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Switch to Forum Live View Obama Declares Support for Same Sex Marriage
2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 1:54PM #61
TemplarS
Posts: 6,693

Perhaps, Marcion.


Though I'm not convinced.  It is true that  polls show Americans favor same-sex marriage by a small margin.


But I suspect the passion is greater among those who oppose this.  IOW, I think there are more on the right who are going to make sure they get out and vote for someone who opposes gay marriage than there are on the left who are going to make sure they get out and vote for someone who favors it.


I guess we will see.

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 2:25PM #62
Ebon
Posts: 10,145

May 11, 2012 -- 11:26AM, Marcion wrote:

Obama's people did the math and concluded Obama would have abetter chance of being reelected if he supported same sex marriage.


Obama is an astute politician and made it clear that his was a personal opinion and the decision on same sex marriage lies with each state.



True and he's done about all he actually can (ending DADT, telling the justice department to stop defending DOMA and a bunch of little regulation changes that make life slightly easier for LGBT folks) but all a president can do sometimes is cheerlead on an issue. At the least, it's got to be a nice feeling for our LGBT friends that the president (and VP) are on their side in the fight for justice.

He who oppresses the poor shows contempt for their Maker, but whoever is kind to the needy honors God. ~ Proverbs 14:31

Fiat justitia, ruat caelum

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 3:48PM #63
wohali
Posts: 10,227

Roodog:


"This has got to be nipped in the bud because such things as the Holocaust can happen in America."


A holocaust has happened in America.


Until 1978 it was legal to steal Indian children from their families.


The United States government was actively involved in the destruction of Indian peoples.


Indian women were routinely sterilized without cause and without the women's permission or knowledge.


We need to always be vigilant.

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 4:10PM #64
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

May 10, 2012 -- 11:22PM, Do_unto_others wrote:


May 10, 2012 -- 3:47PM, mainecaptain wrote:

And no moral person would consider Paul Ryan's economic plan. 




And yet the House passed it. No moral person? Bang on.




Frightening isn't? Well clearly the majority in the "House" right now have no morals, none at all.


They appear to be nothing but greedy, mean spirited, selfish people. None should be in positions of power. Not even to delivering newspapers.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 4:13PM #65
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

May 11, 2012 -- 3:48PM, wohali wrote:


Roodog:


"This has got to be nipped in the bud because such things as the Holocaust can happen in America."


A holocaust has happened in America.


Until 1978 it was legal to steal Indian children from their families.


The United States government was actively involved in the destruction of Indian peoples.


Indian women were routinely sterilized without cause and without the women's permission or knowledge.


We need to always be vigilant.




"We need to always be vigilant."



Yes we do. Too many people in power right now, would like nothing but that kind of control.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 4:19PM #66
Ebon
Posts: 10,145

May 11, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mainecaptain wrote:

They appear to be nothing but greedy, mean spirited, selfish people. None should be in positions of power. Not even to delivering newspapers.



Without wishing to name anyone, sociopaths often end up in politics or high levels of business. Those environments self-select for the sociopath's glib, superficial charm; grandiosity and defining lack of empathy, remorse, guilt or conscience (all caused by an inability to feel empathy). One thing I will say is that Obama doesn't fit the profile.

He who oppresses the poor shows contempt for their Maker, but whoever is kind to the needy honors God. ~ Proverbs 14:31

Fiat justitia, ruat caelum

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 4:26PM #67
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

May 11, 2012 -- 4:19PM, Ebon wrote:


May 11, 2012 -- 4:10PM, mainecaptain wrote:

They appear to be nothing but greedy, mean spirited, selfish people. None should be in positions of power. Not even to delivering newspapers.



Without wishing to name anyone, sociopaths often end up in politics or high levels of business. Those environments self-select for the sociopath's glib, superficial charm; grandiosity and defining lack of empathy, remorse, guilt or conscience (all caused by an inability to feel empathy). One thing I will say is that Obama doesn't fit the profile.




I agree. I have done some studying in this matter. You are correct.


And Obama does not fit that profile.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 4:39PM #68
vra
Posts: 6,403

May 11, 2012 -- 1:54PM, TemplarS wrote:


Though I'm not convinced.  It is true that  polls show Americans favor same-sex marriage by a small margin.




But here's the catch.  We know some states will, almost without a doubt, go blue, and some others red.  But there are several battleground states whereas a switch of even a small percentage of votes can throw the election one way or another, and each of these states have a relatively large independent block that could go either way.  So far, in states whereas SSM has been put up to a popular vote, it has gone down to defeat, and typically by a wide margin (20% in North Carolina, which went for Obama in 2008).


So far, most of the political commentary I've run across have it that Obama will probably not benefit from this announcement but could well be hurt, especially since there's no doubt that Rove & Co. will milk this cow in every conservative and fundamentalist church in the country.  It's going to be "Obama hates believers", and I don't have much doubt that there will be a fair number of independents who'll be swung by that argument, and I simply don't envision a ground-swell going the other way.     

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 7:00PM #69
Marcion
Posts: 2,883

May 11, 2012 -- 12:15AM, Roodog wrote:


Might I note that the opening shot of the Nazi Holocaust of 1933-45 was the  infamous Nuremberg Laws? These were laws regulating who could marry whom and who could sleep with whom.


There has been rumblings of not only trying to reverse Griswold v. Connecticut and Lawrence v Texas, but also a call to reverse Loving v. Virginia.


This has got to be nipped in the bud because such things as the Holocaust can happen in America.




Not only can happen but did happen. The Government supported genocide of the American Indians is no different than the Nazi genocide against the Jews. If the US had the technology for gas chambers and ovens thay would have used them.

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2 years ago  ::  May 11, 2012 - 7:13PM #70
Bgnet
Posts: 1
I believe that sometimes we have to agree even though we may disagree.,But we must go along with the plan... even if he may have one more year.
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