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Switch to Forum Live View Non-realism about God
5 years ago  ::  Mar 09, 2010 - 8:53PM #61
teilhard
Posts: 51,418

Mar 9, 2010 -- 7:36PM, caduceus wrote:


Mar 9, 2010 -- 7:13PM, Curious_Soul wrote:


That article is about 'depression'... not necessarily "mental problems" as a whole....depression IS a "mental problem" to quote you...... BUT not the same as what kw refered to as "mentally disturbed"...completely different me thinks
That sounds like an interesting read.... source?
And this ...
"Ok, leaving aside the content of your 'conversation'.....in what way did you communicate..what method...did you see a being....or tarot ..or just your intuition...can you expand more ?"
I heard a voice(outside my head) before myself so im not gonna be judgin ya



I can assure you that I'll loose no sleep after a post by KWinters. My sanity is available to be tested against hers or any other sceptic on the board at any time.


Namaste
AL


 



Be careful, though ... In The Old Soviet Union, People who rejected The Dogmatic Claims of Scientific Socialism ( Marxism-Leninism-Stalinism) were diagnosed as "Mentally Ill" and subjected to HORRIFIC "Treatments"  -- all for their own Good, of course, and that of Society as a Whole ...

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 09, 2010 - 11:17PM #62
Blü
Posts: 25,075

AL


I arranged an appointment between Brother Blu and a spirit being some  time ago, but Blu refused to agree to the simple terms. All he had to do  was to say OK, in line with the rules of free will.


Really?  You'd better remind me.


Was it a case where I had to imagine the spirit first before we could chat?  Or study yoghurt for twelve years?  How did it work?


 

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 7:06AM #63
caduceus
Posts: 1,274

Mar 9, 2010 -- 8:53PM, teilhard wrote:


Be careful, though ... In The Old Soviet Union, People who rejected The Dogmatic Claims of Scientific Socialism ( Marxism-Leninism-Stalinism) were diagnosed as "Mentally Ill" and subjected to HORRIFIC "Treatments"  -- all for their own Good, of course, and that of Society as a Whole ...




Yes, it's amazing the lengths (and depths)  that some will go to impose their ideology on others. Pregnant girls were committed to mental institutions here in the UK right up until the 1950's, so I'm told.
There's a program about Bedlam coming up on TV that I must watch.
namaste
AL

“We live at the level of our language. Whatever we can articulate we can imagine or explore. All you have to do to educate a child is leave him alone and teach him to read. The rest is brainwashing.”
Ellen Gilcrist
Visit my website
www.n-atlantis.com
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 7:21AM #64
caduceus
Posts: 1,274

Mar 9, 2010 -- 8:46PM, Ken wrote:


Mar 9, 2010 -- 7:36PM, caduceus wrote:

I also often see spirit beings in energy form and journey to other places during meditation.  



He thinks he's been to Jupiter.




That's true.
Annie Besant, CW Leadbeater and John Keely all saw the structure of the atom before the official atomic theory and Francis Crick saw the molecular structure of nucleic acids by means that are also used by some psychics.
It seems that the occult has been ahead of science on many occasions.
Namaste
AL

“We live at the level of our language. Whatever we can articulate we can imagine or explore. All you have to do to educate a child is leave him alone and teach him to read. The rest is brainwashing.”
Ellen Gilcrist
Visit my website
www.n-atlantis.com
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 11:57AM #65
Ken
Posts: 33,859

Mar 10, 2010 -- 7:21AM, caduceus wrote:


Mar 9, 2010 -- 8:46PM, Ken wrote:

He thinks he's been to Jupiter.




That's true.


If you've actually been there, prove it.


Annie Besant, CW Leadbeater and John Keely all saw the structure of the atom before the official atomic theory


Nonsense. Here are some drawings of atoms that Besant and Leadbeater published in 1909.



1. Iron  2. Lithium  3. Helium  4. Neon


They look nothing at all like the atomic structures that have been determined and confirmed by modern science.


www.chem.yale.edu/~chem125/125/history99... 

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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 12:21PM #66
Kwinters
Posts: 22,169

Mar 9, 2010 -- 12:15PM, Jcarlinbn wrote:


Mar 9, 2010 -- 10:53AM, Kwinters wrote:

Sure, we can all talk and answer with voices in our heads.


However, only the mentally disturbed think those voices are something other than their own invention and imagination.


If you do, perhaps tin-foil hats are in order. 


You are getting into the area of disproving God here.  Until you can prove those voices are not communication with some external entity, usually God, your diagnosis of mental illness is intellectually challenged to say the least.  You may believe there is no God there, but that is a belief statement, not a reasoned evaluation until you can provide evidence that your belief is any way different from the belief that one is speaking with God.  


 






Eh? That's not how things work.


Do you have evidence of some outside entity manipulating brain cells in order to produce speech patterns?


 

Jesus had two dads, and he turned out alright.~ Andy Gussert

“Feminism has fought no wars. It has killed no opponents. It has set up no concentration camps, starved no enemies, practiced no cruelties. Its battles have been for education, for the vote, for better working conditions…for safety on the streets…for child care, for social welfare…for rape crisis centers, women’s refuges, reforms in the law.

If someone says, “Oh, I’m not a feminist,” I ask, “Why, what’s your problem?”

Dale Spender
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 12:27PM #67
Kwinters
Posts: 22,169

Mar 9, 2010 -- 3:59PM, Jcarlinbn wrote:


Mar 9, 2010 -- 12:35PM, Ken wrote:

 Come now. When somebody says "I chatted with a spirit being today," a rational person knows what to think. 


I know many rational theists who would also know what to think. Perhaps you can provide us with a rational answer complete with clear logically impeccable premises using airtight logic to get to your conclusion.  






Yeah, it's called creating a model in your head.


Authors do it all the time.  The invent people, give them backgrounds, motivations and then let that person 'talk'.


 


Like this:


'...My attitude as I write reflects my respect for my characters’ independence. I never say to myself, “Now, I need her to do this.” Instead, I say, “What will she do now? Among the possible choices, I need to work toward this direction.” The actions of the character need to make sense. Even if they are irrational actions, they need to be “in character”—consistent with how that character is put together psychologically.

Occasionally, I have thought out the broad plot of a manuscript before I have gotten to know my characters that well, and I have found a character unable to accept the course of action that my plot demands. In Close Kin, for example, one character is assigned to marry another, and it is important for my plot that he do so. It never occurred to me that the character might not want to do this because he is ordinarily obedient to commands, and he knows that such a marriage is very prestigious. But I also made this character very nice: he has a hard time distressing people. When he finds out that his partner deeply deplores the marriage, he is thrown into real turmoil. I was writing this section one morning and thinking, “What will my character say in response to that?” And I was quite disturbed when he blurted out, “I can’t marry you!”...'


 


www.claredunkle.com/Design/writecharacte...


 


 


Authors understand the voices are fictions.  I guess some people delude themselves into thinking they are communicating with some mystical being.


I wonder, can they get the mystical being to say things like the rain in Spain stays mainly in the plain?


 

Jesus had two dads, and he turned out alright.~ Andy Gussert

“Feminism has fought no wars. It has killed no opponents. It has set up no concentration camps, starved no enemies, practiced no cruelties. Its battles have been for education, for the vote, for better working conditions…for safety on the streets…for child care, for social welfare…for rape crisis centers, women’s refuges, reforms in the law.

If someone says, “Oh, I’m not a feminist,” I ask, “Why, what’s your problem?”

Dale Spender
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 12:28PM #68
Kwinters
Posts: 22,169

Mar 9, 2010 -- 6:45PM, caduceus wrote:



Post #30
My message involved myself and my wife moving house, something I'm sure you are not interested in. If you want a personal reading for yourself I would be glad to do you one by PM.

Science, having instilled the idea that we are purposeless biological machines, living in an accidental universe takes no responsibility for the obvious psychological implications of someone taking it seriously.
Namaste
AL



I already posted about the contents of the communication and obviously some don't read the posts. The spirit that answered was not god, there are others.

Mar 9, 2010 -- 10:53AM, Kwinters wrote:



Sure, we can all talk and answer with voices in our heads.

However, only the mentally disturbed think those voices are something other than their own invention and imagination.

If you do, perhaps tin-foil hats are in order.



I find this post a little strange as only a day or so ago I looking for info for someone else and came upon this link:
www.upliftprogram.com/depression_stats.h...
If anyone cares to search the somewhat extensive archives they will find that scientific studies have found the those who are spiritually inclined are less likely to suffer from mental problems than the rest of the population and the stronger the belief the less likely, somewhat at odds with the post.
On the other hand, I used to read the web pages of a psychiatrist who specialised in treating science undergraduates who had lost their sense of identity due to the materialist nature of science.

KWinters, one atheist vicar does not cancell reality.

Namaste
AL






 


None of that has anything to do with the fact that the voices you 'hear' in your head are your own...

Jesus had two dads, and he turned out alright.~ Andy Gussert

“Feminism has fought no wars. It has killed no opponents. It has set up no concentration camps, starved no enemies, practiced no cruelties. Its battles have been for education, for the vote, for better working conditions…for safety on the streets…for child care, for social welfare…for rape crisis centers, women’s refuges, reforms in the law.

If someone says, “Oh, I’m not a feminist,” I ask, “Why, what’s your problem?”

Dale Spender
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 12:33PM #69
Kwinters
Posts: 22,169

'...Psychologists have launched a study to find out why some people who hear voices in their head consider it a positive experience while others find it distressing...'


www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/09/06...


 


HEARING VOICES
The phenomenon of hearing voices might not be as unusual as we think, and many people even live quite happily with the voices they hear.  Sometimes the voices have helpful advice, or words of encouragement to offer. But where do the voices come from?  Might they be the sound of society itself?
Dr Julie Kirby, senior Lecturer at Edge Hill University talks about her research study of over sixty people who live with voice hearing.


www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/factual/thinkingall...

Jesus had two dads, and he turned out alright.~ Andy Gussert

“Feminism has fought no wars. It has killed no opponents. It has set up no concentration camps, starved no enemies, practiced no cruelties. Its battles have been for education, for the vote, for better working conditions…for safety on the streets…for child care, for social welfare…for rape crisis centers, women’s refuges, reforms in the law.

If someone says, “Oh, I’m not a feminist,” I ask, “Why, what’s your problem?”

Dale Spender
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5 years ago  ::  Mar 10, 2010 - 2:11PM #70
teilhard
Posts: 51,418

Mar 9, 2010 -- 11:17PM, Blü wrote:


AL


I arranged an appointment between Brother Blu and a spirit being some time ago, but Blu refused to agree to the simple terms. All he had to do was to say OK, in line with the rules of free will.


Really?  You'd better remind me.


Was it a case where I had to imagine the spirit first before we could chat?  Or study yoghurt for twelve years?  How did it work?


 



I'm sure that Reflexive Mocking and Scoffing are VERY Inviting ...

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