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Switch to Forum Live View Lenin's Tomb without Lenin?
4 years ago  ::  Jan 21, 2011 - 9:10PM #1
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

worldblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/01/21...


Personally I'd keep history intact and say to keep the body there. What does everyone else think?

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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4 years ago  ::  Jan 21, 2011 - 11:28PM #2
costrel
Posts: 6,226

The body should be buried. Of course, his burial will be better than the terrible one the Bolsheviks gave the Romanovs in 1918.

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2011 - 9:20AM #3
costrel
Posts: 6,226

I find it interesting that, in the midst of discussions concerning the burial of Lenin's body, the Romanovs are now being treated not only with respect, but with reverence. Tzar Nicholas II and his family have been canonized as passion bearer saints by the Russian Orthodox Church, and their purported bodies, removed from the Yekaterinburg grave-pits, are now buried in Peter and Paul Cathedral in St. Petersburg. If the Tzar was really an ineffective ruler of Russia, I wonder if his sainthood and the reverence of his royal line is a rehabilitation (like that of Joan of Arc) or historical revisionism. (One recalls the purportedly anti-tzarist graffito supposedly scrawled on the cellar wall of the Ipatiev House where they were murdered: "Belsatzar was, on the same night, killed by his slaves.")

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2011 - 1:21PM #4
Erey
Posts: 18,573

having a corpse on display is more than a little gross IMO and I probably would be for burial.  Ultimately it is up to the russian people. 

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2011 - 3:06PM #5
costrel
Posts: 6,226

Jan 22, 2011 -- 1:21PM, Erey wrote:


having a corpse on display is more than a little gross IMO and I probably would be for burial.  Ultimately it is up to the russian people. 



There are many incorrupt bodies of Christian saints on display in Catholic and Othordox churches throughout Europe. I suppose for some people it is "gross," while for others, it is a sign of the holiness and saintliness of a deceased person awaiting the resurrection of the flesh. St. Bernadette Soubirous is probably one of the more widely known examples. Russian author Fyodor Dostoyevski devoted an entire chapter in his novel The Brothers Karamazov to Father Zosima's corpse having a putrid smell after death and what that might or might not mean concerning his righteousness.


I'm not sure what the reasonings for displaying Lenin's body (and later Stalin's body) might have been. These days, it is widely known that Lenin's body is not naturally or supernaturally incorrupt, but is painstakingly preserved with chemicals and chemical baths. I'm not sure if average Russians knew about this before the early 1990s. If they did know, perhaps the preservation of Lenin's body is not supposed to mimick the incorrupt body of a saint, but is supposed to bring to mind the preserved bodies of the Egyptian pharoahs.

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2011 - 4:24PM #6
TemplarS
Posts: 6,693

You can apparently view the body of that other wonderful human benefactor, Chairman Mao, in Beijing.


I say apparently because there are rumors that they did such a poor job of embalming the Great Helmsman  that what people actually are viewing is a wax effigy.  


 

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2011 - 5:03PM #7
costrel
Posts: 6,226

Jan 22, 2011 -- 4:24PM, TemplarS wrote:

You can apparently view the body of that other wonderful human benefactor, Chairman Mao, in Beijing.


I say apparently because there are rumors that they did such a poor job of embalming the Great Helmsman  that what people actually are viewing is a wax effigy.  


According to the article linked to in the opening post, "Mendinski claims that only 10 percent of what is left can actually be called Lenin's body." It seems that, in spite of all the care taken in the preservation of Lenin's body, not much of it may be left, either. And according to an EWTN article, even St. Bernadette Soubirous's incorruptable body is partly covered in wax: "Very fine wax masks were laid over the face and hands of St. Bernadette's body in 1925 to disguise the sunken eyes and nose and the blackish tinge to the face and hands" (www.ewtn.com/library/mary/bernbody.htm ).

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4 years ago  ::  Jan 29, 2011 - 1:12PM #8
Merope
Posts: 9,555

This thread was moved from the Hot Topics Zone.


 

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