that have afflicted the human race have had their origin in this thing called revelation, or revealed religion.     

As Richard Dawkins has been quoted as saying: Religious faith is not only a major force for evil in the world.  Its very foundations are undermined and denied by scientific logic.  

     
 

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 7:51PM #2
Girlchristian
Posts: 11,566

Feb 16, 2012 -- 6:22PM, solfeggio wrote:


Why is it that whenever somebody takes it upon him/herself to 'defend' religion, the person never stops to take into account all the misery, suffering and death caused by religious beliefs over the centuries?   




Probably for the same reason that those that take it upon themselves to criticize religion ignore all the good things that religion, religious entities, and religious people have done?

"No matter how dark the moment, love and hope are always possible." George Chakiris

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.” Stuart Chase
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 8:24PM #3
Fodaoson
Posts: 11,162

Religion is  an expression of the hopes of Mankind, religion is made of optimism .  A religion of faith  goes beyond science , beyond life, beyond what is and can be known.   Faith looks for some better in humanity, better for humanity and  the ultimate end of evil and badness.  Atheism is the religion of skeptics, and hopelessness; hopelessness because without religion or faith, this is as good as it gets.


Just as deities and eternity can never be proved , it also can  never be proven to not exist.  Negative are improvable and what is beyond life is improvable


The   crusades, the inquisition s the religious persecutions, the killing in the name of a  religion and god prove the evil that dwells in humanity  and the need for hope.  

“I seldom make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions I have no respect.” Edward Gibbon
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 8:24PM #4
farragut
Posts: 4,122

Al Capone kissed babies.

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 8:33PM #5
Erey
Posts: 19,167

In modern times more people have been killed in the name of communism than anything else.


For some people atheism is a religion and people have actually killed for that.

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 10:10PM #6
mountain_man
Posts: 40,244

Feb 16, 2012 -- 8:24PM, Fodaoson wrote:

Religion is  an expression of the hopes of Mankind, religion is made of optimism .


You spelled that word wrong. It's spelled; oppression.


A religion of faith  goes beyond science , beyond life, beyond what is and can be known.


There is nothing past those things except fantasies. 


Atheism is the religion of skeptics.....


No, it is not. Atheism is nothing more than a lack of belief in gods. Why is that so hard for you to understand?

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 16, 2012 - 10:12PM #7
mountain_man
Posts: 40,244

Feb 16, 2012 -- 6:22PM, solfeggio wrote:

....As Richard Dawkins has been quoted as saying: Religious faith is not only a major force for evil in the world.  Its very foundations are undermined and denied by scientific logic. 


That's what happens when people care more for a malefic god then for their fellow humans and the other species we share this planet with.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 17, 2012 - 10:13AM #8
Fodaoson
Posts: 11,162

“No, it is not. Atheism is nothing more than a lack of belief in gods. Why is that so hard for you to understand? “


You have posted thousands of posts on several threads about nothing? Several atheist writers/thinkers have made millions writing and speaking about nothing or something that does not exist? The idea of something beyond the physical can exist as a dream, a memory, an idea, or as thought. Dreams, memories, ideas,  influence people, they motivate. Dreams, memories etc. exist.. They are not measurable, they are not physical, they are largely unseen except in someone’s thoughts and mind. Love, like, dislike, hate are emotions, i.e. thoughts, so they exists. Because people think of love, hate , love and hat exists. They cannot be seen, they cannot be touched. They cannot be proved. There is suggestion of their existence by people’s acts. The thought and belief of the existence of ‘gods’ makes gods exists. Even the rejection of a belief in deities makes them exist in at least a thought form. Cogito ergo sum “ This phrase is a fundamental element of Western thought and philosophy , it is seen to be a foundation for all knowledge. While other knowledge could be a figment of imagination, deception or mistake, the very act of doubting one's own existence serves to some people as proof of the reality of one's own existence, or at least that of one's thought. (Descartes) As long s people think a god exists, and as long as some doubt he exists, then it exists at least in nebulous form.

“I seldom make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions I have no respect.” Edward Gibbon
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 17, 2012 - 10:49AM #9
mountain_man
Posts: 40,244

Feb 17, 2012 -- 10:13AM, Fodaoson wrote:

“No, it is not. Atheism is nothing more than a lack of belief in gods. Why is that so hard for you to understand? “ You have posted thousands of posts on several threads about nothing? .....


I have not. Because you do not wish to understand what Atheism or Secular Humanism is all about means the problem is not mine.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 17, 2012 - 10:53AM #10
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Feb 16, 2012 -- 8:24PM, farragut wrote:


Al Capone kissed babies.




And Hitler was really good to his dogs. 

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