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Switch to Forum Live View How a Muslim acquires slaves
3 years ago  ::  Jun 18, 2011 - 10:06AM #21
Abdullah.
Posts: 882

Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Is it forbidden for a Muslim to have another Muslim as a slave?



  


Yes i think so, for slaves is only attained by defending against kaafir enemies, thus Muslims dont come into the equation, however if a kaafir slave converts, then the owner is not under obligation to free him, but as Islam looks upon compassion to and freeing slaves as an act of great good, then this is why in overwhelming cases slaves were freed


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


And where does it say in the Quran or Hadiths that the reason for slavery is rehabillitation?




it is deduced from the teachings; the Muslims duty is to save himself and all of humanity [as much as he can] from the Hell fire, so our interaction and treatment of non-Muslims wether slaves or not, is all meant as an 'invitation to Islam'; also the slave lives amongst the muslims and sees the excellent examples of Islam first hand; there can be no better exposure to the beuty of Islam 


The slaves also enjoy unprecedented human rights and dignified interaction with the Muslim society too, not being shunned etc, and thus once their freed, their ready to live as respectable members of the community


  ... (iv) to distribute them among the Muslims as part of the spoils of war.

the fourth option, whence followed the humane laws and norms instituted by Islam for what is, in effect, the rehabilitation of prisoners of war.

The slave in every Muslim house had the opportunity to see at close quarters the truth of Islam in practice. His heart would be won over by kind treatment and the humanity of Islam in general, especially by the access the slave had to many of the legal rights enjoyed by Muslims, and, ultimately, by getting his freedom. In this way, many thousands of the very best people have swelled the numbers of the great and famous in Islam, whose own example has then become a sunna, a norm, for the Muslims who succeeded them-imams such as Nafi�, Imam Malik�s sheikh, and Tawus bin Qaisan, to name only two.

The reality is that in Islam it is overwhelmingly the case that being a slave was a temporary condition.


qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=...


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


How can a Muslim free a Muslim slave as compensation if a Muslim could never own another Muslim slave?



 


I think your answer lies above; Muslims are not under obligation to free their slaves once their muslim, thus it is only natural that some wont be immediately freed 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Would you believe a story about a Non-Muslim freeing a slave and the slave refusing because he was treated well by his slavemaster?



  


yes it will be very rare indeed, however this slaveboy lived with THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH [SWT] and you can tell that type of endearment he'd have to the best of humanity, so it is not surprising that he did not leave; his dad was heartbroken when the boy was captured as a slave too and spent years? looking for him and the boy knew this, but yet he chose to stay with muhammad [saw]; straight after this event, the Propht [saw] adopted him as his son, untill adoption was prohibbited by Allah [swt], but in his later life this former slave was married to a cousin? of the prophet [saw], so this shows how their would be no stigma  attachd to freed slaves and they would be treated as equall members of the community


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Why did Muhammad free him?




as above; when he 'adopted him' he was freed


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Would it be wrong for a Muslim slavemaster free a slave if the quality of life of the slave would be worse off if he were set free?




 in a Muslim society it wouldn't be worse

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 29, 2011 - 11:43PM #22
arabianwitch
Posts: 669

Slavery is an absolute evil and has no place, any place, in the world today. Nothing can justify it and nothing can excuse it.


Salaam,


Aisha

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 30, 2011 - 1:25PM #23
visio
Posts: 3,121

Jun 29, 2011 -- 11:43PM, arabianwitch wrote:


Slavery is an absolute evil and has no place, any place, in the world today. Nothing can justify it and nothing can excuse it.


Salaam,


Aisha





Muslims are messengers, caliphs and slaves of ALLAHswt.  Is that evil?

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3 years ago  ::  Jul 01, 2011 - 11:27AM #24
NATAS
Posts: 777

Jun 18, 2011 -- 10:06AM, Abdullah. wrote:


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Is it forbidden for a Muslim to have another Muslim as a slave?



  


Yes i think so, for slaves is only attained by defending against kaafir enemies, thus Muslims dont come into the equation,



Yes I do think that Muslims could have other Muslims as slaves. 


Quoting from the link you provided


qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=...


 


" The Qur�an     commands that he who has killed a believer by mistake must set free a believing     slave and pay the blood-money to the family of the slain (al-Nisa�, 4.92)."


I think that a "believer" refers to a Muslim.   If I am correct then the Quran commands that if a Muslim kills another Muslim by mistake then he must free a Muslim slave and pay blood money to the Muslim family of the slain. 


Jun 18, 2011 -- 10:06AM, Abdullah. wrote:


 however if a kaafir slave converts, then the owner is not under obligation to free him, but as Islam looks upon compassion to and freeing slaves as an act of great good, then this is why in overwhelming cases slaves were freed.



Why is it that Muslims are not under an "obligation" to free a kaafir who reverts to Islam?


 


 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


And where does it say in the Quran or Hadiths that the reason for slavery is rehabillitation?




it is deduced from the teachings; the Muslims duty is to save himself and all of humanity [as much as he can] from the Hell fire, so our interaction and treatment of non-Muslims wether slaves or not, is all meant as an 'invitation to Islam'; also the slave lives amongst the muslims and sees the excellent examples of Islam first hand; there can be no better exposure to the beuty of Islam 



It can be deduced that making a person a slave is a meant to be an "invitation to Islam" and that by doing so a slave will see that Islam is an excellent and beautiful religion then that a person will be saved from hellfire then it can be deduced the more slaves that are owned by Muslims the more people will revert to Islam and be saved from hellfire.


Jun 18, 2011 -- 10:06AM, Abdullah. wrote:


The slaves also enjoy unprecedented human rights and dignified interaction with the Muslim society too, not being shunned etc, and thus once their freed, their ready to live as respectable members of the community



I might agree that slaves of Muslims were "SUPPOSED" to have "MORE" human rights then slaves owned by Non-Muslims. 


But slaves did not enjoy EQUAL human rights with their Muslim slave massas. 


  

Jun 18, 2011 -- 10:06AM, Abdullah. wrote:


  ... (iv) to distribute them among the Muslims as part of the spoils of war.



Like Muslims could distribute cows, goats and other property-booty-spoils of war.

the fourth option, whence followed the humane laws and norms instituted by Islam for what is, in effect, the rehabilitation of prisoners of war.




The slave in every Muslim house was SUPPOSED  opportunity to see at close quarters the truth of Islam in practice. His heart MIGHT be won IF over they were  and the humanity of Islam in general, especially by the access the slave had to many  BUT NOT ALL of the legal rights enjoyed by Muslims, and, ultimately, MIGHT  her  freedom. In this way, many thousands of the very best people have swelled the numbers of the great and famous in Islam and many of thousands of those who were not freed because they did NOT see the truth and beauty of Islam remained 
The reality is that Muslims were not under an OBLIGATION to free slaves even if they reverted to Islam.   


As this link  


qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=...


clearly states. 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


How can a Muslim free a Muslim slave as compensation if a Muslim could never own another Muslim slave?



 


I think your answer lies above; Muslims are not under obligation to free their slaves once their muslim, thus it is only natural that some wont be immediately freed 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Would you believe a story about a Non-Muslim freeing a slave and the slave refusing because he was treated well by his slavemaster?


 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


Why did Muhammad free him?




as above; when he 'adopted him' he was freed 



 That says "WHEN" Muhmmad freed his slave NOT WHY. 


If Muhammad's slaveboy did not see the beauty and truth of Islam would-should have Muhammad freed him?  


Because it seems to me that the WHY Muhammad freed him was because the slaveboy reverted to Islam and I doubt that Muhammad would have freed him if he did not revert to Islam.     


 


 


 




 That says "WHEN" Muhmmad freed his slave NOT WHY. 


If Muhammad's slaveboy did not see the beauty and truth of Islam would-should have Muhammad freed him?  


Because it seems to me that the WHY Muhammad freed him was because the slaveboy reverted to Islam and I doubt that Muhammad would have freed him if he did not revert to Islam.     


 


 


 


Jun 17, 2011 -- 2:18PM, NATAS wrote:


 
Would it be wrong for a Muslim slavemassa free a slave if the slave did not see the beauty and truth of Islam and did not revert to Islam? 

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3 years ago  ::  Jul 01, 2011 - 2:41PM #25
IDBC
Posts: 4,361

Howdy Visio


Jun 30, 2011 -- 1:25PM, visio wrote:


 


Muslims are messengers, caliphs and slaves of ALLAHswt.  Is that evil?





Yes.  It is evil because Muslims who are not as kind as Allah and who do not treat slaves as they are "SUPPOSED" to treat them will use it as an excuse to have slaves. 


Christian slaveowners used the excuse that because their slaves we not "believers"  that owning slaves who were not "believers" and making them believers they would be saving them from hellfire.   And according to the Bible christian slaveowners were "SUPPOSED" to treat them kindly and with compassion.  


I am sure that you will agree that slaveowners both christian and muslim did not always do what the were "SUPPOSED" to do.

HAVE A THINKING DAY MAY REASON GUIDE YOU
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