Apr 15, 2012 -- 11:35AM, rsielin wrote:

Once you fall hook line and sinker for the falsehood that the Bible and all its scripture is inerrant and literal truth, you are forced into a life time of lies, distortions and misrepresentations.

Thus for creationism, it all begins with swallowing and then believing that first lie, and nothing can break those brainwashed shackles thereafter. They're doomed to a life of lies, misrepresentation, dishonesty and fakery for the remaining of their natural lives. 

As a Christian, I would agree.  The reason is that making the Bible "inerrant and literal truth" and the "Word of God" is bilioloatry.  In theological terms, it is worshipping a false idol.  So yes, once you start with that one lie, there are going to be others. 

"One of the fundamental principles of Christianity is that nothing is sacred. No thing. No part of creation is God. God is separate from the creation. Creation is only to be respected (made holy) as the handiwork of our God. It is never to be worshiped. This is why western civilization holds nothing sacred. Not king, not country, not flag, not clergy. This is the basis of our freedoms. The first ammendment rights are based on this idea. This is where the founding fathers got this stuff. Fundamentalist evangelicals violate this basic principle every time the put the printed Bible ahead of God, ahead of Christ, or ahead of the Holy Spirit. The belief in the infallability of the printed Bible may be the worst heresy to affect the church today."  www.newreformation.org/heresy3.htm

Francis Bacon called it back in 1620:

"For nothing is so mischievous as the apotheosis of error; and it is a very plague of the understanding for vanity to become the object of veneration. Yet in this vanity some of the moderns have with extreme levity indulged so far as to attempt to found a system of natural philosophy on the first chapter of Genesis, on the book of Job, and other parts of the sacred writings, seeking for the dead among the living; which also makes the inhibition and repression of it the more important, because from this unwholesome mixture of things human and divine there arises not only a fantastic philosophy [science] but also a heretical religion. Very meet it is therefore that we be sober-minded, and give to faith that only which is faith's."  Francis Bacon. Novum Organum  LXV, 1620  www.constitution.org/bacon/nov_org.htm

So yes, once you leave God and worship a false idol.  Once you ignore God in His Creation, yes, you are doomed to a life of lies.

lucaspa: So yes, once you leave God and worship a false idol.  Once you ignore God in His Creation, yes, you are doomed to a life of lies.

Thanks for reminding us tha YECism doesn't represent Christianity and in fact, isn't even really Christian.  It is unfortunately easy to forget the huge number of huge number of quietly rational theists in the flood of gibberish that comes from the YEC movement.

I think the key question here is: why fall for that initial falsehood hook line and sinker in the first place?  What is it in the makeup of our creationist friends that they are so gullible to this rather obvious falsehood.  

It doesn't have to be. One can still be a devout and thoughful Christian without being under the spell of this falsehood. A growing list of 12,000+ Christian clergy have attested to that fact. And they are the most learned and devout within the Christian community. What gives here?

If we could solve this problem, creationism could get fixed rather fast.

Any ideas?

iama

I will continue to call "goo to zoo to you" evolution a speculation, until I am presented with scientific evidence that all life-forms are reproductively related.

You know that's simply untrue.

You've been presented with evidence of all the aspects of evolution you've ever asked for.

And you've simply refused to read it.

You have no intention of understanding anything that might contradict your obsessive prejudices.

Apr 25, 2012 -- 12:21PM, iamachildofhis wrote:

iama:  I will continue to call "goo to zoo to you" evolution a speculation, until I am presented with scientific evidence that all life-forms are reproductively related. 

But by any honest person's reasoning, you have been amply presented with clear-cut, unmistakable, compelling and overwhelming empirical evidence that in fact all life-forms ARE reproductively related. Take off those blindfolds and quit denying the obvious. I

And most recently this addition to the long list of evidence, the new technology of genome sequencing now has mathematical proof positive that WITHOUT A DOUBT all life-forms are reproductively related. If you don't believe me you can read it for yourself right from the genomes.

You have no empirical evidence to credibly say otherwise.

Now what are you going to do, IAMA?  At best you can say you don't understand or personally just can't accept the implications of the evidence, but you really can't say its never been presented and still be honest with yourself.