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Switch to Forum Live View Floods are not the mechanism that produces fossils
2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 3:42PM #31
HouseofDavid
Posts: 603

Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:21PM, 57 wrote:

Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:19PM, HouseofDavid wrote:

Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:57PM, 57 wrote:

seems like my evo-friends are having a hard time.


Like, yeah.  Lets see, the flood sediments were soft enough to fold; but they were not so soft that they didn't slump into mush when they were lifted 29,035 in Tibet in the past 4,500 years, during which time no one cared to describe the process in their recorded history ?  Just how soft or hard were these sediments ?



You forgot...there were only 8 people alive when it happened.


..then again the book of Psalms mentions it.


ROTF...


So all this not quite hard-enough-to-be-a-rock sediment was uplifted Fantasia-like10,000, 20,000, even 29,035 feet in EVEN LESS than 4,500 years ( without slumping like a soft serve cone on a summer day), between population 8 and, say a few hundred thousand ?  That's why no one described it in their recorded history? In Tibet, the Middle East, the Alps, the Pyrenees, the Urals, the Andes, the Rockies.   ROTF. 


All this hand waving because you cannot plausibly answer Blu's question ?

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 5:21PM #32
Midutch
Posts: 4,173

Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:21PM, 57 wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:19PM, HouseofDavid wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:57PM, 57 wrote:

seems like my evo-friends are having a hard time.


Like, yeah.  Lets see, the flood sediments were soft enough to fold; but they were not so soft that they didn't slump into mush when they were lifted 29,035 in Tibet in the past 4,500 years, during which time no one cared to describe the process in their recorded history ?  Just how soft or hard were these sediments ?


You forgot...there were only 8 people alive when it happened.


..then again the book of Psalms mentions it.


So, we're supposed to take the word of your bronze age collection of goat herder myths, fables and fairy tales as evidence for the veracity of that very same book bronze age collection of goat herder myths, fables and fairy tales?


Really? And you don't see the idiocy of this?

"creationism" ... 2000+ years worth of ABYSMAL FAILURE ... and proud of it.
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:15PM #33
57
Posts: 22,662

Apr 15, 2012 -- 5:21PM, Midutch wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:21PM, 57 wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:19PM, HouseofDavid wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:57PM, 57 wrote:

seems like my evo-friends are having a hard time.


Like, yeah.  Lets see, the flood sediments were soft enough to fold; but they were not so soft that they didn't slump into mush when they were lifted 29,035 in Tibet in the past 4,500 years, during which time no one cared to describe the process in their recorded history ?  Just how soft or hard were these sediments ?


You forgot...there were only 8 people alive when it happened.


..then again the book of Psalms mentions it.


So, we're supposed to take the word of your bronze age collection of goat herder myths,


At this point I stopped reading your post.


fables and fairy tales as evidence for the veracity of that very same book bronze age collection of goat herder myths, fables and fairy tales?


Really? And you don't see the idiocy of this?





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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:16PM #34
57
Posts: 22,662

Why are you evos so scared of presenting an answer? 


If the earth was smooth...how high would the water be? 

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:26PM #35
steven_guy
Posts: 11,748

Apr 15, 2012 -- 6:16PM, 57 wrote:


Why are you evos so scared of presenting an answer? 


If the earth was smooth...how high would the water be? 




The earth never was smooth.


End of story.


What's an "evo"?

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:38PM #36
McAtheist
Posts: 8,077

57: If the earth was smooth...how high would the water be?


According to the Bible:  Genesis 7:19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered. 7:20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.


So either


1). the water was 15 cubits high (20-33 feet, depending on what definition of cubit you use) and covered "all the high hills" and "mountains" --- which means the authors of the Bible lied about what the world around them looked like since 33 feet does not a mountain make and that all those fossils in the flood layers of animals and plants from mountain terrain came from some other planet, because no such place existed on Earth pre-flood


or


2). the water was 15 cubits higher than the moutains, the heights of which are not in any way specified, but were of sufficient height to merit the word "mountain."


Of course, we already know that the whole Noah's flood never really happened; the physical evidence from the real world tells us so:


* If these sedimentary strata were all laid down by one event, they should be the same age --- and they aren't.  Erosion comparisons of the Appalachians and the Himalayas says the former is 7 times older than the latter.  And before you claim that the Appalachians just erode way faster, make sure you have a scientific explanation complete with supporting evidence for why that superfast erosion suddenly stopped when human observers came on the scene.


* The marine fossils in these various sedimentary layers are very different from each other: Himalayan fossils are typical of the Triassic,  the ones in the Appalachians are typical of the Paleozoic  and the ones found in places like Kansas (from the North American inland sea) are typical of the Cretaceous.  The age of the rock as suggested by these fossils correlates beautifully with the age of the rock as suggested by erosion.


* If the flood was really responsible for these sediments, then fluid dynamics dictates that the smaller creatures would sink slower than larger ones and thus should dominate the upper layers.  Instead, their fossils dominate the lower layers.


* There is no known process by which a year-long flood can produce areas like the Haymond beds in Texas, that had 15,000 alternating layers, meaning each one was laid down and lithified sufficiently not to mix with subsequent deposits once ever 10 minutes.


* YECism fails to explain the existence, part-way through these sedimentary layers (and thus partway through the flood) of: raindrop marks, river channels, dunes formed by wind, beaches, footprints, meteorite craters and coral reefs.


* Lithification to form limestone releases heat.  Given that there is about 5 X 1023 grams of limestone in these sediments and each gram released about 11,000 joules upon formation, then formation of the limestone would have released around 5 x 1027 joules of heat, sufficient to boil away the flood waters and parboil everything on the ark.


* And of course, there is the whole problem of how the fossil record is sorted; YECs have been unable to provide a single, reasonable explanation for why flying dinosaurs drowned before slow-moving mammals and why not a single human artifact is ever found in the lower layers of the fossil record.


How many different ways does the YEC "paradigm" have to utterly fail before you recognize that the whole thing is physically and scientifically impossible and is actually nothing more than a mix of very bad theology and pseudo-science nonsense?


Cool

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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:48PM #37
d_p_m
Posts: 9,835

Apr 15, 2012 -- 6:16PM, 57 wrote:


Why are you evos so scared of presenting an answer? 


If the earth was smooth...how high would the water be? 




If I didn't know better (and I don't, really) I'd think you don't have confidence in your own ability to calculate this for yourself.


Go ahead, show us your logic.

"If you aren't confused by quantum physics, you haven't really understood it."

― Niels Bohr


“Extinguished theologians lie about the cradle of every science as the strangled snakes beside that of Hercules; and history records that whenever science and orthodoxy have been fairly opposed, the latter has been forced to retire from the lists, bleeding and crushed if not annihilated; scotched, if not slain.”

― Thomas Henry Huxley, Lay Sermons, Addresses, and Reviews


“The science, the art, the jurisprudence, the chief political and social theories, of the modern world have grown out of Greece and Rome—not by favour of, but in the teeth of, the fundamental teachings of early Christianity, to which science, art, and any serious occupation with the things of this world were alike despicable.”

― Thomas Henry Huxley, Agnosticism and Christianity and Other Essays
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:55PM #38
Midutch
Posts: 4,173

Apr 15, 2012 -- 6:15PM, 57 wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 5:21PM, Midutch wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:21PM, 57 wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 3:19PM, HouseofDavid wrote:


Apr 15, 2012 -- 2:57PM, 57 wrote:

seems like my evo-friends are having a hard time.


Like, yeah.  Lets see, the flood sediments were soft enough to fold; but they were not so soft that they didn't slump into mush when they were lifted 29,035 in Tibet in the past 4,500 years, during which time no one cared to describe the process in their recorded history ?  Just how soft or hard were these sediments ?


You forgot...there were only 8 people alive when it happened.


..then again the book of Psalms mentions it.


So, we're supposed to take the word of your bronze age collection of goat herder myths,


At this point I stopped reading your post.


As if I care.


My posts are meant for everyone BUT you, since you have clearly demonstrated over the years that honesty, integrity, knowledge, science and reality are completely lost on you.


fables and fairy tales as evidence for the veracity of that very same book bronze age collection of goat herder myths, fables and fairy tales?


Really? And you don't see the idiocy of this?


 




"creationism" ... 2000+ years worth of ABYSMAL FAILURE ... and proud of it.
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 6:59PM #39
Midutch
Posts: 4,173

Apr 15, 2012 -- 6:16PM, 57 wrote:


Why are you evos so scared of presenting an answer? 


If the earth was smooth...how high would the water be? 


Why are you so scared of scientifically demonstrating that this was ever the case in the past 6000 years or so?


Or even demonstrating that the Earth's mountains were DRASTICALLY shorter than they are now in that time?


Or demonstrating that you have any real interest in science?


Or demonstrating that just making up wild and crazy BS is NOT the only thing you guys know how to do?

"creationism" ... 2000+ years worth of ABYSMAL FAILURE ... and proud of it.
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2 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 7:36PM #40
57
Posts: 22,662

My, My, My...why can't you evos answer the question? 


if the earth was smooth, how much water would cover the surface? 



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