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Switch to Forum Live View "mush God" apostasia
6 years ago  ::  Dec 11, 2008 - 7:32PM #21
gillyflower
Posts: 5,325
And the Catholics and the Protestants don't either.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. Marcus Aurelius
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 11, 2008 - 8:17PM #22
gorm-sionnach
Posts: 1,663
Let's not forget the Orthodox (even though everyone already does...:p)
Truth in our hearts, Strength in our arms, Fulfillment in our tongues.
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 11, 2008 - 9:59PM #23
ItsAllALie
Posts: 4,421

sacrificialgoddess wrote:

Next, someone will claim that the mormons and mainstream christians don't worship the same god. ;)



gillyflower wrote:

And the Catholics and the Protestants don't either.



gorm-sionnach wrote:

Let's not forget the Orthodox (even though everyone already does...:p)




It's already been suggested,,,,,,,,,goes along with the REAL Christian thing.   Holly

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6 years ago  ::  Dec 13, 2008 - 4:33PM #24
ajesuschrist_mathetes
Posts: 148
Shortly after 9/11 I was led by The Holy Spirit to a local mosque. Thought I knew enough about what Islam was, but wanted to be sure. The Sheikh there was very pleasant and gave me a free copy of the Quran. We had a brief discussion. Told him I was an Evangelical Christian. No hostilities. He asked me to contact him after I looked Quran over for further discussions. I constructed the following after a several weeks of work.

Question: can we reconcile our sacred texts? Our separate Holy Books? Need, as post #1 discusses, to be able to look openly and seriously at the actual Scriptural texts. This hopefully will assist in that:
____________________________________________________________________________________

Some of  Islam's teachings on:Jesus Christ, The Trinity, Jews, Jews and Christians
                              December 10,2002

                                                              Subject                    SURA References
     -------------------------  --------------------
     JESUS CHRIST :
     
        o Not Crucified           iv:157
        o Not The Son of God      iv:171;ix:30;
                                  xix:35,88-92
        o Not God                 v:19,75
           (Hell fire for belief
            that He is)
        o Not part of The Trinity iv:171;v:76
        o No more than an apostle iv:171;v:78

      THE TRINITY:

        o "Say not . desist. will iv:171
             be better for you"
        o Blasphemy               v:76
        o Grievous penalty        v:76

      JEWS :

        o Enmity to Islam         v:85

      JEWS AND CHRISTIANS :

        o Take them not as        v:54
           friends and protectors
        o God's curse be on them  ix:30

______________________________________________________
  From "The Glorious Kur'an
        Translation and Commentary
                by
         Abdallah Yousuf Ali"
      [completed by 'ABDULLAH YUSUF 'ALI November 14,
       1937; Preface to Third Edition dated 1938]

       [Obtained from Sheikh Muhammad Al-Hanooti on
        September 17, 2001 at:
             Islamic Center of Capitol District
             21 Lansing Road North
             Schenectady, New York 12304
             (518)-374-2364
             (518)-395-9866 Islamic Ctr. School Bldg]

       [Note that the above Subjects come directly
        from the Index given in this Kur'an under:
         ...Blasphemy...Jesus...Jews...]

   *Islam regards the Kur'an as the final Word of God.
     * A Muslim is a follower of the Islamic faith.
------------------------------------------------------

Sura iv:157 page 230

      That they said (in boast),
      "We killed Christ Jesus
      The son of Mary,
      The Apostle of God";-
      But they killed him not,
      Nor crucified him,
      But so it was made
      To appear to them,
      And those who differ
      Therein are full of doubts,
      With no (certain) knowledge,
      But only conjecture to follow,
      For of a surety
      They killed him not:-

Sura iv:171  page 233-234

      O People of the Book!
      Commit no excesses
      In your religion: nor say
      Of God aught but the truth.
      Christ Jesus the son of Mary
      Was (no more than)
      An apostle of God,
      And His Word,
      Which He bestowed on Mary,
      And a Spirit proceeding
      From Him: so believe
      In God and His apostles.
      Say not "Trinity" : desist:
      It will be better for you:
      For God is One God:
      Glory be to Him:
      (Far Exalted is He) above
      Having a son.  To Him
      Belong all things in the heavens
      And on earth.  And enough
      Is God as a Disposer of affairs.

Sura v:19  page 246-247

      In blasphemy indeed
      Are those that say
      That God is Christ
      The son of Mary.
      Say:"Who then
      Hath the least power
      Against God, if His Will
      Were to destroy Christ
      The son of Mary, his mother,
      And all-every one
      That is on the earth?
      For to God belongeth
      The dominion of the heavens
      And the earth, and all
      That is between.  He createth
      What He pleaseth.  For God
      Hath power over all things."

Sura v:54  page 259-260

      O ye who believe!
      Take not the Jews
      And the Christians
      For your friends and protectors:
      They are but friends and protectors
      To each other.  And he
      Amongst you that turns to them
      (For friendship) is of them.
      Verily God guideth not
      A people unjust.


Sura v:75  page 266

      They do blaspheme who say:
      "God is Christ the son
      Of Mary"  But said Christ:
      "O Children of Israel!
      Worship God, my Lord
      And your Lord"  Whoever
      Joins other gods with God,-
      God will forbid him
      The Garden, and the Fire
      Will be his abode.  There will
      for the wrong-doers
      Be no one to help.


Sura v:76  page 266

      They do blaspheme who say:
      God is one of three
      In a Trinity: for there is
      No god except One God.
      If they desist not
      From their word (of blasphemy),
      Verily a grievous penalty
      Will befall the blasphemers
      Among them.

Sura v:78  page 266-267

      Christ the son of Mary
      Was no more than
      An Apostle; many were
      The apostles that passed away
      Before him.  His mother
      Was a woman of truth.
      They had both to eat
      Their (daily) food.
      See how God doth make
      His Signs clear to them;
      Yet see in what ways
      They are deluded
      Away from the truth!

Sura v:85  page 268

      Strongest among men in enmity
      To the Believers wilt thou
      Find the Jews and Pagans;
      And nearest among them in love
      To the Believers wilt thou
      Find those who say,
      "We are Christians":
      Because amongst these are
      Men devoted to learning
      And men who have renounced
      The world, and they
      Are not arrogant.

Sura ix:30  page 448

      The Jews call 'Uzair a son
      of God, and the Christians
      Call Christ the Son of God.
      That is a saying from their mouth;
      (In this) they but imitate
      What the Unbelievers of old
      Used to say.  God's curse
      Be on them:how they are deluded
      Away from the Truth!

Sura xix:35  page 774

      It is not befitting
      to (the majesty of) God
      That He should beget
      A son. Glory be to Him!
      When He determines
      A matter, He only says
      To it, "Be", and it is.

Sura xix:88-92 page 785-786

      They say: "(God) Most Gracious
      Has begotten a son!"

      Indeed ye have put forth
      A thing most monstrous!

      At it the skies are ready
      To burst, the earth
      To split asunder, and
      The mountains to fall down
      In utter ruin,

      That they should invoke
      A son for (God) Most Gracious.

      For it is not consonant
      With the majesty of (God)
      Most Gracious that He
      Should beget a son.
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 15, 2008 - 4:19PM #25
ajesuschrist_mathetes
Posts: 148
Was deeply convicted of sin by including Billy Graham Evangelistic Association in the list in post #1 re "mush God". BGEA has ALWAYS been [over 50 years] 100% uncompromising on Jesus Christ and The Cross.

Was and is awful for me to be a devil="diabolos"="false accuser. Terrible sin and I am so sorry. As to the others I mentioned-sorry about that also. Got into that somewhat in post #2 and the pressures on peoples and ministries. "Invisible War"-principalities,powers,rulers of the darkness of this world, spiritual wickedness in high places. Ephesians 6:10-18

Me being gnat sized re BGEA and other ministries. Billy Graham turned 90 and pretty much unanimously proclaimed worldwide a Giant of an Evangelist in the 2nd half of the 20th Century. In the book of Hebrews chapter 11 mentions some heroes of the faith who the world was not worthy of. Not for me to say, but maybe Billy fits into that?

Please forgive me for being an ignorant hateful judgemental false-accuser of the brethren and doing the devil's work. Our enemy the devil's work.

Truly very sorry.
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 15, 2008 - 4:19PM #26
ajesuschrist_mathetes
Posts: 148
Was deeply convicted of sin by including Billy Graham Evangelistic Association in the list in post #1 re "mush God". BGEA has ALWAYS been [over 50 years] 100% uncompromising on Jesus Christ and The Cross.

Was and is awful for me to be a devil="diabolos"="false accuser. Terrible sin and I am so sorry. As to the others I mentioned-sorry about that also. Got into that somewhat in post #2 and the pressures on peoples and ministries. "Invisible War"-principalities,powers,rulers of the darkness of this world, spiritual wickedness in high places. Ephesians 6:10-18

Me being gnat sized re BGEA and other ministries. Billy Graham turned 90 and pretty much unanimously proclaimed worldwide a Giant of an Evangelist in the 2nd half of the 20th Century. In the book of Hebrews chapter 11 mentions some heroes of the faith who the world was not worthy of. Not for me to say, but maybe Billy fits into that?

Please forgive me for being an ignorant hateful judgemental false-accuser of the brethren and doing the devil's work. Our enemy the devil's work.

Truly very sorry.
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