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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 10:14PM #11
Creedofcrusades
Posts: 1,571
[QUOTE=TPaine;340009]As far as I know there is only one Religious Right group that actually wants to physically take over the Government, and IMHO they are a very dangerous, but growing albeit slowly, bunch. From what I've read, if they were to succeed, they would make the atrocities of the Catholic Church in the Dark Ages seem like a Sunday School picnic. I'm including a link since the article is too long to post.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/reconstr.htm

Comments would be appreciated.[/QUOTE]


  Yes, all 13 Dominioinists are gearing up to take over America :) Ignoring the fact that this group is not part of the Religious Right, this is an outstanding example of the bias and agenda of religioustolerance.org. I'll stop there unless you want to pursue it more...not as an argument but as something you just may not have noticed. Working down the page you gave as a link gives several startlingly clear examples of both their bias and agenda.

In God We Trust
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 10:52PM #12
TPaine
Posts: 9,427

Creedofcrusades wrote:

Yes, all 13 Dominioinists are gearing up to take over America :) Ignoring the fact that this group is not part of the Religious Right, this is an outstanding example of the bias and agenda of religioustolerance.org. I'll stop there unless you want to pursue it more...not as an argument but as something you just may not have noticed. Working down the page you gave as a link gives several startlingly clear examples of both their bias and agenda.

In God We Trust



If not agreeing that Evangelical Christians are the only true religion makes them liberal, then I grant you your point. If you consider that I'm a liberal because I believe that the diversity of religion is beneficial to this country, so be it. I created this thread not because I believe a small group of extremists are going to take over the government, but to show what such a group believes this country should be like.  IMO, it's not a pretty picture.

"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- General Smedley Butler: War is a Racket (1935)

"War is mankind's most tragic and stupid folly; to seek or advise its deliberate provocation is a black crime against all men. Though you follow the trade of the warrior, you do so in the spirit of Washington — not of Genghis Khan. For Americans, only threat to our way of life justifies resort to conflict." - General of the Army Dwight D. Eisenhower: Graduation Exercises at the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York, USA at 3 June 1947
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 10:54PM #13
JohnQ
Posts: 5,676

Creedofcrusades wrote:

Oh god..religioustolerance.org...lol....thats all the comment you need my friend :) Lately that bunch has gotten so open they dont even pretend to hide who they front for.

These people are about anything but tolerance.




Okay, so enlighten me.  For whom does religioustolerance.org front?

And, what are they about if it is not tolerance?

Peace!                 
------

Christian LIES wed Christian HATE......Begot a child....it’s named Prop 8! 

Supreme Court let it stand.....which means we can vote away the rights of others in our land.

Sad as that may be...it hurts all of us.....not just me.
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 11:23PM #14
Sacrificialgoddess
Posts: 9,496

JohnQ wrote:

Okay, so enlighten me.  For whom does religioustolerance.org front?

And, what are they about if it is not tolerance?





Don't worry about it, John.  For Creed, tolerating anything other than Christianity is evil. :rolleyes:

Dark Energy. It can be found in the observable Universe. Found in ratios of 75% more than any other substance. Dark Energy. It can be found in religious extremists, in cheerleaders. To come to the conclusion that Dark signifies mean and malevolent would define 75% of the Universe as an evil force. Alternatively, to think that some cheerleaders don't have razors in their snatch is to be foolishly unarmed.

-- Tori Amos
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 8:24PM #15
TPaine
Posts: 9,427

faith713 wrote:

It's not surprising, the Bible talks about the antichrist in Revelation. A new world order will soon emerge and take over. It will seem wonderful at first then turn for the worst.

http://www.worldslastchance.com/full_article.php




Faith, first of all, I want you to know I enjoy your posts and the debates we have had on this board. I read the article you linked and found it interesting but having read Hal Lindsey's books it offered little I did not already know. My question is, do you believe that the Dominion Theologists (which was who the link was about) are or could be the Antichrist? Your link seemed to infer that the Roman Catholic Church was, and if you believe that, then the Reconstructionists would not be because Catholics would be among the first that would be executed if they were to take over.

"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- General Smedley Butler: War is a Racket (1935)

"War is mankind's most tragic and stupid folly; to seek or advise its deliberate provocation is a black crime against all men. Though you follow the trade of the warrior, you do so in the spirit of Washington — not of Genghis Khan. For Americans, only threat to our way of life justifies resort to conflict." - General of the Army Dwight D. Eisenhower: Graduation Exercises at the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York, USA at 3 June 1947
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 8:53PM #16
Xristocharis
Posts: 5,051
Dominionism is a dangerous heresy from my perspective (and the perspective of most mainstream Christians).

Full blown Dominionism seems really to be the product of Post Millennialism, which is one of the most recent contenders in the Eschatology show down.

Post Millennialism teaches that Christ rules through His Church here on earth, and that this is the Millennium; it is the purpose of the Church to subjugate the whole world under the reign of God including national governments, once the whole world has been converted then Christ will return to reign forever and ever.

At least that's the gist of it.

Not all Post-millennialists are Dominionists, but it's easy to see how it's conducive to producing Dominionist thought.

Now since Post-millennialism is a very small minority position (held mostly by only a handful of Calvinists and Pentecostals) we can probably rule out explicit Dominionism being that dangerous, because there simply aren't more than a very small number of people who advocate it.

HOWEVER, there is the more subtle forms of Dominionism that permeate through the Religious Right in America and thus has trickled down into a large number of Evangelical churches.

It's the idea of "taking back America", it's coated in patriotic and pseud-Christian language in order for it to be more easily swallowed.

I think THIS is the more dangerous form of Dominionism, because it's so gradual and much more sinister, it has been simmering on the back burner for decades, slowly ensnaring more and more people by convincing them that what they are supporting is both pro-America and pro-Christian. They see themselves as the remnants of a time when America was a more moral place which has been subverted and transformed into a land of immorality; and an entirely different kind of eschatological system helps fuel this: Premillennial Dispensationalism.

The basic idea is this: Since Scripture states that things will get increasingly worse as time progresses it will finally be the right time for the Antichrist to step onto the scene who will make a pact with Israel for seven years (but subsequently turn his back on the Jews halfway through that time frame). The Antichrist will unite the world under his banner, all nations will join together in a one world government and be forced to take his mark as a sign of loyalty. However true believers will have been whisked away before the sh*t storm really starts, either before the time of tribulation (pretribulationism) or midway through it (midtribulationism).

So based on this eschatological system and the conviction that you are part of the last of the moral remnant then the changes going on in America over the past few decades are seen as "signs of the times" indicating a grand choreographed conspiracy by Satan which will ultimately give rise to the advent of the Beast (Antichrist).

Democrats, Socialists, the ACLU, Atheists, Muslims and adherents to other religions and those belonging to non-Fundamentalist churches (Catholics, Lutherans, Orthodox, Methodists, etc) are simply pawns in the devil's grand conspiracy.

Thus "taking back America" is not merely over-inflated patriotic tripe, it's a rallying cry over a perceived spiritual war with the Prince of Darkness himself for the souls of Americans and for the soul of America--that great God-fearing country founded on Christian principles and which can stand up against a world gone mad.

Thus in order to preserve America and the American way of life--freedom, liberty and justice for all--we must "take back America" in order that we remain under the protection of God, for if we don't we will lose His protection (if we haven't already) and may--in fact--face certain destruction either because God has lifted His protection otherwise keeping us safe or He will personally reign down His wrath upon us for our iniquity just as He did to Sodom and Gomorrah, or Egypt.

"So Jon, how do you know all this?"

Because I used to believe all of it once upon a time.

-Jon
"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." - Dom Hélder Câmara
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 8:55PM #17
Xristocharis
Posts: 5,051
I should also point out that I was generalizing in some sense in order to really condense it down so as to make it make any sense in a single post.

-Jon
"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." - Dom Hélder Câmara
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 9:04PM #18
TPaine
Posts: 9,427
Jon, thank you for an excellent, insightful post. May I say that Madison and I agree with you.:)

"Since the general civilization of mankind, I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."... James Madison
"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- General Smedley Butler: War is a Racket (1935)

"War is mankind's most tragic and stupid folly; to seek or advise its deliberate provocation is a black crime against all men. Though you follow the trade of the warrior, you do so in the spirit of Washington — not of Genghis Khan. For Americans, only threat to our way of life justifies resort to conflict." - General of the Army Dwight D. Eisenhower: Graduation Exercises at the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York, USA at 3 June 1947
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 9:14PM #19
faith713
Posts: 3,892
This is the first time I've ever heard of Dominion Theologists. I think it's an attempt to lead people away from Christianity. The faith statement of the site is against biblical principles IMO. So, I think the site is just another attempt to demoralize America along with the ACLU.

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within".

-- Joseph Stalin, former dictator of the Soviet Union
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."--John14:6

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.-- John 3:16

"We love Him because He first loved us."--1 John 4:9-10

"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear ... "
1 John 4:18
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7 years ago  ::  Mar 07, 2008 - 9:40PM #20
TPaine
Posts: 9,427

faith713 wrote:

This is the first time I've ever heard of Dominion Theologists. I think it's an attempt to lead people away from Christianity. The faith statement of the site is against biblical principles IMO. So, I think the site is just another attempt to demoralize America along with the ACLU.

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within".

-- Joseph Stalin, former dictator of the Soviet Union




Faith, I certainly hope that you and Jon are right and that Dominion Theology never becomes anything but a small extremist movement.  There is nothing I find more disgusting than genocide whether it is by Nazis in Germany, Christians in Kosovo, or Muslims in Sudan.

However, I would have to disagree if your comment, "So, I think the site is just another attempt to demoralize America along with the ACLU." Religious Tolerance is a site dedicated to trying  to get people to learn about  those belief systems that are different than the ones they hold, and to understand that there is good in all of them. I suggest you check out this page on their site. They are not the ACLU. They are Canadian.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/1st_visi.htm

"Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do so too."... Voltaire

"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives." -- General Smedley Butler: War is a Racket (1935)

"War is mankind's most tragic and stupid folly; to seek or advise its deliberate provocation is a black crime against all men. Though you follow the trade of the warrior, you do so in the spirit of Washington — not of Genghis Khan. For Americans, only threat to our way of life justifies resort to conflict." - General of the Army Dwight D. Eisenhower: Graduation Exercises at the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York, USA at 3 June 1947
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