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Switch to Forum Live View Why are we "demonizing" socialism?
6 years ago  ::  Oct 03, 2008 - 11:37AM #1
CommieJesus
Posts: 276
The right wing, neocons in this country are demonizing the democratic party as "socialist", when in fact in Europe where I am from "social democracies" flourishing and in fact doing better than we are in the USA. (just look at the EURO/USD).
Look the benefits of social democracies in Europe

1) Free healthcare
2) Free college education
3) Quality high schools and K-12
4) Less crime
5) Social safety net for unemployed
6) Less stress
7) More vacation
8) Free daycare for mothers
9) Paid leave for Mothers up to 2 years!!!

Yes, they pay higher taxes and they GET STUFF BACK for it. Neocons and other right wingnuts like to portray that the US is heading to the ways of Cuba, Pol Pot, North Korea or Stalinist Russia if Obama wins. That is simply a lie and sadly many uninformed people in the USA just take their world for it.
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 09, 2008 - 10:18PM #2
Mostyn32
Posts: 2,941
I've spent years trying to figure out why 'socialism' and 'socialist' are dirty words in the US. I live under a socialist government right here in North America - in Canada, actually. My province is well-governed by the New Democratic Party. We have all the benefits you listed, CJ, plus government-run auto inurance which means that our rates are lower than anywhere else! My sister and brother-in-law pay close to $7,000.00 a year to insure two 2003 Jimmys, while I paid under 500.00 to insure my 1996 Altima. Our Premier is nothing like Pol Pot and since we're under snow for a good six/seven months of the year, we're nothing like Cuba, either.

Maybe it's the American thing about labels - liberal, neocon, rightwing, leftwing, fundamentalist, progressive.....and on and on and on. It's easier to demonize what you haven't tried and know nothing about if you slap a derogatory label on it. 
"God is no captious sophister, eager to trip us up whenever we say amiss, but a courteous tutor, ready to amend what, in our weakness or our ignorance, we say ill, and to make the most of what we say aright."  from 'A Learned Discourse on Justification', a sermon by Richard Hooker (1554-1600).
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 12, 2008 - 5:40PM #3
Beruriah33
Posts: 638
[QUOTE=Mostyn32;815386]I've spent years trying to figure out why 'socialism' and 'socialist' are dirty words in the US. I live under a socialist government right here in North America - in Canada, actually. My province is well-governed by the New Democratic Party. We have all the benefits you listed, CJ, plus government-run auto inurance which means that our rates are lower than anywhere else! My sister and brother-in-law pay close to $7,000.00 a year to insure two 2003 Jimmys, while I paid under 500.00 to insure my 1996 Altima. Our Premier is nothing like Pol Pot and since we're under snow for a good six/seven months of the year, we're nothing like Cuba, either.

Maybe it's the American thing about labels - liberal, neocon, rightwing, leftwing, fundamentalist, progressive.....and on and on and on. It's easier to demonize what you haven't tried and know nothing about if you slap a derogatory label on it.  [/QUOTE]

People do not understand what the words they use actually mean. This is due to the terrible educational system in our country. Because people use words without understanding what they mean or the history behind them, they are easily deceived by media and politicians aiming to sway them to their side. If the American people are uneducated about civics and our duties as citizens, our non-revised history, then it becomes easy for Americans to tolerate the rise of corporate fascism in the guise of a democratic republic.
Hope that clears it up.
For the record, I believe in free markets- with targeted, sensible, government intervention, regulation of industries that are essential to the American economy's success, and the maximization of personal freedoms and opportunities in American life.
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2008 - 7:17PM #4
Nightwriterx
Posts: 200
Those who demonize the words "socialist" and "socialism" are likely the same ones who demonize the words "liberal", "secular", or "Democrat"...
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2008 - 7:21PM #5
mountain_man
Posts: 38,095
We do have a state that takes a portion of the profits of a very large corporation and distributes it among the residents of that state.

Isn't that Socialism?

Anyone know which state that is?
Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2008 - 7:47PM #6
Justme333
Posts: 1,101
[QUOTE=mountain_man;846374]We do have a state that takes a portion of the profits of a very large corporation and distributes it among the residents of that state.

Isn't that Socialism?

Anyone know which state that is?[/QUOTE]

Are you talking about Alaska and the oil revenues?

Justme
"Even if you are on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there."  Will Rogers

"Give to those who ask, and don't turn away from those who want to borrow."  Matthew 5:42

"Charity is no substitute for justice withheld."         St. Augustine

"Your love for God is only as great as the love you have for the person you love least."  Dorothy Day

"If you want peace, work for justice." Pope Paul VI
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2008 - 9:51PM #7
mountain_man
Posts: 38,095
[QUOTE=justme333;846404]Are you talking about Alaska and the oil revenues[/QUOTE]
Yep. That's socialism.
Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 23, 2008 - 9:51PM #8
mountain_man
Posts: 38,095
[QUOTE=justme333;846404]Are you talking about Alaska and the oil revenues[/QUOTE]
Yep. That's socialism.
Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 24, 2008 - 12:32AM #9
Justme333
Posts: 1,101
[QUOTE=mountain_man;846627]Yep. That's socialism.[/QUOTE]

Well, so is the huge bailout of financial institutes that Bush and congress handed out a couple of weeks ago.  So there doesn't seem to be much room for anyone calling anyone names ( and that seems to be the intent of the *socialist* label- to make people somehow fear the candidate so labeled) since both parties voted it through.

Justme
"Even if you are on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there."  Will Rogers

"Give to those who ask, and don't turn away from those who want to borrow."  Matthew 5:42

"Charity is no substitute for justice withheld."         St. Augustine

"Your love for God is only as great as the love you have for the person you love least."  Dorothy Day

"If you want peace, work for justice." Pope Paul VI
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6 years ago  ::  Oct 24, 2008 - 1:07AM #10
mountain_man
Posts: 38,095
[QUOTE=justme333;846959]Well, so is the huge bailout of financial institutes that Bush and congress handed out a couple of weeks ago.  So there doesn't seem to be much room for anyone calling anyone names ( and that seems to be the intent of the *socialist* label- to make people somehow fear the candidate so labeled) since both parties voted it through.[/QUOTE]
The Right wants every one to believe that socialism is the same as totalitarianism or a "welfare state." It's another example of framing.
Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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