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Switch to Forum Live View Speculative Mental/Spiritual Phenomena
4 years ago  ::  May 20, 2010 - 5:16PM #31
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

May 20, 2010 -- 5:13PM, Christianlib wrote:


Please be more specific as to "wild ones."


And BTW, it's late here in EDT zone.  I have to sign out now.  I'll check this thread early tomorrow.





So far you've accused me of being angry and that Jesus made Rome wipe out Judea.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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4 years ago  ::  May 20, 2010 - 7:40PM #32
Christianlib
Posts: 21,848

A) You DO sound pretty angry.


B) I said no such thing about Jesus making Rome destroy Jeruselem.  I asked if that'w what YOU meant by your comment that Jesus was personnaly responsible for all evil that befell the Jews after his death.  If that isn't what you meant, please clarify.  THAT was what I was asking.


 


And BTW, let me reiterate, through the centuries, there is much evil that can be laid at the feet of people who either claimed to follow Jesus, or totally screwed up how they read his message.  But, that is THEIR fault, not his.

Democrats think the glass is half full.
Republicans think the glass is theirs.
Libertarians want to break the glass, because they think a conspiracy created it.
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4 years ago  ::  May 20, 2010 - 8:27PM #33
Wendyness
Posts: 3,013

May 20, 2010 -- 3:45PM, Jcarlinbn wrote:


Thank you for sharing this experience with us.  It sounds to me like a powerful experience of a panentheist God.  (Everything is contained in and is a part of God.) My co-host of the Panentheist forum is a Christian Panentheist, and would, I am sure, appreciate your post.  Other panentheists might as well if you would be willing to post this on that forum.  Not that it isn't exactly what I hoped for on this thread, but it deserves a wider audience.  


jcbn


 







In Eastern thought some have called it the "Kundalini" (I do not practice yoga, and never have), others in the "Jungian" circles would call it the process of "individuation", those in the "Chiristian" circles would call it the "Holy Spirit", whatever one wants to call it matters not to me.  I can assure you it was an amazing, sensual, mind/heart expanding and mystical experience.  


 

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4 years ago  ::  May 20, 2010 - 8:57PM #34
Jcarlinbn
Posts: 7,028

Please do not make the common atheist mistake of conflating Jesus with Paul's Christ.  They are two entirely different Biblical characters.  Christianity has nothing at all to do with Jesus the charismatic preacher except for using his charisma.  I think if you stop reading the NT with the synoptics you will have quite a different picture of Jesus.  

May 20, 2010 -- 4:11PM, Yavanna wrote:

Not really. He created divisions and spawned thousands of years of hatred, discrimination and violence. He ripped apart families, communities and society as more and more came to believe in him. 




Jcarlinbn, community moderator
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4 years ago  ::  May 21, 2010 - 9:22AM #35
Christianlib
Posts: 21,848

J,


Thank you.  That is yet another way of stating my point about the "Historical Jesus" and the "Biblical Jesus."


As scholar Marcus Borg phrases it, in study, of the Canon and other sources, we actually find two entities, the "Pre-Easter Jesus", and the "Post-Easter Jesus."


 


BTW, it takes him book-length presentations to explain this, please don't anyone demand a "full explanation" of it here.  IF you care, pick up one of Borg's books. I suggest, "Meeting Jesus Again for the First Time."


If you don't care enough to read it, which is absolutely your right, then please don't feel free to try to bust my chops in an area in which you've done no study.

Democrats think the glass is half full.
Republicans think the glass is theirs.
Libertarians want to break the glass, because they think a conspiracy created it.
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4 years ago  ::  May 21, 2010 - 12:24PM #36
teilhard
Posts: 49,997

The Mystics are RIGHT ... There IS Only ONE ( Real ) "God" ...


You and I have that Friend in common ... !!!


May 20, 2010 -- 2:20PM, Wendyness wrote:


May 20, 2010 -- 11:52AM, teilhard wrote:


Sister Wendy -- You INDEED have been Blessed(+) and you ARE a Blessing ...

May 19, 2010 -- 10:03PM, Wendyness wrote:


 


 


I started meditating and praying daily, I started practicing "love thy neighbor" everyday, I felt immense gratitude for the beauty and sacredness of nature and life and in doing this, it forever change me. I call it the "green fuse", it was powerful.


 









I have always had a sense of knowing there is a God, I could sense God in nature but nothing I could define, so I would pray everyday, "I know you exist, but I really want to know you".  Be very careful what you pray for, it was not what I expected and it scared the crap out of me, it tore me to my bones, it ripped apart everything I had ever believed and had been taught about "Christianity".  My "love affair" with nature became immense, the beauty and power of nature overwhelmed me.  I felt love like I had never experienced before, it was if a veil had been lifted and I could glimpse the Universe (no drugs or alcohol involved, nor am I medicated for anything).  I have never felt such bliss and fear at once, I felt as if I had been "born again".  Just thinking about the experience brings tears to me eyes it was so beautiful and powerful.  Sex (with my husband) became "sacred" and "holy" and connected me deeply to life.   This experienced lasted a good 6 months and every single one of my friends was touched by this experience, they saw how it "transformed" me.





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4 years ago  ::  May 23, 2010 - 12:49AM #37
PosingAsMe
Posts: 193

May 20, 2010 -- 2:20PM, Wendyness wrote:


May 20, 2010 -- 11:52AM, teilhard wrote:


Sister Wendy -- You INDEED have been Blessed(+) and you ARE a Blessing ...

May 19, 2010 -- 10:03PM, Wendyness wrote:


 


 


I started meditating and praying daily, I started practicing "love thy neighbor" everyday, I felt immense gratitude for the beauty and sacredness of nature and life and in doing this, it forever change me. I call it the "green fuse", it was powerful.


 









I have always had a sense of knowing there is a God, I could sense God in nature but nothing I could define, so I would pray everyday, "I know you exist, but I really want to know you".  Be very careful what you pray for, it was not what I expected and it scared the crap out of me, it tore me to my bones, it ripped apart everything I had ever believed and had been taught about "Christianity".  My "love affair" with nature became immense, the beauty and power of nature overwhelmed me.  I felt love like I had never experienced before, it was if a veil had been lifted and I could glimpse the Universe (no drugs or alcohol involved, nor am I medicated for anything).  I have never felt such bliss and fear at once, I felt as if I had been "born again".  Just thinking about the experience brings tears to me eyes it was so beautiful and powerful.  Sex (with my husband) became "sacred" and "holy" and connected me deeply to life.   This experienced lasted a good 6 months and every single one of my friends was touched by this experience, they saw how it "transformed" me.




 


Good stuff.  We grok.  Reality is more important than (and quite independent of) our often incessant attempts to "explain" it.  To explain a thing is not the same as explaining it away.

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4 years ago  ::  May 28, 2010 - 1:39AM #38
iamachildofhis
Posts: 10,368

May 20, 2010 -- 4:11PM, Yavanna wrote:



May 20, 2010 -- 4:06PM, Christianlib wrote:



Yavanna: Fear is a vicious cycle.  It is the ultimate "dis-ease".




Christianlib: Which is why what Jesus did was HEAL people.  He didn't "cure" disease, he didn't "treat" patients as a physician would.  He healed.  He healed people, commuinities and societies.




Yavanna: Not really. He created divisions and spawned thousands of years of hatred, discrimination and violence. He ripped apart families, communities and society as more and more came to believe in him.




iama: You have it backward.


"Unbelieving people hate those who love the Lord Jesus Christ." - Woodrow Kroll


The Christian heart is characterized by a giving of self-type of love for others.


It is, therefore, the non-Christians who perpetrated the hatred, etc.


 


.

The wonder of Christmas is that the God Who dwelt among us, now, can dwell within us. - Roy Lessin
.
"Father, forgive them for they know not what they do."
.
Justice is receiving what you deserve.
Mercy is NOT receiving what you deserve.
Grace is receiving what you DO NOT deserve.
.
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4 years ago  ::  May 28, 2010 - 8:32AM #39
steven_guy
Posts: 11,739

May 28, 2010 -- 1:39AM, iamachildofhis wrote:


May 20, 2010 -- 4:11PM, Yavanna wrote:



May 20, 2010 -- 4:06PM, Christianlib wrote:



Yavanna: Fear is a vicious cycle.  It is the ultimate "dis-ease".




Christianlib: Which is why what Jesus did was HEAL people.  He didn't "cure" disease, he didn't "treat" patients as a physician would.  He healed.  He healed people, commuinities and societies.




Yavanna: Not really. He created divisions and spawned thousands of years of hatred, discrimination and violence. He ripped apart families, communities and society as more and more came to believe in him.




iama: You have it backward.


"Unbelieving people hate those who love the Lord Jesus Christ." - Woodrow Kroll


The Christian heart is characterized by a giving of self-type of love for others.


It is, therefore, the non-Christians who perpetrated the hatred, etc.




Yeah right.


So what were the Crusades, the Inquisition, various pogroms against Jews, the destruction of New World civilisations and the burning of witches all about?




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4 years ago  ::  May 28, 2010 - 10:20AM #40
teilhard
Posts: 49,997

Yes ...


To "explain" something is NOT the same thing as explaining it "away" ...


And SOMETIMES an "Understanding" has NOTHING necessarily to do with a given "Explanation" ...


May 23, 2010 -- 12:49AM, PosingAsMe wrote:


May 20, 2010 -- 2:20PM, Wendyness wrote:


May 20, 2010 -- 11:52AM, teilhard wrote:


Sister Wendy -- You INDEED have been Blessed(+) and you ARE a Blessing ...

May 19, 2010 -- 10:03PM, Wendyness wrote:


 


 


I started meditating and praying daily, I started practicing "love thy neighbor" everyday, I felt immense gratitude for the beauty and sacredness of nature and life and in doing this, it forever change me. I call it the "green fuse", it was powerful.


 









I have always had a sense of knowing there is a God, I could sense God in nature but nothing I could define, so I would pray everyday, "I know you exist, but I really want to know you".  Be very careful what you pray for, it was not what I expected and it scared the crap out of me, it tore me to my bones, it ripped apart everything I had ever believed and had been taught about "Christianity".  My "love affair" with nature became immense, the beauty and power of nature overwhelmed me.  I felt love like I had never experienced before, it was if a veil had been lifted and I could glimpse the Universe (no drugs or alcohol involved, nor am I medicated for anything).  I have never felt such bliss and fear at once, I felt as if I had been "born again".  Just thinking about the experience brings tears to me eyes it was so beautiful and powerful.  Sex (with my husband) became "sacred" and "holy" and connected me deeply to life.   This experienced lasted a good 6 months and every single one of my friends was touched by this experience, they saw how it "transformed" me.




 


Good stuff.  We grok.  Reality is more important than (and quite independent of) our often incessant attempts to "explain" it.  To explain a thing is not the same as explaining it away.





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