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What is money?
11 months ago  ::  Jul 19, 2011 - 1:25PM #5
JoliverJOLLY
Posts: 440

Anyway I've moved on from "Money is war" to "Money is fuel"


 


Big energy suck! 

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11 months ago  ::  Jul 19, 2011 - 1:09PM #4
JoliverJOLLY
Posts: 440

Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


Money is simply a measurable means of exchanging one thing of value for another




 


No that is a currency, money has a value in of itself, an intrinsic value, like a gold or silver coin, there is the value of the gold in the means of exchange.


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


The underlying driving force is always the human perception of that which has value.




 


True and with a gold coin it's value will flux accordingly. With fiat currency tho, which is backed by a promise to pay and has no intrinsic value, the promise to pay the bonds is where the value comes from, and what fluxs is the perception of that ability.


Pure and simple it's a credit, the payment comes in the future, and as it's all pushed off into the future the ability of people to assess that ability is confused slightly.


 


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


These driving forces are rooted in the forces of nature itself, the forces of the life process; the life processes which ever seek to sustain life itself. Therefore all things of value derive from a hierarchy of values established by the natural laws of the universe and the way in which life processes such as human society may alter their availability.




 


That's a joke, if people agreed that grass was more valuable than gold, it would be so, to suggest that the driving force is a natural law of the universe is rediculas. As you said before and as austrian ecconomic states there is no real value, and value is a matter of perception, which is why we have the market to establish the acutal value of things, basically the majority of people agree that the value should be in this or that position as they buy and sell it.


Sadly this system is broken and price discovery is lost today, and apparently everyone that has tried to bring price discovery back, has become as broken as the system.


  


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


 For example, at one time everyone believed that the natural resources of the world which sustain life were beyond depletion. Mankind did not possess enough knowledge to measure their level of availability. Oil and water were assumed to be forever in abundance.  Between the mass consumption of oil and the contamination of the sources of natural fresh water these values became percieved as limited and therefore the price and competition for oil went up and water became a comodity with a price. 




Well some, want to make everything a commodity. These are the laws of supply and demand, naturally if more people want something then that reality will increase the price till some people are not prepared to pay it, but that does not take into consideration sustainability, that is simply I have 10 mangos, fifthy people want them, the price rises till the only buyers left are prepared to pay the amount that arises but afterwads they are gone, looking at sustainablity then those 10 mangos are sold in limited amounts, to those that are prepared to pay for it and the supply continues, one way looks to the future and future business the other just sells with no consideration to the future at all.  


 


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


At first water was relatively cheap in price.  Its price just as all other continues to go up steadily. 




 


This has to be the biggest con ever 80% of the earth is water, it is the one thing we have in massive abundence, we have technologies to convert sea water, purify waters, it is a total joke, just like the hose pipe bans put in place in Britian, by making a water a comodity those that sell it seek, to reduce supply to increase profits, or manufacture the idea of low supply.


 


  


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


 At the pace of contamination of the earths natural resources one day we will be forced underground or out to space and oxygen itself will be placed in canisters for sale. 


 




 Again that is rediculas, water is made from Qxygen and as it evaporates it realeases that oxygen when becomes the gases that make it up.


 Contaminations can be repair and cleaned up. Stopping them happening in the first place is a more pressing issue.


Jan 14, 2011 -- 11:00AM, etoro wrote:


Why does a diamond have value in the eyes of human beings?






Depends on who you ask, someone that uses Diamonds in their work would probably say "there value is there ultility or usefulness", other might say they are shiny, other like the Jewellery, artists like the light they reflect, maybe a house wife would say the same, others might see it's value in its strength, an African fighting over a blood diamond might say they allow me to and my family eat, another Afican might say they have no value "I lost my whole family to them". Very relative what gives something it's value to each person that likes or wants it.


Personally I think you've been watching "the day the earth stood still" too much.  .  


Money, values, the market, business pratice all these things should be discussed in a rational manner, sadly, Market fascists, con men plutocrates and cletocrates are not reasonable and rational people.


As I always say the idea of some button trader as a master of the universe, just makes me laugh.    

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 14, 2011 - 11:00AM #3
etoro
Posts: 497

Money is simply a measurable means of exchanging one thing of value for another The underlying driving force is always the human perception of that which has value. These driving forces are rooted in the forces of nature itself, the forces of the life process; the life processes which ever seek to sustain life itself. Therefore all things of value derive from a hierarchy of values established by the natural laws of the universe and the way in which life processes such as human society may alter their availability. For example, at one time everyone believed that the natural resources of the world which sustain life were beyond depletion. Mankind did not possess enough knowledge to measure their level of availability. Oil and water were assumed to be forever in abundance.  Between the mass consumption of oil and the contamination of the sources of natural fresh water these values became percieved as limited and therefore the price and competition for oil went up and water became a comodity with a price. 


At first water was relatively cheap in price.  Its price just as all other continues to go up steadily.  At the pace of contamination of the earths natural resources one day we will be forced underground or out to space and oxygen itself will be placed in canisters for sale. 


 


 


 


Why does a diamond have value in the eyes of human beings?

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 06, 2011 - 3:00PM #2
Karma_yeshe_dorje
Posts: 7,866

There are several varieties of money. And their relative values vary.

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1 year ago  ::  Dec 30, 2010 - 9:56PM #1
JoliverJOLLY
Posts: 440

It's an interesting topic, some consider money to be a thing of value used to exchange for good and services.


The explanation I have come to, after looking into it slightly, is:-


A Thing of real or percieved value or both, used as a tool to facilitate transactions, which also has an agreement with in a group, state or community, to be used as a medium of exchange for goods, services and or desires.


So I was wondering if any of you had any ideas about what money is?


I will add that, money as stated is a thing of value real or percieved, a thing of value, meant to be anyway- I know that current fiat currency is actually debt, in that, it takes it's value from future taxation.  So really current fiat money is "credits" not money.


That aside any ideas about what money is?

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