Post Reply
Page 52 of 57  •  Prev 1 ... 50 51 52 53 54 ... 57 Next
Switch to Forum Live View Usama Bin Laden confirmed dead!
4 years ago  ::  May 23, 2011 - 4:49PM #511
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

May 23, 2011 -- 11:30AM, NATAS wrote:


As a scientist how would you determine wether or not such evidence if released was not altered or faked entirely.  



This cannot be answered without going into the details of the evidence, which - as we know - is impossible because said evidence has not been provided yet.


But generally speaking: you cannot fake the whole truth, so I would want to know the whole truth. Faking always is local, about specific minutiae. Fakers can get through with their lies by spoonfeeding peacemeal information, because such local small stuff they can control to some degree. The more small units are faked, the more likely they will contain inconsistencies. One lie typically entails a few more lies, and thus the spiral to hell is entered. The whole truth, full transparency: nobody can control or fake that, it stands on its own. Truth sets us free.



So the alleged documentation says that the pilots were trained in the US.  


So what?  


That OLB was at the head of the chain of command is "irrelevent"? 


...


I don't understand how you can say that it is irrelevent that OLB was at the top of the chain of command. 



It is pointless. If you study how networks organise, you can learn that there is no head and no top-down "chain of command". These notions are not applicable for modern terrorist warfare. A terrorist network is a self-organising, decentralised organisation.


Think of the internet. There is no "central head router" you could knock out and kill the beast.

tl;dr
Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 23, 2011 - 4:51PM #512
teilhard
Posts: 51,873

So, then ... What Level of "Evidence" -- in THIS Case -- do you require / demand / expect ... ???


May 23, 2011 -- 1:39PM, Nepenthe wrote:


May 23, 2011 -- 10:40AM, teilhard wrote:


So ... You don't believe (accept) a Death Report of ANY famous (or infamous) Person unless you have observed The Autopsy; performed The DNA Tests in your own Lab ... ???


What Level of "Evidence" DO you require ... ???


What is -- for you -- so specially special about The (reported) Death of Osama bin Laden ... ???




Most famous people have not been accused of being the author of some of the most violent crimes of the 21st century nor are they the leader of the most sought after criminal/terrorist group by the Untied States.  So, yeah. some of us hold Bin Laden's death a little more special than your average celebrity. especially during an international investigation.





Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 12:15PM #513
Nepenthe
Posts: 2,722

May 23, 2011 -- 4:51PM, teilhard wrote:

So, then ... What Level of "Evidence" -- in THIS Case -- do you require / demand / expect ... ???




Osama Bin Laden, alive.  That is the level of evidence I require/demand/expect.  However, he was ordered to be executed and then dumped in the sea.  He was intentionally silenced and then destroyed, so yeah I find that a little suspect, especially since the amount of information he may have possessed and the fact that he is accussed of committing horrendous crimes.

Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one's life for his friends.
Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 12:21PM #514
teilhard
Posts: 51,873

You want Video of the LIVING Osama bin Laden, in Hand-Cuffs, being dumped-into-The-Sea ... ???


I guess THAT would qualify as The ULTIMATE "Water-Boarding," eh ... ???


May 25, 2011 -- 12:15PM, Nepenthe wrote:


May 23, 2011 -- 4:51PM, teilhard wrote:

So, then ... What Level of "Evidence" -- in THIS Case -- do you require / demand / expect ... ???




Osama Bin Laden, alive.  That is the level of evidence I require/demand/expect.  However, he was ordered to be executed and then dumped in the sea.  He was intentionally silenced and then destroyed, so yeah I find that a little suspect, especially since the amount of information he may have possessed and the fact that he is accussed of committing horrendous crimes.





Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 1:02PM #515
BDboy
Posts: 6,217

May 25, 2011 -- 12:21PM, teilhard wrote:


You want Video of the LIVING Osama bin Laden, in Hand-Cuffs, being dumped-into-The-Sea ... ???


I guess THAT would qualify as The ULTIMATE "Water-Boarding," eh ... ???


May 25, 2011 -- 12:15PM, Nepenthe wrote:


May 23, 2011 -- 4:51PM, teilhard wrote:

So, then ... What Level of "Evidence" -- in THIS Case -- do you require / demand / expect ... ???




Osama Bin Laden, alive.  That is the level of evidence I require/demand/expect.  However, he was ordered to be executed and then dumped in the sea.  He was intentionally silenced and then destroyed, so yeah I find that a little suspect, especially since the amount of information he may have possessed and the fact that he is accussed of committing horrendous crimes.








 


>>>>>>> Those who followed the "Bin Laden" drama will not argue about if he is alive or not. Most of us think he is dead. However the way his death was shared is a bit abnormal. Contradictions, concealing information, dead body in the sea (reminds us of the mafia movies!).


There was a rumor that he died few years ago. Who knows. I did not know his name before 9-11 and only knowledge of Bin laden I have were given to me by CNN, BBC, Fox, MSNBC and other media outlets.



Who knows...

Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 1:24PM #516
NATAS
Posts: 968

May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


May 23, 2011 -- 11:30AM, NATAS wrote:


As a scientist how would you determine wether or not such evidence if released was not altered or faked entirely.  



This cannot be answered without going into the details of the evidence, which - as we know - is impossible because said evidence has not been provided yet. 



What eividence? 


DNA evidence? 


Photographs of the body?


The Hollywood movies that Obama and others watched of the murder-assaination-execution of OLB?


All of the above?


 


May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


But generally speaking: you cannot fake the whole truth, so I would want to know the whole truth.



There is a difference between evidence and truth. 


 


May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


 Faking always is local, about specific minutiae.



So what has been "faked"? 


May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


Fakers can get through with their lies by spoonfeeding peacemeal information, because such local small stuff they can control to some degree. The more small units are faked, the more likely they will contain inconsistencies. One lie typically entails a few more lies, and thus the spiral to hell is entered.



But it does take time to get all the evidence and all the truth.  And sometimes inconsistencies occur unintentionally.  


May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


The whole truth, full transparency: nobody can control or fake that, it stands on its own. Truth sets us free.


Could you clarify what you mean by the whole truth and full transparency in regards to the alleged death of OLB?


So the alleged documentation says that the pilots were trained in the US.  


So what?  


That OLB was at the head of the chain of command is "irrelevent"? 


...


I don't understand how you can say that it is irrelevent that OLB was at the top of the chain of command. 



You said that there was documentation there was documentation that the pilots of the airplanes that were involved in 9/11 where trained in the US. 


How do you know that the documents were not faked?


Did you examine them?


May 23, 2011 -- 4:49PM, CharikIeia wrote:


It is pointless. If you study how networks organise, you can learn that there is no head and no top-down "chain of command". These notions are not applicable for modern terrorist warfare. A terrorist network is a self-organising, decentralised organisation.



I am not referring to a terrorist network.  I am referring to the resistance organization dedicated to oppose the oppression of Dar al Islam by the Zionist Controlled Corporate Capitilist Military Industral Complex known as Al Qeda. 


Al Qeda did not come into existence all by itself.  Its founder was OLB. 


Al-Qaeda ( /ælˈkdə/ al-ky-də or /ælˈkdə/ al-kay-də; Arabic: القاعدة‎, al-qāʿidah, "the base" or "the foundation"), alternatively spelled al-Qaida and sometimes al-Qa'ida, is a global militant Islamist group founded by Osama bin Laden sometime between August 1988[6] and late 1989.


Al-Qaeda's management philosophy has been described as "centralization of
decision and decentralization of execution."[17] Following the War on
Terror
, it is thought that al-Qaeda's leadership has "become geographically
isolated", leading to the "emergence of decentralized leadership" of regional
groups using the al-Qaeda "brand".[18][19]


 


Many terrorism experts do not believe that the global jihadist movement is driven at every level by bin Laden and his followers. Although bin Laden still had huge ideological sway over some
Muslim extremists, experts argue that al-Qaeda has fragmented over the years into a variety of disconnected regional movements that have little connection with each other. Marc Sageman, a psychiatrist and former CIA officer, said that al-Qaeda would now just be a "loose label for a movement that seems to target the West". "There is no umbrella organisation. We like to create a mythical entity called [al-Qaeda] in our minds, but that is not the reality we are dealing with."[20]


 


For further details on Al Qeda and its organization see:


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Qaeda


 


Human networks can be organized differently than the internet. 


 


 


Think of the internet. There is no "central head router" you could knock out and kill the beast



 


 




Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 1:58PM #517
Ebon
Posts: 10,148

If Osama's death was fake then it could have been done anytime and so, it would have been held back for the moment of maximum political advantage (say, a week before the elections).

He who oppresses the poor shows contempt for their Maker, but whoever is kind to the needy honors God. ~ Proverbs 14:31

Fiat justitia, ruat caelum

Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 2:08PM #518
Nepenthe
Posts: 2,722

My questioning has little to do with the possibility of this event being a 'hoax'. 


My questioning has to do with assassination of an indivual who possess large amounts of information concerning the terrorist network we are currently fighting against.  Then, to top that off, his body is destroyed.  Destruction of evidence and silencing of individuals is done in order to stop information that those in power do not want the public to know.  Law Enforcement and Governments do this with little to no repercussions or accountability.


 

Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one's life for his friends.
Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 5:37PM #519
CharikIeia
Posts: 8,301

NATAS, I don't know why you play this silly game of asking questions you don't care for. It is pointless to answer any of them, as you seem to merely be searching for points to bicker about.


In case I mistake your stance, please tell me what exactly it is that you want me to seriously address. Not a list of twenty small and divergent questions, but one or two big ones.


Thank you.

tl;dr
Quick Reply
Cancel
4 years ago  ::  May 25, 2011 - 5:57PM #520
teilhard
Posts: 51,873

He was shot while he resisted arrest ...


May 25, 2011 -- 2:08PM, Nepenthe wrote:


 


My questioning has to do with assassination of an individual ...





Quick Reply
Cancel
Page 52 of 57  •  Prev 1 ... 50 51 52 53 54 ... 57 Next
 
    Viewing this thread :: 0 registered and 1 guest
    No registered users viewing
    Advertisement

    Beliefnet On Facebook