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Switch to Forum Live View Why do whales have leg bones?
2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 9:01AM #1
christzen
Posts: 6,569

They do,you know.The hind leg bones are just concealed withing the tissue and don't extend outside the body.So the question is,why?Why have leg bones when you don't have actual legs?

The scientific answer is evolutionary adaptation.Whales are mammals that evolved from land based mammals to live in water,and in doing so gradually adapted to a more streamlined body suitable for swimming rather than walking.But the leg bones of the ancestors didn't fall off or go away,they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body.But they are still there.

The creationist answer is God did it.But this answer begs the question of why.Why create an animal from scratch that has never lived on land with leg bones hidden within it's body?

Does it really make more sense for creationists to look at an animal that breathes air with land based lungs even though it lives in water,is warm blooded when fish are cold blooded,and has leg bones like land based mammals,and decide that God made it this way for some weird reason rather than explore the possibility that it evolved to life in the water from an amphibious mammal?

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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 9:14AM #2
McAtheist
Posts: 8,077

I think what "makes sense" depends on what a person values the highest; young Earth creationists seem to value preserving their particular, fallible, human-derived way of reading the Bible higher than finding an interpretation that is consistent both with Christianity and real world data.  That's just my take on it.


Some kinds of snakes have remnants of legs as well.

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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 3:34PM #3
wohali
Posts: 10,227

Let's not forget the legless lizard:


www.californiaherps.com/lizards/pages/a....

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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 9:10PM #4
christzen
Posts: 6,569

May 9, 2012 -- 6:42PM, 57 wrote:


May 9, 2012 -- 9:01AM, christzen wrote:


They do,you know.The hind leg bones are just concealed withing the tissue and don't extend outside the body.So the question is,why?Why have leg bones when you don't have actual legs?

The scientific answer is evolutionary adaptation.Whales are mammals that evolved from land based mammals to live in water,and in doing so gradually adapted to a more streamlined body suitable for swimming rather than walking.But the leg bones of the ancestors didn't fall off or go away,they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body.But they are still there.

The creationist answer is God did it.But this answer begs the question of why.Why create an animal from scratch that has never lived on land with leg bones hidden within it's body?

Does it really make more sense for creationists to look at an animal that breathes air with land based lungs even though it lives in water,is warm blooded when fish are cold blooded,and has leg bones like land based mammals,and decide that God made it this way for some weird reason rather than explore the possibility that it evolved to life in the water from an amphibious mammal?




Do tell us how mutations added up and morphed into the spout. 




 


Actually,the question is...why would a Creator create a whale with hind leg bones that are worthless and are nestled inside the tissue of the whale.If you feel capable,please offer an answer.If you do not,then move along and let someone more qualified to speak for creationism give it a try.


I'm not interested in a juvenile debate with someone who can do nothing but try and divert the subject because of an inability to participate intelligently in a civil discussion.

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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 9:48PM #5
rangerken
Posts: 16,406

A series of one liner, mostly insulting posts, by several members were removed.


Rangerken

Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 11:47PM #6
iamachildofhis
Posts: 10,599

May 9, 2012 -- 9:01AM, christzen wrote:



christzen: They do, you know.


The hind leg bones are just concealed withing the tissue and don't extend outside the body.So the question is,why?Why have leg bones when you don't have actual legs?

The scientific answer is evolutionary adaptation.Whales are mammals that evolved from land based mammals to live in water,and in doing so gradually adapted to a more streamlined body suitable for swimming rather than walking.But the leg bones of the ancestors didn't fall off or go away,they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body.But they are still there.

The creationist answer is God did it.But this answer begs the question of why.Why create an animal from scratch that has never lived on land with leg bones hidden within it's body?

Does it really make more sense for creationists to look at an animal that breathes air with land based lungs even though it lives in water, is warm blooded when fish are cold blooded,and has leg bones like land based mammals,and decide that God made it this way for some weird reason rather than explore the possibility that it evolved to life in the water from an amphibious mammal?



iama: Someone is pulling someone's leg!


What makes sense is what The Bible states:


The strange tale of the leg on the whale


.

The wonder of Christmas is that the God Who dwelt among us, now, can dwell within us. - Roy Lessin
.
"Father, forgive them for they know not what they do."
.
Justice is receiving what you deserve.
Mercy is NOT receiving what you deserve.
Grace is receiving what you DO NOT deserve.
.
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2 years ago  ::  May 09, 2012 - 11:55PM #7
d_p_m
Posts: 9,835

May 9, 2012 -- 11:47PM, iamachildofhis wrote:


What makes sense is what The Bible states:




Since you cited an article on creation.com rather than the bible, I'm really not sure what you meant.


What I am sure of is that the bible is not a good source of scientific information, so what it says about vestigial leg structures - if indeed it says anything at all - is quite irrelevant.

"If you aren't confused by quantum physics, you haven't really understood it."

― Niels Bohr


“Extinguished theologians lie about the cradle of every science as the strangled snakes beside that of Hercules; and history records that whenever science and orthodoxy have been fairly opposed, the latter has been forced to retire from the lists, bleeding and crushed if not annihilated; scotched, if not slain.”

― Thomas Henry Huxley, Lay Sermons, Addresses, and Reviews


“The science, the art, the jurisprudence, the chief political and social theories, of the modern world have grown out of Greece and Rome—not by favour of, but in the teeth of, the fundamental teachings of early Christianity, to which science, art, and any serious occupation with the things of this world were alike despicable.”

― Thomas Henry Huxley, Agnosticism and Christianity and Other Essays
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2 years ago  ::  May 10, 2012 - 12:17AM #8
christzen
Posts: 6,569

May 9, 2012 -- 11:47PM, iamachildofhis wrote:


May 9, 2012 -- 9:01AM, christzen wrote:



christzen: They do, you know.


The hind leg bones are just concealed withing the tissue and don't extend outside the body.So the question is,why?Why have leg bones when you don't have actual legs?

The scientific answer is evolutionary adaptation.Whales are mammals that evolved from land based mammals to live in water,and in doing so gradually adapted to a more streamlined body suitable for swimming rather than walking.But the leg bones of the ancestors didn't fall off or go away,they were just absorbed into the soft tissue of the body.But they are still there.

The creationist answer is God did it.But this answer begs the question of why.Why create an animal from scratch that has never lived on land with leg bones hidden within it's body?

Does it really make more sense for creationists to look at an animal that breathes air with land based lungs even though it lives in water, is warm blooded when fish are cold blooded,and has leg bones like land based mammals,and decide that God made it this way for some weird reason rather than explore the possibility that it evolved to life in the water from an amphibious mammal?



iama: Someone is pulling someone's leg!


What makes sense is what The Bible states:


The strange tale of the leg on the whale


.




 


Hilarious.But sad,that there are people willing to take what creation.com says seriously.It doesn't say much for the reasoning capacity of their willingly duped readers.


 


What is even sadder is that readers of this stuff WANT to be lied to,so they can find some excuse to maintain their ignorance about science and evolution.

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2 years ago  ::  May 10, 2012 - 12:57AM #9
McAtheist
Posts: 8,077

iam: What makes sense is what The Bible states:


Not if you are talking facts, evidence and data; then, what the Bible states is very obviously wrong and has no explanatory/predictive powers at all ... which is why YECism has no more place in a science classroom than Greek mythology.


Thanks for playing.

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2 years ago  ::  May 10, 2012 - 10:13AM #10
MMarcoe
Posts: 16,219

May 9, 2012 -- 11:47PM, iamachildofhis wrote:


What makes sense is what The Bible states:





Then why are creationists changing their story every few decades?

There are three sides to every story: your side, my side, and the truth.

God is just a personification of reality, of pure objectivity.
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