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Switch to Forum Live View There is only one true "religion" - the Truth
6 years ago  ::  Jul 16, 2008 - 7:06PM #31
John_T_Mainer
Posts: 1,658
[QUOTE=StephFunny;629447]Curious...you believe Jesus existed? If so, do you believe he was god or man? I agree the bible is not inerrant with the same reasons you mentioned (ie, translations, editing, alterations, re-editings, etc). However, I've always been told that to this day, the Bible has never been proven wrong when compared to all events in history and is the only 'book of relgion' that hasn't had an error in research, etc. Then, at one point commiejesus said its "filled with mistakes". So, I was just curious if someone would go into a little more detail. I'd like to know if and what the exact errors/mistakes/contradictions are that have been found. Or perhaps point me in a good direction of where I could research those sort of facts. I'd be interested to know...

Have a good day all![/QUOTE]

Its wrong about a few things.  The New Testiment shows its origins as written by people who were not there as they seemed to have left out one whole seige of Jerusalem, and the eventual sack thereof.  You'd think a large scale rebellion and suppression in which a walled city was eventually sacked would have at least been mentioned by people who were aparently coming and going from the beseiged city without even noticing the armies. 

The Romas kept excellent records, as did the Jews.  The people who penned the Bible hadn't read them.

Take it as allegory, as mythic past.  Don't try to pass it off as accurate history unless you have checked both primary source material written by people who would have known the truth, and the archeological record of what we can prove happened.

Faith is faith and history is history.  If you don't confuse the two, then everybodies allegories have lessons to teach.  Confuse the two and you just get wrong a lot.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 12:24AM #32
CommieJesus
Posts: 276
I think the historical Jesus lived about 100-years before the Bible claims.
[QUOTE=StephFunny;629447]Curious...you believe Jesus existed? If so, do you believe he was god or man? I agree the bible is not inerrant with the same reasons you mentioned (ie, translations, editing, alterations, re-editings, etc). However, I've always been told that to this day, the Bible has never been proven wrong when compared to all events in history and is the only 'book of relgion' that hasn't had an error in research, etc. Then, at one point commiejesus said its "filled with mistakes". So, I was just curious if someone would go into a little more detail. I'd like to know if and what the exact errors/mistakes/contradictions are that have been found. Or perhaps point me in a good direction of where I could research those sort of facts. I'd be interested to know...

Have a good day all![/QUOTE]
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 1:49AM #33
Gwyddion9
Posts: 320
there is a quote i love from the TV show Babylon 5, regarding truth...
"Truth is like a 3 edged sword, there is my truth, your truth and the truth."
I've always found the quote fascinating and am beginning to see the truth in the comment. this can be applied to about everything is see in the news any more. Just had to add the thought.
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. Dr. Seuss


Let My Worship be within the heart that rejoiceth, for behold: all acts of love and pleasure are my rituals. And therefore let there be beauty and strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence within you. Charge of the Goddess
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 7:47AM #34
CommieJesus
Posts: 276
I know how deeply philosophical this whole "truth" business is. Yet as much as we perceive things the ultimate truth remains the same. Our mind is not. Our feelings, perceptions vary. The words Truth is maybe a little misleading but let’s call it then nature's laws. Not something god dictated to Moses on an emerald tablet but the "real enchilada". I do not care of your persuasion, world view, religion or philosophy, thank god some things are unalterable and fixed no matter how you look at it - the sun is the source of life on earth, the physical AND the "other" metaphysical one, if the sun were to disappear tomorrow, so would we.
There is only one god and it is transcendental principle and not an external being, there is always someone who knows more than you and I (hence the principle of the Hierarchy). You can chose to ignore these or accept them into your world view, but that will not alter their validity. These truths are principles, and while I may appear orthodox in my view and this may be not a politically correct view of modern american philosophy, I hold only one TRUTH -
GOD IS , all else is an illusion, maya as the Hindus describe it, since our mind is the most powerful tool, we create our worlds and dreams. Yet the dream seems so  "real" and it has certain rules...if you follow the rules you wake up sooner.
Take the blue pill or the red pill (as it was shown in the Matrix)...
[QUOTE=Gwyddion9;630422]there is a quote i love from the TV show Babylon 5, regarding truth...
"Truth is like a 3 edged sword, there is my truth, your truth and the truth."
I've always found the quote fascinating and am beginning to see the truth in the comment. this can be applied to about everything is see in the news any more. Just had to add the thought.[/QUOTE]
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 3:05PM #35
gillyflower
Posts: 5,325
I respectfully disagree. I think that you are defining "truth" as what you believe, correct?  I don't think that you can prove that your god exists or that there is only one but don't feel badly! No one else can either. The spiritual ideas that you are stating as facts are only your opinions. Other people opinions and experiences are different.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. Marcus Aurelius
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 6:46PM #36
CommieJesus
Posts: 276
Gilly,
I understand where you are coming from but what about people who had "visions" or see things? That is no longer just a belief. It is either true or hallucination.  Anyways, can you argue with the fact that I worship the Sun (or nature, take your pick) and I see it every day with my own eyes. That is reality! (I might not be in the 100-percent right path but that's "reality".)
Cheers
Jesus
[QUOTE=gillyflower;631380]I respectfully disagree. I think that you are defining "truth" as what you believe, correct?  I don't think that you can prove that your god exists or that there is only one but don't feel badly! No one else can either. The spiritual ideas that you are stating as facts are only your opinions. Other people opinions and experiences are different.[/QUOTE]
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 7:22PM #37
gillyflower
Posts: 5,325
[QUOTE=CommieJesus;631797]Gilly,
I understand where you are coming from but what about people who had "visions" or see things? That is no longer just a belief. It is either true or hallucination.  Anyways, can you argue with the fact that I worship the Sun (or nature, take your pick) and I see it every day with my own eyes. That is reality! (I might not be in the 100-percent right path but that's "reality".)
Cheers
Jesus[/QUOTE]

People who have visions have a UPG and those are meaningless to anyone but themselves. To the person who had it, it can have great meaning. It is part of your reality but no one else's reality. I would never argue that you don't worship the Sun. I don't know you in real life so really I have to take your word for what you worship, just as you do for me. I also wish you well on your path whatever it might be. Personally I think if your path is satisfying to you, then it is 100 per cent right for you.
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. Marcus Aurelius
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 11:42PM #38
williejhonlo
Posts: 3,908
[QUOTE=Gwyddion9;630422]there is a quote i love from the TV show Babylon 5, regarding truth...
"Truth is like a 3 edged sword, there is my truth, your truth and the truth."
I've always found the quote fascinating and am beginning to see the truth in the comment. this can be applied to about everything is see in the news any more. Just had to add the thought.[/QUOTE] I think the truth is the underlying principal. This principal is the standard by which all truths are understood, known, hypothesized and speculated upon. This truth is that which cannot  be denied. This truth is the underlying principal behind knowledge and love. This truth is consciousness, for it takes consciousness to even know what consciousness is.  It takes consciousness to know even what truth is. The end of truth is when we understand where this consciousness comes from.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 17, 2008 - 11:53PM #39
John_T_Mainer
Posts: 1,658
Don't you love the word truth?

We use it like it means fact, but we use it when opionion would be a more accurate description.

Many of us have got a hold of a tiny piece of it, which is good, but too many of us take that little peice and attempt to derive the totality of all the nine worlds and all its wonders from that piece.

Rather than showing the knowledge of what we found, we show our ignorance of everything else.

Like your faith, your truth may have little relavence to my life.  I am not taking away from anyones experience or beleif, but do not think that having found a shard of truth in any way gives you the right or the ability to instruct others about what we should beleive.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 18, 2008 - 6:59AM #40
CommieJesus
Posts: 276
Yes. Thanks for saying this. I have failed to get this across....     :)

On the other hand we could approach this differently...lets look at what God IS NOTand be happy when we have left with something of a value....
God isn't a person with a white beard, He/she has no gender - it is IT, It did not create us, the earth or hell, It is not hateful, vengeful or mean spirited who can smite. When we pray IT does not listen, when we meditate we listen and sometimes hear us. etc etc
we could attempt this for the concept of truth, peal it like an onion...

Jesus.


[QUOTE=williejhonlo;632413]I think the truth is the underlying principal. This principal is the standard by which all truths are understood, known, hypothesized and speculated upon. This truth is that which cannot  be denied. This truth is the underlying principal behind knowledge and love. This truth is consciousness, for it takes consciousness to even know what consciousness is.  It takes consciousness to know even what truth is. The end of truth is when we understand where this consciousness comes from.[/QUOTE]
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