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Switch to Forum Live View Moderate Muslims Oppose Ground Zero Mosque
4 years ago  ::  Sep 11, 2010 - 4:10PM #581
bb-15
Posts: 242

Sep 11, 2010 -- 11:27AM, IDBC wrote:


Howdy bb-15


...I do not believe that it will accomplish what Iman Rauf wants it to accomplish but that doesn't matter.   All that matters is that it be built....


Have A Thinking Day And May Reason Guide You


Agreed.


Best wishes, BB ;-)

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4 years ago  ::  Sep 11, 2010 - 4:49PM #582
bb-15
Posts: 242

Sep 11, 2010 -- 3:11PM, blissseeker1 wrote:


They have a right to build anywhere it's legal to build a mosque. The big question - the one no one in authority/the media is failing to ask - is, Why build it there?"


When I see this question asked repeatedly, I just think that some people don't understand how difficult it is to get a house of worship built.


Building a house of worship is not like making a reservation in a hotel. You can't just create a house of worship one week and then move it the next week.


In my town, there are many congregations which struggle finding/building new houses of worship. They may be in an inadequate/small building  or an industrial section of town for decades before they can get enough money to buy/lease a new property and go through the permit/construction process in order to have a new house of worship.


In a recent CNN interview Rauf said that he had been working on this project for 15 years. Even without all of this opposition, it would've taken at least five more years to get the Community Center built. That's over 20 years working on this one project. That's typical in my experience.


Really; why, with the majority of the country clearly against it...


Just because the majority of Americans believe in something doesn't make it right.


, tension already rising, other mosques being burned down because of it, why still go through with it? Why stir the pot?


Muslim Americans are certainly asking these questions as they receive threats and know about the firebombings of Mosques in Tennessee.


But another question comes up, how can a persecuted minority stop hatred and bigotry by the majority? If the minority give up some of their rights such as not building houses of worship, will that make the majority like them more? I don't see that in our history. For decades African-Americans were lynched and their churches/homes were burned down in the South. Did that make the Southerners like African-Americans more? I don't think so.


It's a clear sign of antagonism.


This is a very old idea. The thinking is; just because someone from a minority exists, it is an insult to the majority. If this person from a minority is walking down the street, it is an insult. If people from the minority build a house of worship, it is an insult. And so on.


* As far as I know the organizers of the Community Center are innocent of any crime of terrorism or conspiracy to commit terrorism. It is not up to the innocent in my opinion to change their lawful behavior.


- It is up to the majority to treat a lawful minority as human beings and as full citizens imo.


BB ;-)


 

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4 years ago  ::  Sep 11, 2010 - 6:51PM #583
Ceren
Posts: 1,430

Sep 11, 2010 -- 3:11PM, blissseeker1 wrote:


They have a right to build anywhere it's legal to build a mosque. The big question - the one no one in authority/the media is failing to ask - is, Why build it there? Really; why, with the majority of the country clearly against it, tension already rising, other mosques being burned down because of it, why still go through with it? Why stir the pot? It's a clear sign of antagonism. 





 I really think that people don't understand the real estate market in Manhattan. Do you think it's easy to find a building where according to zoning laws you can build over 10 floors in Manhattan? Do you think those buildings are cheap for sale every day?


No there aren't that many buildings and compared to the real estate market they actually got an amazing deal because it's an abandoned building and hadn't been sold for a while.


The bought it A YEAR ago, Daisy Khan went and did an interview with Fox and they wished her the best. They have been praying there since September last year.


So... I don't think it was THEM who "stirred the pot". I think this year some right-wing bloggers were trying to bring controversy and made this an issue from what was a non-issue before. If there was anyone stirring the pot is Pamela Geller and her buddies, not Imam Feisal.


All the best,


Ceren

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4 years ago  ::  Sep 11, 2010 - 7:09PM #584
jane2
Posts: 14,295

Sep 11, 2010 -- 6:51PM, Ceren wrote:


Sep 11, 2010 -- 3:11PM, blissseeker1 wrote:


They have a right to build anywhere it's legal to build a mosque. The big question - the one no one in authority/the media is failing to ask - is, Why build it there? Really; why, with the majority of the country clearly against it, tension already rising, other mosques being burned down because of it, why still go through with it? Why stir the pot? It's a clear sign of antagonism. 





 I really think that people don't understand the real estate market in Manhattan. Do you think it's easy to find a building where according to zoning laws you can build over 10 floors in Manhattan? Do you think those buildings are cheap for sale every day?


No there aren't that many buildings and compared to the real estate market they actually got an amazing deal because it's an abandoned building and hadn't been sold for a while.


The bought it A YEAR ago, Daisy Khan went and did an interview with Fox and they wished her the best. They have been praying there since September last year.


So... I don't think it was THEM who "stirred the pot". I think this year some right-wing bloggers were trying to bring controversy and made this an issue from what was a non-issue before. If there was anyone stirring the pot is Pamela Geller and her buddies, not Imam Feisal.


All the best,


Ceren





Nice response, Ceren


For heaven's sake it is an old Burlington Coat Factory site. And it is a blight site.


Most of the western faiths have had adherents who were war-mongers, killers, etc. Judaism, Christianity and Islam all arose in the same area.



discuss catholicism
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4 years ago  ::  Sep 11, 2010 - 8:02PM #585
mountain_man
Posts: 39,638

Sep 11, 2010 -- 3:11PM, blissseeker1 wrote:

They have a right to build anywhere it's legal to build a mosque. The big question - the one no one in authority/the media is failing to ask - is, Why build it there?



Because they have been using the site for many years already. It was no problem then so the question that has to be asked is why is it a problem now?


Really; why, with the majority of the country clearly against it, tension already rising, other mosques being burned down because of it, why still go through with it? Why stir the pot? It's a clear sign of antagonism.



Actually, it's the other way around. The anti Islamicists are the ones being antagonistic. They must build that community center now. If they don't they'll just be empowering the extremists that spread hate and in actions are no different than the terrorists.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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4 years ago  ::  Sep 22, 2010 - 8:24PM #586
Agnosticspirit
Posts: 9,244

This thread has been moved from the Hot Topics Zone once discussion died down. The rules in HTZ are a little looser... personal insults are left to remain but sitewide guidelines that prohibit vulgarity, hate speech, etc. are still enforced. 


Local guidelines will apply to any discussion going forward. 


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3 years ago  ::  Sep 23, 2011 - 12:20AM #587
bb-15
Posts: 242

From the Los Angeles Times.


An Islamic community center that fueled angry demonstrations because of  its proximity to the site of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks has opened  quietly in Lower Manhattan, drawing no protesters...



I had faith that some way, some how, that the fear would die down and that the respect for religious freedom which is at the foundation of the US would prevail. And today in New York for one moment it happened.

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3 years ago  ::  Sep 23, 2011 - 4:21PM #588
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,786

That is a very good thing

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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