| 1 year ago :: Apr 17, 2012 - 4:07PM #1 | |
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When thinking of cycles and myths, one cannot pass the idea of Kronos or Kali. That brought me to form some questions about the nature of time. Three definitions for time: a) Time is a measure of the change. Change is a result of the forces. Time as a relative yet real "thing" is confucing (I'm probably not only one in the world :-). Everything on universum seems to be in a movement. Atoms, cells, inner human organs are in constant change, earth rotates and orbits around sun. Sun orbits and rotates on galaxy, galaxy rotates and orbits or expands or moves on space. Maybe a huge unisystem (contra ecosystem) of galaxies are still moving as a group. Now because there is so much movement and forces, how come one can say, that time slows in moving objects or that it is something real, something more than change and movement and concept of human mind? It is told, that time is relative to gravity. What is the exact particle one measures and compares to the gravity then? Say our head is 72 inches above the ground. Time is slower on head than on toes. Does this mean that aging is different for different parts of the body, or that just atoms gets older, or that earth rotation compared to the sun is different for head and toes and so forth up to higher scale? Primitive natural way to understand time is to see the change of days and years. Think of time traveller who takes a trip in speed of light years and comes back and sees everything is 5 years older that his clock says. Of course trip itself brings up plenty of paradoxes in physical sense, but what I'm thinking is if travellers aging process got slower, or did planets and sun, maybe whole galaxy change their speed relative to traveller and people on earth? Or was it only the atomic clock that slowed down? I'm not sure if I'm able to to describe the problem I'm facing when trying to understand, what is really meant with special relativity theory. I quess its really something to do on atomic or quantum level and huge speeds, which brings me to question, if there is any real world usage with the theory? www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-... |
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| 1 year ago :: Apr 19, 2012 - 6:16PM #2 | |
another potential definition for time is as a kind of fourth spatial dimension, but which is constrained in ways the three we normally work in aren't. (although to be realistic the third spatial dimension, up and down, is also relatively constrained to us compared to the first two but the constraints seem more obvious and we've also learned to make devices to get around the constraints). If this definition were accurate I would presume that one description of the constraints in the temporal dimension are as if 'being carried downstream in a river flowing through a narrow gorge'. I don't know what the practical aspect of special relativity would be unless you are theorizing about the nature of the universe or designing thingamabobs around it or deep into esoteric meditations that are possibly lost to the modern world... because the relative speeds you need aren't naturally attainable at the gross level... |
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| 1 year ago :: Apr 22, 2012 - 8:06PM #3 | |
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Real world usage for the theory? Indeed. One of the daily ones is satnav location systems, whose signals have to be adjusted for time dilation in order to provide you with high accuracy. One major riddle about time is the nature of Now - no Now is found in any of our physics. I'm also unconvinced by the claim commonly met that the arrow of time is caused by entropy. Checking Wikipedia, I notice that examples in physics in which, it used to be said, t=0 have tended to be modified so that it doesn't. The speed of a tunneling particle is one. However the resolution of entangled particles is arguably still that way, though explained so as not to offend the Einsteinian rule that information can't be transfered faster than c. |
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| 1 year ago :: Apr 24, 2012 - 11:23PM #4 | |
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"Time" is "Events" ... If NOTHING "happens," no "Time" has "passed" ... |
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| 1 year ago :: Apr 25, 2012 - 12:57PM #5 | |
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The scientific questions in the OP can be answered easily enough. But the truth is, the smartest physicists is the world are still rather baffled by time. There are those who think that as theoretical physics progresses (if it progresses!) time will prove not to be a fundamental property of physical laws at all. Well, maybe. Also, it may be that it is we ourselves who greatly overplay the significance of time. This is because dealing with "time" is absolutely critical to consciousness. It is true, there is no "now" (or, rather, to conscious beings "now" is meaningless); everything we perceive is a succession of states which musty be processed by the brain into something coherent. Even something so simple as hearing a word is not simple at all; it is really a rapid succession of changes in frequency and amplitude which manifest themselves as changes in position of the microscopic hairs in the ear. The brain must make sense of these, somehow store each successive state in short-term memory until the entire word is spoken, then compare it with patterns in its long-term memory to make sense of it. Without being able to process these continual changes in perceptual states, there would be no consciousness. |
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| 1 year ago :: Apr 25, 2012 - 5:13PM #6 | |
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I suppose the concept of time only has significance to the observer that can appreciate it's passage. If we we're to suddenly vanish from the pages of history (ala "Life without People"), would time have any meaning to the rest of universe? I suppose it would if there were another species that evolves a conciousness worth caring about it. Curiouser (?) still is the concept of infinity... |
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| 1 year ago :: May 10, 2012 - 2:52AM #7 | |
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This topic is still on my interest, I'm constructing some more material. But since the word consciousness is raised here, which is very appropriate, I'm willing to start a new thread about it. Maybe it will produce some extra thoughts about time as well. Thanks for your replies already. :) |
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| 1 year ago :: May 12, 2012 - 7:34PM #8 | |
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Blu wrote: Real world usage for the theory? Indeed. One of the daily ones is satnav location systems, whose signals have to be adjusted for time dilation in order to provide you with high accuracy. Indeed, GPS. One major riddle about time is the nature of Now - no Now is found in any of our physics. I'm also unconvinced by the claim commonly met that the arrow of time is caused by entropy. Are you saying that time doesn't have an arrow? Then, why don't we remember the future as well as the past? Checking Wikipedia, I notice that examples in physics in which, it used to be said, t=0 have tended to be modified so that it doesn't. The speed of a tunneling particle is one. However the resolution of entangled particles is arguably still that way, though explained so as not to offend the Einsteinian rule that information can't be transfered faster than c. Entangled particles do not violate Einstein's rule that information can't be transfered faster than light. Entangled particles effect one another superceding the speed of light, but they cannot be used to code information superceding the speed of light (because of quantum nature of reality). sdp
The purpose of words is to convey ideas. When the ideas are grasped, the words are forgotten.
Where can I find a man who has forgotten words? He is the one I would like to talk to. The Way of Chuang Tzu by Thomas Merton A map is not the territory. Alfred Korzybski When supposedly skeptical atheists and scientists pick on monotheistic religion in books, speeches and debates, they are simply beating up a court jester in a clown crown. They think that by clobbering the clown of religion, they have overthrown the kingdom of transphysical reality, but such arguments cannot sway anyone established in the integrated, co-creative state, which is the serious reality underlying the circus of religion. Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything: The Enlightened Perspective, 57% |
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| 1 year ago :: May 12, 2012 - 8:26PM #9 | |
The purpose of words is to convey ideas. When the ideas are grasped, the words are forgotten.
Where can I find a man who has forgotten words? He is the one I would like to talk to. The Way of Chuang Tzu by Thomas Merton A map is not the territory. Alfred Korzybski When supposedly skeptical atheists and scientists pick on monotheistic religion in books, speeches and debates, they are simply beating up a court jester in a clown crown. They think that by clobbering the clown of religion, they have overthrown the kingdom of transphysical reality, but such arguments cannot sway anyone established in the integrated, co-creative state, which is the serious reality underlying the circus of religion. Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything: The Enlightened Perspective, 57% |
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| 1 year ago :: May 12, 2012 - 8:51PM #10 | |
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stardust Are you saying that time doesn't have an arrow? Then, why don't we remember the future as well as the past? Time indeed has an arrow. And we each experience a personal Now. But where is Now in our physics? That is, how do we show that any particular moment of the timeline is correctly called Now? Is Now a moment at all, or (as it subjectively seems) a process? |
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