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Switch to Forum Live View Separation of church and state.
3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 3:44PM #31
lulu2
Posts: 454

People of conscience can not separate themselves from their beliefs. The recent intrusion by the Presidents Healthcare law is an example. WIth one side of his mouth, or brain..he claimed his religious belief as a Christian..he used that to enforce his belief that what he is doing is for public good..and I have to believe, thats what he believes. However, at the same time, under the guise of doing what is right, and using his faith as what urges him to do so..he  crosses the line of government as servants of God..which cant happen just by the fact that not all men think alike, even if they claim to all be servants of the higher good.


This is now evident with the RCC. ..I heard someone liken this violation of religious conscience in this easily understandable way..He said: I'm an owner of a Jewish Kosher Deli..my employees want to pork sandwiches, they want me to pay for it, serve it, and put on the menu"...and I would add ..free of charge and with no co-pay..and we make believe someone else is going to pay for it!  

Without the Soul of Christ alive in us...we are nothing but empty shells...
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 3:53PM #32
teilhard
Posts: 51,824

What I found so especially shocking is that President O'Bama -- former Professor of Constitutional Law !!! -- ought not have made such an obviously egregious Policy ERROR in the first Place ...


Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:44PM, lulu2 wrote:


People of conscience can not separate themselves from their beliefs. The recent intrusion by the Presidents Healthcare law is an example. WIth one side of his mouth, or brain..he claimed his religious belief as a Christian..he used that to enforce his belief that what he is doing is for public good..and I have to believe, thats what he believes. However, at the same time, under the guise of doing what is right, and using his faith as what urges him to do so..he  crosses the line of government as servants of God..which cant happen just by the fact that not all men think alike, even if they claim to all be servants of the higher good.


This is now evident with the RCC. ..I heard someone liken this violation of religious conscience in this easily understandable way..He said: I'm an owner of a Jewish Kosher Deli..my employees want to pork sandwiches, they want me to pay for it, serve it, and put on the menu"...and I would add ..free of charge and with no co-pay..and we make believe someone else is going to pay for it!  





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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 3:56PM #33
farragut
Posts: 4,117

"where does the USConst. clearly state and define a "right to privacy".


 


i am happy to find it in the 9th amendment, and in the recognition that the government is the property and the employee of the people.  Not the reverse.

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 3:59PM #34
lulu2
Posts: 454

where did you get the right to privacy from EAGLE SCOUT..and interesting choice of the SPELLING OF MR O's name

Without the Soul of Christ alive in us...we are nothing but empty shells...
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 3:59PM #35
teilhard
Posts: 51,824

That anyone is STILL fussing over The (supposed, NON)Right to Privacy in The U. S. Constitution makes me really, really, REALLY glad that we gave Robert Bork the heave-ho ...

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 4:03PM #36
lulu2
Posts: 454

The irony is..the HARVARD LAW Professor..thought he was God..now we all know the TRUTH!

Without the Soul of Christ alive in us...we are nothing but empty shells...
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 4:35PM #37
jane2
Posts: 14,295

Feb 11, 2012 -- 4:03PM, lulu2 wrote:


The irony is..the HARVARD LAW Professor..thought he was God..now we all know the TRUTH!




Who exactly thought he was God?? Obama ?? I don't think so. But he should have listened to Biden.

discuss catholicism
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 4:36PM #38
mountain_man
Posts: 40,196

Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:06PM, Rgurley4 wrote:

The "WALL" was not created by Jefferson!


You're right, it was created by the part of the Constitution you quoted earlier. Favoring one religion over another, or even one faction of a religion over another faction, IS establishing a government sponsored religion.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 4:39PM #39
TPaine
Posts: 9,427

Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:06PM, Rgurley4 wrote:


The "WALL" was not created by Jefferson!



Jefferson just came up with the term. The wall wall was built by the Framers in Article VI Paragraph 3 and the First Amendment. They had seen the problems that existed in theocratic colonies such as Massachusetts Bay, Connecticut, and Virginia. The churches do not have the constitutional power to make laws or interpret the laws.


Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:06PM, Rgurley4 wrote:

It was created by a succession of federal and state court cases that stretched the 1st Amendment beyond its clear words and intent.



No they didn't. They interpreted the Constitution correctly. Anyone who listens to David Barton and WallBuilders has no idea what the original intent of the Framers was. The Constitution is a living document. That's why the Framers provided for amendments. In 1789 only white male property owners could vote. Now every citizen over age 18 can.


Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:06PM, Rgurley4 wrote:

For a "constitutionalist" who believes that the Supremes should not "MAKE LAW", this FACT is VERY "relevant" and material...your Honor!



SCOTUS doesn't make law. They interpret it based on the conditions and challenges of each generation. The 4th Amendment doesn't mention electronic methods of communication because the Framers never considered the concept of it.


Feb 11, 2012 -- 3:06PM, Rgurley4 wrote:

For example, where does the USConst. clearly state and define a "right to privacy"


It doesn't! It was a "penumbral" right invented by the SCOTUS.



It doesn't have to actual state the words "right to privacy." It is implied in the 3rd, 4th, 5th, & 9th Amendments.

The United States economy is like a poker game where the chips have become concentrated in fewer and fewer hands, and where the other fellows can stay in the game only by borrowing. When their credit runs out the game will stop. -- Marriner Eccles: Beckoning Frontiers (1951)
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 11, 2012 - 5:00PM #40
Marcion
Posts: 2,883

Feb 11, 2012 -- 11:19AM, teilhard wrote:


Anti-Catholic Bigotry is alive in the Pages of Belief-Net ...




You're right, I went from devout catholic, to doubting catholic, to ex catholic, to anti-Vatican.


I don't appreciate the bigotry part.


My anti-catholicism stems from knowledge not from ignorant bigotry.

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