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Switch to Forum Live View Vasectomies, Tubal ligation and religion/faith/God (moral or wrong)
5 years ago  ::  May 18, 2009 - 5:47PM #1
Godgirl
Posts: 973

What do Mormons, Muslims, Catholics, Conservative Protestant Christians, Bahia`s and etc, think about vasectomies and tubal ligation. In your opinion and your religious background...it is more moral than getting an abortion? Is it "playing God?" Is it more moral than other birth control methods or the same? Howdoes your holy book, God or religious faith determine what you think is the morality of this decision? Is it more or less moral if the couple already has kids or doesn't have kids? What about it a single adult makes this decision for him or herself? Is this something your faith teaches if you do you will burn in hell for doing? 

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5 years ago  ::  May 18, 2009 - 6:09PM #2
Tmarie64
Posts: 5,277

The Catholic church preaches that ALL artificial birth control is a SIN, WRONG.


They have this idea that a couple can't love each other completely and are, in some way, cheating on each other.


As to what Catholics believe... I'd venture to say that many, MANY of them believe that it takes more to show your love and connection and loyalty than squirting out kids.  I know I believe that my marriage is not JUST for making babies.

James Thurber - "It is better to know some of the questions than all of the answers."
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5 years ago  ::  May 18, 2009 - 6:15PM #3
mountain_man
Posts: 39,756

I'm an Atheist. I have no religious background, nor any religion.


All forms of birth control must be voluntary and all should have unrestricted access to them. The right to procreate is a personal choice. One should not be force into, or out of, the decision they make for themself.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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5 years ago  ::  May 19, 2009 - 2:24PM #4
MysticWanderer
Posts: 1,328

Speaking as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints the Church permits all forms of birth control and sterilization.  The Church feels that family size should be determined by the parents in according with their ability provide for their children.  Of course we see children as a blessing from Heavenly Father but too many defeat the purpose of parenting which is to raise children properly not in poverty and deprivation.  That being said the Church opposes abortion as the killing of a human being and the deprivation of a mortal existence. 

"Not all who wander are lost" J.R.R.Tolkein
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. ~Anne Lamott
"Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain."
Friedrich von Schiller
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5 years ago  ::  May 19, 2009 - 5:16PM #5
mountain_man
Posts: 39,756

May 19, 2009 -- 2:24PM, MysticWanderer wrote:


...That being said the Church opposes abortion as the killing of a human being and the deprivation of a mortal existence. 




All very nice. They have a right to believe that and a right to preach it in their churches. What they, and other christian sects, do not have is the right to force their religious beliefs on others.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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5 years ago  ::  May 20, 2009 - 12:53PM #6
MysticWanderer
Posts: 1,328

May 19, 2009 -- 5:16PM, mountain_man wrote:


May 19, 2009 -- 2:24PM, MysticWanderer wrote:


...That being said the Church opposes abortion as the killing of a human being and the deprivation of a mortal existence. 




All very nice. They have a right to believe that and a right to preach it in their churches. What they, and other christian sects, do not have is the right to force their religious beliefs on others.




Nor did I ever suggest anything otherwise.  The request was for how the Church taught on these subjects.  I remain Pro Choice on a legal issue while I personally am opposed to abortion.  the way to prevent abortion is through education and birth control not legislation.

"Not all who wander are lost" J.R.R.Tolkein
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. ~Anne Lamott
"Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain."
Friedrich von Schiller
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5 years ago  ::  May 26, 2009 - 10:38PM #7
Dreamweever2
Posts: 733

My third child was born by c-section. Since I was already in surgery, and now had 3 children, I chose to have my tubes tied. Fortunately I was in a hospital that allowed the procedure to be done. I knew what my financial situation was, and I knew that to adequately provide for the kids I had, my 3 were plenty. I love each one of them dearly, and am grateful to have them. I could not be involved in a religion that dictated to me man made rules about such matters. Birth control, to the best of my knowledge, was not an option back when biblical teachings were taught, so how could they have been addressed with cut and dry answers for the options we have today? Also, pregnancies have sometimes happened following those procedures, and to people who are on the pill, or use other forms of birth control. What is meant to happen will happen.

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5 years ago  ::  May 26, 2009 - 11:35PM #8
Marysara722
Posts: 2,550

May 26, 2009 -- 10:38PM, Dreamweever2 wrote:

My third child was born by c-section. Since I was already in surgery, and now had 3 children, I chose to have my tubes tied. Fortunately I was in a hospital that allowed the procedure to be done.



Yes, it was fortunate for you that you were in such a hospital at the time.
Yet had you been in a Catholic hospital, you would have been subjected to "their" rules which meant that you wouldn't have been granted permission to have a tubal and the attending doctor would just have to comply with the rules.  You would have had to make a choice to have the procedure done elsewhere and it would have required you to undergo another surgical procedure that would have put you through taking another risk to your health and/or life. 
Any time one experiences any kind of surgery, it's not a risk-free walk-in-the-park.  But hey, "they" got to hold to "their" rules right.


DW << Birth control, to the best of my knowledge, was not an option back when biblical teachings were taught, so how could they have been addressed with cut and dry answers for the options we have today?


To the contrary Dreamw, birth control goes back to ancient times and all the way up to the present day.
Here's a link to an excellent & very informative essay on the history behind birth control.


The History of Birth Control
by Kathleen London

www.yale.edu/ynhti/curriculum/units/1982...



*Hope the link works* Surprised

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5 years ago  ::  May 27, 2009 - 9:58AM #9
karbie
Posts: 3,329

I was raised Episcopalian, and I don't remember anyone preaching against birth control. The sermons were more to do with the Biblical lessons for the day or what changes were going on in the world. I actually don't remember a SINGLE sermon telling the congregation they would be going straight to HELL. I was in the girl's choir, so I heard years worth of sermons about trying to help others less fortunate than we were. I'm not claiming this for the whole religion. We were taught that there were as many paths to God as there were devout believers. Most of the clergy had between 3-6 children in their families. We were even told God didn't care if we had money to give or not because giving time and service in things like teaching Sunday School was just as important.


  My aunt had a tubal litigation after the birth of their 4th child. (Her IUD came out one morning and she turned out to be 1 month pregnant at the time.)  If you are sure that you have all the family you can provide for or want, I think vasectomies and tubal litigation are the surest ways to keep from having "surprises". ANY kind of birth control that works is a better option than an abortion. I'm PC because I don't think it is something the government should be involved in when they have more than enough intrusions into our privacy as it is. Being PC doesn't keep me from believing the best course of action is reducing the amount of unwanted pregnancies in the first place. I think the "morning after" pill should automatically be offered to a victim of rape, although I realize that isn't likely to happen in a Catholic hospital.


Surprisingly enough to some of you--I think that the pharmacists who refuse to fill prescriptions for birth control pills and/or the morning after pill because it's "against their religion" do more harm than good. They have every right to their moral and religious beliefs, but not to impose them on customers with valid prescriptions during their working hours. I think it is hypocritical to be against abortions and then thwart someone doing their best to not need one.


During Biblical times, women were chattel. People would have had some understanding of birth control just from watching their animals. Even today they tied chalk bags on the rams so they can easily tell how many ewes will probably have lambs in the Spring and I would expect that it is a very old practice. Women were bartered for livestock  and still are in some areas of the world today. The idea then was to have as many children (sons) as possible to be sure that some survived into adulthood. If your wife died in childbirth, you just got a new one. Most of my ancestors were the children of the second or third wife.


I just don't think it is moral for me to pass judgement on any  other person's choices when I have no idea what their reasons are. There's a local family with 16 kids and one with 20--they both said that they just "took what God gave them." In my view, God sent me birth control so that I could take proper care of the child I give thanks for every day.

"You are letting your opinion be colored by facts again."
'When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you."
these are both from my father.
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5 years ago  ::  Jun 05, 2009 - 6:46PM #10
bluehorserunning
Posts: 1,754

...had you been in a Catholic hospital, you would have been subjected to "their" rules which meant that you wouldn't have been granted permission to have a tubal and the attending doctor would just have to comply with the rules.


That is not accurate.  I work at a Catholic hospital, and the Ob-Gyns do perform tubals on planned c-sections.  They have to fill out a form certifying that they believe the tubal to be 'medically necessary,' but they are pretty free-and-loose with their interpretations of 'medical necessity.'  I don't know of anyone who has been denied a tubal who has asked for one beforehand.  

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