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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 12:08PM #31
TemplarS
TemplarS
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When it was introduced in the early 90s, don't-ask-don't-tell was a reasonable compromise.


But times have changed; nearly a generation has passed, a child born back then is now eligible for military service.  From my experience with my own children I know that this generation is much more open to full equality for homosexuals.


It is time to move on and fully accept gays in the military.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 1:12PM #32
REteach
REteach
Posts: 13,195

I find it odd that the Republican preach/scream this "we have to protect the country" mantra, and then want to kick out perfectly good troops.  Can we say "hypocrisy"?

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize what you heard was not what I meant...
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 2:02PM #33
Stardove
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Feb 3, 2010 -- 8:38AM, REteach wrote:


hamptonroads.com/2010/02/joint-chiefs-ch...


So maybe the land of the free and the home of the brave is getting over being scared of gays.  Unless they are Republican...



From your link and on the TV news last night is McCain's reversal.


McCain’s objection was particularly striking to some in the gay rights community because, as recently as 2006, he had said he wouldn’t stand in the way of a repeal of the policy. “I’ve had these debates and discussions, but the day that the leadership of the military comes to me and says, ‘Senator, we ought to change the policy,’ then I think we ought to consider seriously changing it because those leaders in the military are the ones we give the responsibility to,” McCain said on MSNBC’s “Hardball” that year.

But at this point, McCain is not swayed by the personal opinion of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said McCain spokeswoman Brooke Buchanan. “Adm. Mullen was speaking for himself, not the military as a whole,” Buchanan said, adding that McCain will wait to see the results of the review and hear the collective decision by all the Joint Chiefs. “There’s a huge difference there.”


I listened as one gay Lt. Col. Airforce pilot who has been in the military for 19 years and was outed by a civilian say he joined because of McCain and what he felt he owed McCain's generation.  He was very disappointed McCain has flip-flopped.


McCain also said if he had been elected President on the first day he would have requested a review of the DADT indicated needed changes.  Right McCain.


Feb 3, 2010 -- 8:57AM, IreneAdler wrote:


Why the need for a year-long review to study the impact?


It’s not like this has never come up before.


 


And FYI: my bro 20 years US NAVY (1986-2006) very much wondered what the big deal was here.  In his mind, it was doing one’s job that was important.  Period.


 


Irene.



I agree Irene.  It is not like there are not gays in the military now living, eating, sleeping, etc with straight service men and women.  The Joint Chief said he has served with gays since 1968.  Nothing new about gays in the military.  They are just forced in the closet today by DADT.  If found out they are gay from the closet to the street.

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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 2:09PM #34
Stardove
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This speaks for itself.  McCain flip-flops on don't ask dont's tell (DADT)! Other issues with DADT are included in video.










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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 2:22PM #35
mainecaptain
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So much for "Land of the Free and home of the Brave"


Some brave there, They are afraid of Gay people. Gay people are People, nothing more to be afraid of then any other people.


 


I have more to say. but it would be rude.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 2:43PM #36
mountain_man
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Feb 3, 2010 -- 2:02PM, Stardove wrote:

McCain’s objection was particularly striking to some in the gay rights community because, as recently as 2006, he had said he wouldn’t stand in the way of a repeal of the policy. ....



Why this surprised some is surprising to me. McCain is a Republican above all. He is a member of the Party of NO. Whatever Obama, or any other Democrat wants, they say no. They say no even if it is something they agree on or want. It's what they do.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 4:18PM #37
mainecaptain
mainecaptain
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Feb 3, 2010 -- 2:43PM, mountain_man wrote:


Feb 3, 2010 -- 2:02PM, Stardove wrote:

McCain’s objection was particularly striking to some in the gay rights community because, as recently as 2006, he had said he wouldn’t stand in the way of a repeal of the policy. ....



Why this surprised some is surprising to me. McCain is a Republican above all. He is a member of the Party of NO. Whatever Obama, or any other Democrat wants, they say no. They say no even if it is something they agree on or want. It's what they do.




Bolding is mine. And what you say is correct, but I can't figure out why. Why this desire to make others fail? Even when you want the proposal? It makes no sense, this desire to cause so much harm, for harms sake.

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 4:36PM #38
Redfrog777
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Posts: 2,136

 Ya know this is the damn stupidest issue I can possibly think of!!!! What kind of nation would deny a solid up standing willing citizen the right to serve in the it's armed forces over something that is none of their business in the first place!?


 I get that everybody shares the same barricks and showers and all that hoo haa. But come on  folks grow the hell up. NO means NO guy or gal. Ain't that hard to get past. An just cuz a gay guy likes you don't mean your gonna catch the gay! Damn insecure little boys, if you ask me. 


 This should have never been an issue in the first place, and right now it seems to be all the rage on the media. Don't get me wrong score one for equality, woo hoo. But it's kind like telling women that they can vote now. Geeze, as a nation we so espouse the equality BS. But in truth as a nation we spend an time and effort blocking the equality of those deemed less equal. 


 Let those who wish to serve, serve. 
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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 4:44PM #39
IDBC
IDBC
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Howdy Folks


A long, long time ago(1968-1970)when I was either protecting my country from the evil, monothlic godless Communist regime or being a stooge for the military industrial complex, I did a two year bid in the US Army.  I am sure that there were homosexuals among those I served with, but none of them came out or came on to me, maybe it was because I was...cute enough. 


Now I can to some degree understand that some hetrosexual men may feel uncomfortable either taking a shower with or sleeping in a barracks with homosexual men.   However I do not believe that their being uncomfortable is sufficent reason to prevent their being in the Army.   I do not think being uncomfortable is a valid reason to prevent a man or a woman from serving their country.  Especially now when there are not enough men or women willing to voluntarily to protect their country from a evil terrorist who hate our way of life,  or willing to kill innocent civlians and be stooges for Zionist-Islamophic-Imperialist Empire.   


What are the objections of those who oppose their fellow American who happen to be homosexuals from being openly gay?


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3 years ago  ::  Feb 03, 2010 - 6:07PM #40
Stardove
Stardove
Posts: 12,759

Feb 3, 2010 -- 4:44PM, IDBC wrote:


Howdy Folks


A long, long time ago(1968-1970)when I was either protecting my country from the evil, monothlic godless Communist regime or being a stooge for the military industrial complex, I did a two year bid in the US Army.  I am sure that there were homosexuals among those I served with, but none of them came out or came on to me, maybe it was because I was...cute enough. 


Now I can to some degree understand that some hetrosexual men may feel uncomfortable either taking a shower with or sleeping in a barracks with homosexual men.   However I do not believe that their being uncomfortable is sufficent reason to prevent their being in the Army.   I do not think being uncomfortable is a valid reason to prevent a man or a woman from serving their country.  Especially now when there are not enough men or women willing to voluntarily to protect their country from a evil terrorist who hate our way of life,  or willing to kill innocent civlians and be stooges for Zionist-Islamophic-Imperialist Empire.   


What are the objections of those who oppose their fellow American who happen to be homosexuals from being openly gay?


Have A Thinking Day And May Reason Guide You



IDBC,



My husband served in the Navy about the same time as you.  He kept re-upping for Nam.  He surprised me the other night as we were watching the DADA debate on the news.  He told me "I served with gays".  Knock me over with a feather in all these years he had never told me that.  He said he didn't think of it as a big deal. When you are on the river or the jungle, guess you just want the man (back then) next to you to know how to shoot straight.

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