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Switch to Forum Live View South Dakota's new abortion law
4 years ago  ::  Mar 04, 2011 - 3:37PM #51
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:33PM, TPaine wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 2:07PM, Erey wrote:


Not to mention men taking off after they have become pregnant.  Also, men can have their lives change.  Often when a woman chooses she chooses to carry the pregnancy to term.  That can mean for the man his life will never be the same.  He will either have to live with the fact that he abandoned his own child or has his wages garnished or will have to raise a child with a woman that he might not share the same values with.  Then the woman might marry another man who will have his influence on the child.


Looking at 85+ percent of unwanted pregnancies arising from the complete lack of BC or the knowingly incorrect usage of BC then I believe we have the makings for a enlightenment campaign to address that very high figure and bring it down.


There will always be accidents even with the the most carefull people, one that sliped past the goalie.  But those are the miniority of unwanted preganancies.  Most unwanted pregnancies are preventable and that is where the focus should be in reducing abortions.



Erey, I agree with you. I think is is vitally important to teach safe sex and methods of contraception in schools since there are too many parents who for one reason or another do not explain either to their children. It goes without saying that lowering the number of unwanted pregnancies will lower the number of abortions.




I don't think anyone would argue with that. The fact remains that abortion is legal and must remain legal for medical neccessity.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 04, 2011 - 3:41PM #52
Fodaoson
Posts: 11,156

Mar 4, 2011 -- 6:37AM, costrel wrote:


Mar 3, 2011 -- 9:02PM, REteach wrote:

Mar 3, 2011 -- 6:23PM, costrel wrote:

The Catholics generally don't accept birth control


Actually, about 85% of Catholics ignore official teaching on birth control.  I got married as a college student in SD and got my contraception from the local planned parenthood. 


And now South Dakotans can easily buy condoms at Wal-Mart in the larger communities (and at truck stops along the Interstate). That doesn't mean that they approve of the use of condoms and other forms of birth control.





When I was teenagers condoms( then usually called rubbers )  had printed on the  dispensing machine  and the container  “For use for the  prevention of disease only” . I wonder how many of the youth of that period then began to associate pregnancy with disease?  After all that was then main concern of those who used them. 


 

“I seldom make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions I have no respect.” Edward Gibbon
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 04, 2011 - 3:46PM #53
TPaine
Posts: 9,376

Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:37PM, Yavanna wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:33PM, TPaine wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 2:07PM, Erey wrote:


Not to mention men taking off after they have become pregnant.  Also, men can have their lives change.  Often when a woman chooses she chooses to carry the pregnancy to term.  That can mean for the man his life will never be the same.  He will either have to live with the fact that he abandoned his own child or has his wages garnished or will have to raise a child with a woman that he might not share the same values with.  Then the woman might marry another man who will have his influence on the child.


Looking at 85+ percent of unwanted pregnancies arising from the complete lack of BC or the knowingly incorrect usage of BC then I believe we have the makings for a enlightenment campaign to address that very high figure and bring it down.


There will always be accidents even with the the most carefull people, one that sliped past the goalie.  But those are the miniority of unwanted preganancies.  Most unwanted pregnancies are preventable and that is where the focus should be in reducing abortions.



Erey, I agree with you. I think is is vitally important to teach safe sex and methods of contraception in schools since there are too many parents who for one reason or another do not explain either to their children. It goes without saying that lowering the number of unwanted pregnancies will lower the number of abortions.



I don't think anyone would argue with that. The fact remains that abortion is legal and must remain legal for medical neccessity.



I also agree with that. The government has no business in the room with the Doctor and his/her patient. The decision should be between the two of them. I also don't believe a representative of an anti-choice group should have a part in the decision either, which is what the proposed South Dakota bill would require.

"The genius of the Constitution rests not in any static meaning it might have had in a world that is dead and gone, but in the adaptability of its great principles to cope with current problems and current needs." -- Justice William Brennan: Speech to the Text and Teaching Symposium at Georgetown University (October 12, 1985)
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 04, 2011 - 3:49PM #54
Yavanna
Posts: 3,149

Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:46PM, TPaine wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:37PM, Yavanna wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:33PM, TPaine wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 2:07PM, Erey wrote:


Not to mention men taking off after they have become pregnant.  Also, men can have their lives change.  Often when a woman chooses she chooses to carry the pregnancy to term.  That can mean for the man his life will never be the same.  He will either have to live with the fact that he abandoned his own child or has his wages garnished or will have to raise a child with a woman that he might not share the same values with.  Then the woman might marry another man who will have his influence on the child.


Looking at 85+ percent of unwanted pregnancies arising from the complete lack of BC or the knowingly incorrect usage of BC then I believe we have the makings for a enlightenment campaign to address that very high figure and bring it down.


There will always be accidents even with the the most carefull people, one that sliped past the goalie.  But those are the miniority of unwanted preganancies.  Most unwanted pregnancies are preventable and that is where the focus should be in reducing abortions.



Erey, I agree with you. I think is is vitally important to teach safe sex and methods of contraception in schools since there are too many parents who for one reason or another do not explain either to their children. It goes without saying that lowering the number of unwanted pregnancies will lower the number of abortions.



I don't think anyone would argue with that. The fact remains that abortion is legal and must remain legal for medical neccessity.



I also agree with that. The government has no business in the room with the Doctor and his/her patient. The decision should be between the two of them. I also don't believe a representative of an anti-choice group should have a part in the decision either, which is what the proposed South Dakota bill would require.




Certainly not, the bill itself is a violation of patient privacy laws. This is an illegal action by the South Dakota officials.

The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells
In places deep, where dark things sleep,
In hollow halls beneath the fells.

For ancient king and elvish lord
There many a gloaming golden hoard
They shaped and wrought, and light they caught
To hide in gems on hilt of sword.
- J.R.R. Tolkien
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 04, 2011 - 5:33PM #55
Erey
Posts: 18,862

Mar 4, 2011 -- 3:33PM, TPaine wrote:


Mar 4, 2011 -- 2:07PM, Erey wrote:


Not to mention men taking off after they have become pregnant.  Also, men can have their lives change.  Often when a woman chooses she chooses to carry the pregnancy to term.  That can mean for the man his life will never be the same.  He will either have to live with the fact that he abandoned his own child or has his wages garnished or will have to raise a child with a woman that he might not share the same values with.  Then the woman might marry another man who will have his influence on the child.


Looking at 85+ percent of unwanted pregnancies arising from the complete lack of BC or the knowingly incorrect usage of BC then I believe we have the makings for a enlightenment campaign to address that very high figure and bring it down.


There will always be accidents even with the the most carefull people, one that sliped past the goalie.  But those are the miniority of unwanted preganancies.  Most unwanted pregnancies are preventable and that is where the focus should be in reducing abortions.



Erey, I agree with you. I think is is vitally important to teach safe sex and methods of contraception in schools since there are too many parents who for one reason or another do not explain either to their children. It goes without saying that lowering the number of unwanted pregnancies will lower the number of abortions.





That is true but I think we over-estimate the ability teenagers and young adults have to actually be responsible sexualy.  When I worked in a HS in the 90's it was the hay-day of the AIDS epidemic and there were condoms everywhere the condoms flowed thick and freely.  There were condom demostrations in the classrooms.  Not to mention the school was walkng distance from a free clinic where a young woman could get other forms of BC like the pill for little or even no cost.  We still had a terrible problem with teen pregnancy.


First, those girls were not unhappy being pregnant as it was part of thier culture and Second, they just did not like the idea of thinking ahead, thinking ahead is a drag.  My own sister got pregnant in her middle 30's and became a single mother because she just did not have any contraception handy.  I think she was probably 35 years old!  I love my niece but that pregnancy was the catalyst for alot of far reaching problems. 


People like to play fast and loose with their lives, don't mind bumbling through life and having all kinds of "accidents". 


I don't think we ever connect the dots for people and show them how wisely choosing your sex partners is important to physical and emotional health (forget about STDs deal with being in abusive relationships is just as bad)  and how careful birth control is the moral thing for any potential children.  The campaign might read something like "all children deserve to be planned and wanted".    That would be very sensitive.  Myself, I was using BC but still got pregnant with my son.  I would not have chosen pregnancy at that time. 

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 11, 2011 - 10:12PM #56
rangerken
Posts: 16,408

This thread was moved from the Hot Topics Zone

Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
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4 years ago  ::  Mar 12, 2011 - 11:20AM #57
Bodean
Posts: 9,558

The process should not be focused on the woman ...a woman has a right to choose ... but when it comes to the "procedure" itself, this can be regulated.


Why do you people HATE informing women with regards to this issue!


None of you are looking at what the law states, you only see your blind political b.s. opinion in it.  What's wrong with making sure that the woman is not being coersed by a partner or parent to have the procedure??  What is wrong with making sure that a woman is informed about all the possible risk, both physical and emotional regarding abortion?


While abortion does not qualify as "heatlhcare", IMO, unless the decision is initiated by the doctor for a specific medical need, it, as all procedure, requires verfification and justification for the act.


If a woman elects to have breast augmentation, she does not just walk in and request a new pair.  No ... she has to sit down for a consult, discuss all the risk, etc ... then schedules an appointment for the surgery.


I see no difference in this law and the scenario above, with the exeption of one added step, to ensure that the woman is not being coersed by another party.

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4 years ago  ::  Mar 12, 2011 - 9:39PM #58
Find1Answer
Posts: 7,284

Mar 4, 2011 -- 12:27AM, Yavanna wrote:

Mar 3, 2011 -- 11:53PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Mar 3, 2011 -- 11:59AM, mountain_man wrote:


Mar 3, 2011 -- 11:11AM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Don't forget the other half of the formula -- teaching young men to take responsiblity for their actions,....


By choosing to either continue with the pregnancy or have it ended early IS taking responsibility for their actions. Just because you disapprove of their decision does not mean they are not taking responsibility.





I'm talking about men not knocking a woman up and then running away.


THat's what I disapprove of. Unless you think it's cool for a guy to get laid, get the woman pregnant and then totally disown the deed. If so, you have one sorry-assed view of manhood.


In many cases -- including some I know of personally -- the woman would not have been in the posistion where she felt she had to consider an abortion as an option if the man hadn't just ran away and dissappeared, thereby absolving himself of any responsibility in the matter.


Anyway, that's what I was talking about.


 


 




Actually she wouldn't be in that position if she hadn't gotten herself pregnant. I've always loved how the blame goes to the men in these cases.


I can't believe the women get the blame in these cases.   afterall it is the male that is shooting live ammo.    it is not the women who got themselves pregnant it is the male that got the women pregnant.     if the male does not desire a pregnancy then the male should be more responsible with their sperm.    Folks act like birth control is a no brainer when in fact birth control is a woman taking synthetic hormones into her system which can cause much havoc to her body.     Many women simply cannot take synthetic hormones or wish to perforate their uteruses with weird pieces of copper wiring.     

Bush's "de-Bathification program" eliminated all vestiges of Sunni power in Iraqi society and set the stage for the Sunni insurrection against American occupation and the new Shiite-led government. Bush disbanded the entire Sunni-dominated Iraqi Army and bureaucracy. He didn't change it. He didn't make it more inclusive of Shiites and Kurds. He just disbanded it. It is no accident that two of the top commanders of today's ISIL are former commanders in the Saddam-era Iraqi military.
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3 years ago  ::  Jun 25, 2011 - 1:11PM #59
watcher59
Posts: 1,606

Mar 2, 2011 -- 9:50PM, solfeggio wrote:

The South Dakota Senate has backed and sent to the governer a bill requiring women to follow various procedures before they can have an abortion:


Reading through the various provisions of this bill, it would seem that it infringes upon a woman's rights as stated in the 9th Amendment.




But coercing women to have abortions or submit to sterilization isn't? Planned Parenthood behaves like a tool for the ongoing "Progressive" eugenics campaign. Like most Progressive propaganda it's wrapped in pretty words like women's reproductive rights. But, no matter how prettily packaged, a bucket of BS still stinks.

How strangely will the Tools of a Tyrant pervert the plain Meaning of Words!
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3 years ago  ::  Jun 25, 2011 - 4:39PM #60
Mmichael
Posts: 157

Jun 25, 2011 -- 1:11PM, watcher59 wrote:


Mar 2, 2011 -- 9:50PM, solfeggio wrote:

The South Dakota Senate has backed and sent to the governer a bill requiring women to follow various procedures before they can have an abortion:


Reading through the various provisions of this bill, it would seem that it infringes upon a woman's rights as stated in the 9th Amendment.




But coercing women to have abortions or submit to sterilization isn't? Planned Parenthood behaves like a tool for the ongoing "Progressive" eugenics campaign. Like most Progressive propaganda it's wrapped in pretty words like women's reproductive rights. But, no matter how prettily packaged, a bucket of BS still stinks.





And, your proof and evidence that Planned Parenthood is "coercing women to have abortions or submit to sterilization"??? None. You clearly think women are naive, simple-minded, uneducated, child-like souls who aren't intelligent enough to "know what's good for them!", to "know what they really need and want!", or to be able to determine their own fates and destinies without some Wise (and probably Godly, and probably Male) Person telling them "what's best for them".


Women telephone Planned Parenthood to make appointments. They drive themselves to Planned Parenthood to discuss options. They talk. They listen. They think. They decide. They choose. And, if someone tries to "coerce" them into something or even succeeds in "coercing" them into something they did not want, they are smart enough to know they have been wronged and courageous enough to file a complaint about the jerk who "coerced" them. Planned Parenthood knows women are No Less Intelligent than men are when it comes to making personal and sometimes tough decisions about their bodies, their health, and their lives. Planned Parenthood Trusts Women.

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