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Switch to Forum Live View Where did we go wrong?
7 years ago  ::  Nov 11, 2007 - 9:57AM #1
ProfessorGoatPellets
Posts: 172
Where did we go wrong?

If we have evolved from monkeys or apes, who are largely (but not always) herbivorous animals then what caused us to start eating meat?

When and why did we start killing for food?
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7 years ago  ::  Nov 11, 2007 - 11:46AM #2
PaulaEdwina
Posts: 1,720
If we have evolved from monkeys or apes, who are largely (but not always) herbivorous animals then what caused us to start eating meat?

When and why did we start killing for food?


By your own definition we've been killing for food even when we were apes and "largely, but not always" herbivorous. Which sort of is like saying almost, but not quite pregnant. Heck, Bonobos still kill and eat meat.

I guess you answered your own question.
Paula
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7 years ago  ::  Nov 25, 2007 - 4:00PM #3
thumblina1
Posts: 161
I for one don't buy into 'we evolved from apes" stance. I just don't . Plus I think our ancestors have always ate meat. Now I don't care if some other person wants to go and become vegan, that is oK, just don't try to make the rest of us meat eaters feel guilty. Manly cause it just does not work
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7 years ago  ::  Nov 29, 2007 - 6:53PM #4
dagaz4u
Posts: 1
That is a good comment thumblina1.  What do vegans want you to feel guilty about anyway?
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7 years ago  ::  Nov 30, 2007 - 12:51PM #5
IreneAdler
Posts: 2,849
[QUOTE=dagaz4u;103848]That is a good comment thumblina1.  What do vegans want you to feel guilty about anyway?[/QUOTE]

I agree. 

I think vegans don't ken to the idea that a living being is used as another's food. 
Causes pain/death to the animal used as food.

Irene.
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7 years ago  ::  Dec 01, 2007 - 10:19PM #6
ann1wp
Posts: 1
I don't believe our ancestors went "wrong". Our large, evolving brains are a big part of why we started eating meat. The brain is a small percentage of total body weight, but it demands a very large calorie supply to keep us functioning. Meat is concentrated calories, and it is very much easier for our bodies to extract those calories from meat rather than from plant matter. It became a matter of need. In this day and age,  when food is easier to obtain, we can make the choice to be vegetarian/vegan and not have our health suffer.
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7 years ago  ::  Dec 02, 2007 - 11:20PM #7
solfeggio
Posts: 9,550
Eating meat has nothing whatever to do with brain size.  That silly theory was long ago proven wrong.

The size of our brains has nothing to do with eating meat.  If it did, then carnivorous predators like lions and tigers that eat nothing but meat would have the biggest, best brains of all.

Early hominids were, indeed, vegetarians.  The latest scientific opinions on this are that we were tree-dwellers, living in the canopy, eating mainly fruits.

Humans are believed to be natural frugivores, in fact.  And it is true that we do very well on a raw fruit diet.

At any rate, at some point, for various reasons, people came down from the trees and began to live in the veldt.  They formed small, nomaidic family groups that moved around and looked for food wherever they could find it.

This meant gathering berries, leaves, nuts, roots, etc. in season as they moved.  And it also entailed eating the leftovers from lions' kills.

Possibly, this is where humans began to develop their taste for flesh.  In any case, they would have eaten very little meat.  In fact, the latest scientific evidence is that humans were the prey and not the predators.

We're not natural meat eaters by any means.  We do not have the teeth, jaws, stomachs, or digestions to process raw flesh.

Indeed, not only is meat not a natural food for us, but consuming the saturated fat in meat is bad for us.

Making the choice to vegetarianism or, better yet, to becoming a vegan, is the best possible choice for the planet, the animals, and ourselves.
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7 years ago  ::  Dec 15, 2007 - 12:45AM #8
Urukai
Posts: 1,048
Hello,
In answer to the OP
"When and why did we start killing for food?"

We are an animal that has always done so - we kill for territory...we kill for mates...we kill for our perceived place in a particular group or society and yes we kill for food...we are no different in that respect than any other animal on this planet...
Not even the "monkeys and apes"
Oh and the evolution thing...
We didn't evolve from monkeys or apes...we have an ancestor in common with them...think in terms of a tree with splitting branches...we and creatures like chimpanzees and apes are more like cousins...that is why their genetic lines have not evolved into something like our lines...they are close but separate branches on the evolutionary tree of life.

Chimps and apes ate and eat animal protein...
There are documented cases of chimps eating meat: other small animals and even each other: chimps from different troupes...gibbons have been known to attack and eat the flesh of small infants left on the outsides of farming fields of african villages... the diet of the great apes does mostly consist of plant material but in addition many eat their own poo......

If we are talking about our line of descent...man evolved from a hominid (Homo Sapians) that ate meat and sometimes other hominids, other early humans (Neanderthals)...
Humans today are all descendents of that Homosapian line and because of adaption over time we are omnivores...we can, if necessary, literally eat almost anything...it has given us a survivability that has helped us dominate this planet...

We have gotten to a comfortable spot - so much so that now we can choose...

To eat meat or not to...to be vegetarian (ingesting no animal) or not; to be vegan (ingesting no animal or no animal products)...
There are issues of factory farming, growth hormones, antibiotic resistance (bacteria evolve too) etc...there are issues of diet and ethics...and choice...yes some people like to judge and attempt to instill guilt and use less than ethical tactics to promote what they perceive as an ethical way of life...
...
Healthwise yes vegetarianism is better for the human animal that we have become...we no longer have to chase our prey five miles before killing it and eating it...we tend to over eat and not burn away the amount of fat we ingest...we eat synthetic stuff with very little real nutritional food value...etc

Veganism is a choice 99 times out of 100 based on ethical considerations - feelings for the animals in question not necessarily health considerations...

In the long run and this is my opinion of course we are better off still having a choice...some choosing one way and some the other...adaptability and diversity equals survivability...and that is one thing the human animal has gotten very good at...
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7 years ago  ::  Dec 16, 2007 - 1:36PM #9
solfeggio
Posts: 9,550
The fact that there is absolutely no question that the vegan/vegetarian lifestyle is not only the ethical choice by far, but is also the healthier choice, makes it, in the end the easiest choice for humans.

So what if early humans ate flesh now and then?  (Nobody knows just how much).  So what if chimps eat insects?  Those facts have nothing to do with our lives today.

All we have to be concerned about is the undeniable fact that millions and millions of animals are tortured, abused, and slaughtered simply because humans like the taste of meat.  And millions and millions of chickens are mistreated and caused to suffer because people like the taste of eggs.

The bottom line, whether people want to think about it or not, is that not eating meat is morally and ethically superior to supporting factory farming.  And to say that it is OK to cause suffering and death to other species simply because we humans have the ability to 'make choices' is very weak reasoning.
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7 years ago  ::  Dec 16, 2007 - 1:42PM #10
solfeggio
Posts: 9,550
And, oh, yeah, we are most assuredly NOT descendants of Neanderthals.  Also, we are NOT in any sense of the word natural omnivores.  It is an undeniable fact that our bodies are designed to process plant food, which is obvious when you consider our teeth, jaws, stomachs, etc.

We may be behavioural omnivores in that we choose to eat meat.  But that does not mean that we SHOULD be eating it.  The fact of animal flesh being an unhealthy food for Homo sapiens sapiens has been proven over and over again to everyone's satisfaction.
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