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5 years ago  ::  Feb 01, 2010 - 9:58AM #41
visio
Posts: 3,250

One way to rationalise the creational constituents of a Man as outlined in the Al-Quran is to consider how the apparent death processes of Man are generally understood by an everage believing persons.  Two processes are very commonly  understood and concluded.   One is the immortal soul separates and leaves the gross body frameworks.  The other is the whole physical gross body frameworks are decomposed either when it is earthly buried or when it is cremated on pyre. In the former a colony of worms are said to be built around the decomposed body.  However there is a third process elements that many may be not aware of or not so sure about it.   This is the middle-form (framework) that interfaces between the soul and the apparent physical framework of the whole body. Among the experienced persons  this is what can be termed as the mind principle or the unified spirit that holds together all the organic molecules of the body which is also the primary agent that, by working thru the brain and the whole nerve system,  controls all the animating function  of the whole body (within and without).  It is almost like the bonding framework that holds the O2 : CO2 : N2in the air, at their fixed ratio.  We can simply term it as the Mind Spirit component of Man..  So going back to the basic there are three principal frameworks within the beingness of a Human Person and the instantaneous Human Person (Mi) can be ascribed with the following formulation:
Mi = SOUL + MIND/SPIRIT + BODY
At death, the soul leaves the body. The body goes back into the earth and the air decayed and disintegrated.   What happens to the MIND/SPIRIT frameworks [N.B.  within many spiritual circles this is also referred to as the ASTRAL BODY which even among some Muslims being confused with the Jinn beings to which it may share similar material bodily form, but differs in its history].  The ASTRAL BODY,  un-interfered,  is a resilient bonding energy form and would stick closely with the dead body and retain strong  inertial resistance to hold on to its unified form (similar to that it has so grown and attached with).  At a certain point in the physical decay of the body and when it senses that its unified form would crumble, it works on its instinct and to detach from the collapsing body and find another body to cling to.  This is what many people have experience of witnessing, at burial sites, and report it as ghosts.  The distorted images seen is a reflection of the decayed distortion of the dead body at the point of detachment.  This ASTRAL BODY is perishable when subjected to bright sunlight.  However it possesses self instinct/intelligent and mobility to move and reside under shady or dark covers.  By nature this ASTRAL BODY (so-called ghosts) if left on its own is harmless,  It is a matter of time and environment when it will finally decay and disintegrate.  But to some  knowledge  evil persons they can tap the ASTRAL BODY  and use its form and energy to work with their accomplices among the Jinn of the evil kind. The astral energy acts as a power (food ) source of the Jinn kind.  Fully decayed , fragmented and reduced into various sub-forms  , the spirits are scattered in the atmosphere and absorbed in the evolutionary process chains to create various sub-human life species that finally end up as a seed of another Man (Mx).
The significance of this information  is that the triune nature of a created Man (in the 2nd.Creation Universe) out of the manifested HALF of  SINGLE PERSON (in the 1.st Creation) ,  as described in the Al-Quran, is consistently maintained  as demonstrated  at his/her own death (in the 2nd. Universe) when the immortal SOUL returns to the higher realm of the BARZAKH (above the cosmic heavens an dearth) taking with it the reflected (copy) image of the MIND/SPIRIT of the ASTRAL BODY and leaving behind both the  COARSE PHYSICAL BODY and the ASTRAL BODY in a supposedly and desirably  purified state.  The soul that returns to the BARZAKH upon positive judgment and dispensation will then be given a new vehicle from another seed of Man in an environment conducive for it to improve on its state purification level.  The whole picture view is analogous to a scenario in an Olympic Track Relay Race.  We have a dirty baton taken by the 1st. runner at the start.  At the end of the lap it is expected that the baton would come out cleaner.  At the end of the lap of the last runner,  it is expected   the baton would come out relatively super clean than when it was at the start of the race.  In our case, the baton is to be viewed as our soul.  Our assumption in that race is all the runners are equally clean or inert and the baton doesn’t have a free-will to clean itself.   In the matter of spiritual life  the reality is they are not.  First and foremost, the soul (baton)  is empowered to clean itself and by doing that more effectively and intelligently it cleans itself and also (the hands of the ) relay runner (the vehicular Man) and, secondly, the successive relay runners (successive inheriting Man) are not equally clean.  Most Man to-day are caught in the illusion thinking that this body and the mind as the True SELF.  They are not.  They  are inherited seed of someone else which can be before or after us.  The SOUL is the SERVANT or SLAVE of ALLAH to purify the whole Universe of 1st.Creation and serve as the intelligent Self-willed tool to restore and balance the equilibrium of the LIGHT.
In a response to a question by a poster in the Islam Debate under the thread title  “ALLAH”:


May I follow up with the another question then.. If someone does a bad deed, who is responsible?



My reply was :


………………………..To answer that, most likely a better understanding of the CREATION process is necessary.  Anyway my take is that we are part of the cause and be responsible for it.  However the only way we can act on the responsibility is by not propagating it for the future generation.  How?  Be good in this life so that when we die our soul would leave behind a very clean body (flesh & bones and all)  and the spirits that clung to them.  When they decay and dismantle they may make a better fertilizer to make a better seed for another person (to inherit). This works on the principle of the Trinity of a Human Person. ………………………


.


In Islam Love and Compassion is to be triggered by the default Triune nature in all of us.  First and foremost closest to   us while encaged in the manifested Universe is that OTHER we have inherited in TRUST from ALLAHswt.   Our Love and Compassion Works we have to do FIRST within us before extending it outside us.  It is against this OTHER, who is closest to us, that we have agreed upon when we drew our Covenant with the other HALF PERSON of us well above the Paradise in the Presence of ALLAHswt (All-Mighty God).  Love, Compassion, Sincerity, Honesty, Charity as they say begins at home.  In truth they all begin within us for reasons drawn the derived Al-Quranic perspective on CREATION. This is part and parcel of the deeper aspect of the Islamic Theosophy which many are not aware of.
Salaam/Peace/HORAS

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 09, 2010 - 5:29AM #42
visio
Posts: 3,250

THE SECRET (trinity) OF MAN
From those highly accomplished and enlightened Muslims who had been blessed with direct experiencing in the footsteps of the late Prophet Muhammadsaw, their reconciliation on the substantial non-clear verses led to a simple conclusion to a simple conclusion that refutes many obsolete idea and presumption made on CREATION as a whole (both 1st.Creation and 2nd.Creation).  First and foremost what they view, at the highest state of individual Consciousness, the CREATION didn’t occur at any specific time Zth.Trillion Years ago.  CREATION is viewed as an ongoing process.  At every subsequent blink of an eye CREATION is uncreated and recreated.  The best analogy to describe this is that the solid appearance of the fluorescent bulb light.  It just take a 50 Hz or 60 Hz cycles of the AC current i.e.  1/50 sec. or 1/60 sec periodic cycle time to fool our human eyes us with its solidity.  Just imagine what one can witness  at the highest state of consciousness when the time resolution of the third eye is almost infinite.  At this resolution all the frames in the time frameworks of even the minutest of event sequences are brought to a standstill and, like an X-Ray film, everything could then be analysed frame by frame crystal clear.
What is being viewed of CREATION approaches that of ALLAHswt’s.  Their visualization indicated that , thru their SINGLE PERSON,  they see their own created LIGHT STREAMING and emerging out of its DIVINE SOURCE and descend towards a lower polarizing orbit.   Then after, one part of the polarized whole descends, yet further, into fractionated sub-orbits that make up all the heavenly and earthly existence of the 1st.Creation (the Heavens and Earth and all that are between them).  This part of the original SINGLE PERSON or LIGHT is thus said given its 1ST.DEATH.  All the multiple sub-orbits themselves become  the SOURCE form of all forms of sources that at the blink of an eye creates the existence of the whole 1st.Creation and in the next blink the existence is terminated.  For that, imagine an infinite of stream of the LIGHT of SINGLE PERSONS, in TIME series, created out of the divine source, what a colossal tree of an overlapping chains of branches that is to become.  If in the whole progression, a soul is to be changing vehicles 14 times i.e. inheriting the seeds from other SINGLE PERSONs and itself being inherited 14 times by the seeds of other SINGLE PERSONS  in the form of a Man or a Jinn until it is emancipated from the cycles of life and death and then exists in the Paradise of the Angels.
Below is a general outline how the tree of existence is created from the half part of our SINGLE PERSON or LIGHT ,  ☼ L0 ,  After descending to its orbit as one whole, it further moves down into an orbit polarized into a male and female aspect and remain in a union, ф.  A separation, ╒ ─  ─   ─  ─ d0, then takes place when one part is annihilated to create the whole heavenly and earthly Universe and everything that is called the 1st. Creation. The other half part remains in the orbit (half-spin). This is the half part that is personified by so many names – guardian angel, archaengel, spouse, star and perhaps the Holy Spirit (of which I’m not too sure because too much is said but no visualization given).   After a certain lapse of relative time (referenced to the Universe so created), a unit soul is created out, at the bottom end of the 1st.Creation,  in the form of synthesized spirits to the equivalent of 8 cattle (in pairs).  This soul is then set on it’s path (journey) of purification in seven stages as Man (the earthly bodily vehicle) and another seven stages as Jinn (the astral bodily vehicle) as mentioned above.  What is shown below is the progress over the 4-stages (only) as Man.  At the bottom most of the tree,  ┌──┴──┐,   the Originally created soul, p0 (which is derived from the spirit, S0 , is matched to a human body born out of the seed of another (pair) of persons, B0.   The new entity now becomes the first Original (1st) Man,
M0 , of the liberated spirit of the 1st. Creation, and his/whole spiritual consciousness make up is the enriched new soul, p0, (subscript o), that at the end of its prescribed time, is expected to be purified to  p0(superscript o, i.e. raised).  At the 1st. DEATH experience of the soul (after a prescribed time), the soul, p0  is raised, ╟──── , or,  │└─────, to the Barzakh, , for a Judgement/Decision.  In the BARZAKH, the soul, for the first time is REUNITED (temporarily) with his/her lost HALF PERSON (LIGHT) in the PRESENCE of ALLAHswt.  All his/her sin in his/her FIRST LIFE is forgiven for the first and last time.
Al-An’’am 6 : 94 - 96  And truly you have come unto Us alone  as We created you the first time (as a single person/light).   You have left behind you all that which We have bestowed on you.  We see not with you the intercessors whom you claimed to be partners with ALLAH.   Now all relations between you and them have been cut off, and all that you used to claim has vanished from you.   Verily!  It is ALLAH Who causes the seed-grain and the fruit-stone to split and sprout.   He brings forth the living from the dead, and it is He Who brings forth the dead from the living.   Such is ALLAH, then how are you deluded away from the truth?  Cleaver of the day break.  He has appointed the night for the resting, and the sun and the moon for reckoning.  Such is the measuring of the All-Mighty, the All-Knowing.
Luqman  31 : 28   The creation of you all and the resurrection of you all are only as a SINGLE PERSON.   Verily, ALLAH is All-Hearer, All-Seer.
As-Saffat  37 : 59    “Except our first death, and we shall not be punished?”

After the inaugural BARZAKH and a decision/covenant is made, the soul, 
p0 will return and take a pre-selected new body of Man, to be born from the seed of yet another (pair) of human persons, B1 . With this new body, the soul,  p0 , by virtue of being enriched with knowledge in the last BARZAKH,, is labeled as p1 to indicate a raised consciousness state, to begin the next stage of purification.  His/her new entity thus takes on a new identity of Man, M1, for the next lifetime.  As said before, by the time of the 1st. DEATH, enrichment/purification of the soul is accompanied (thru mutual reaction) by an enrichment/purification of the body, B0 .  So when the soul p0 departed, the body returns to the earth and attached to it, is, its own intrinsic spirit, S0 Both are in better purified state than before – at the start and are thus indicated with superscripts, B0 and S0 .  In the chart the symbol, ∩ is used to indicate the return of the physical matter of the dead body and its associate astral spirit body back to the earth, at the moment of death.


                                        A               L                 L               A                H


                    ┬─────────┬──────────┬──────────┬──────────┬                        


                         ☼ L0                 ☼ L0                  ☼ L0                  ☼ L0                  ☼ L0         


                             ф                      ф                        ф                       ф                      ф         


╒ ─  ─   ─  ─ d0╛                ╒d0╛                 ╒d0╛                 ╒d0╛                 ╒d0╛          


                                                         


                                                                                                                                 


↓1st                                                                                                    ╤                        p4


↓C                                                                         ╤                         p3                      │└─                  


↓R                                             ╤                          p2                       │└─────     M4          


↓E                                             p1                       │└─────      M3           p4 ───┴──┐   


↓A                 ╤                         │└─────       M2          p3 ───┴──┐                       B4 ∩B4S4      


↓T                 p0                        M1            p2 ───┴──┐                      B3 ∩ B3 S3                      H


↓ I                ╟──── p1 ───┴──┐                       B2 ∩ B2 S2                          T                            


↓O               M0                           B1 ∩ B1 S1                                 R       


↓N      ┌──┴──┐                                                                                                                      


        p0          B0 ∩ B0 S0                E                                                                                                


└─>S0                       T                         I                          M                          E    


                       2nd         C           R           E           A            T           I           O            N


[After a time lag, a unit spirit, S0, is synthesized,  created out of the equivalent 8 cattle in pairs, enriched to facilitate a new phase of purification in a new vehicle, a pre-assigned/matched human body, B0 . After the cross (S0 ^ B0 ) it is referred to a brand new (fresh, original) soul, p0 . [i.e. p0 = S0 ^ B0 ].  When breathed into a newly born, the man so born is referred to as a newly born man, or, the original 1st. man of the new soul, M0 (Adam).  If there is any sinful attributes, exhibited by the newly born man, M0 , they are a combination of its inheritance from the original spirits, Sand the conditioning of his/her 1st. human parent.  The former is what can also be traced as the Original Sin {Ignorance, Lust, Anger, Hatred, Jealousy, Pride, Greed}.  This is the sin that is forgiven and unpunished (at the 1st. DEATH )  which is implied by the verse As-Saffat  37 : 59  mentioned above. And the sin of our First Parents is what we pray for forgiveness, too - not only our current.]
The above outline assumes a positive progression of the soul all the way thru the 4 stages charted.  This is done just to simplify matters in their idealized form.  In real life there elements of “eddy-flow” involved especially when it comes to the phase of the jinn beings.  When the Al-Quran mentions about its STRAIGHT PATH, the above outline just indicate what it is.  From it a Muslim should appreciate that Islam is not a mere philosophy but involves the physical ritual act of the body as in the Salat, Fasting, Hajj.  It gets the involvement of all of our bodily molecules (sanctification).  As we observe the routine it does leave a cleaner spirit and purified bodily elements  for an  end decomposition process which  yield  the necessary source elements for the next generation of earthly human seeds,  and , astral  seeds for the jinn kind.   Please note that
p1 , p1,  p2,  p3 , p4……  are the same soul traceable to the originally created p0 ,  in the order of their elevated state of purification in the stages 0, 1, 2, 3 and 4 …..,and, that which takes on different bodies, B0,  B1 , B2,  B3,  B4….. and lives as different man,         M0  , M1 ,  M2 ,  M3   M4……. . @ different lifetimes.  It is also the same soul that re-enters the BARZAKH, at each separation by death when they will be reunited (temporarily) with its lost and ever illuminated counterpart (spouse, guardian angel, archangel), d0,  as One SINGLE PERSON.  It is indicated by superscripted  p0 , p1,  p2,  p3  p4……. .  And to the same SINGLE LIGHT, ☼ L0 , it will be acquainted with at each subsequent BARZAKH.
This detailed outline has implication or consequences on a wide range of theological topics from salat to genetics, from Human Right to Soul Right and the Sharia’ Laws.   InshaAllah I may put some comments later.  For now, let those readers who have the will, digest and contemplate what have been described.  Some may be able to articulate them in better English.
Salaam/Peace
zayn-al-abid-din/KL

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 17, 2010 - 10:46AM #43
visio
Posts: 3,250

In my last post the schematic tree of creation and positive transformation/resurrection of Man from ground zero (the Universe of 1st. Creation) presented up to the first four stages (lifetime) of earthly existence as Man. Expanding that to cover the next 3 human stages and the first two stages in the next phase as Jinn, the tree continues as outlined below.  The importance of this stage is an optimistic treatment on the nature of Isasaw (Jesus) which explained the man that he was.   Thru this TREE of CREATION, many of Isasaw (Jesus) known and authentic narratives could be reconciled.   Those that do not, they were, most likely than not, misquoted or conjectured (against this Al-Quranic Tree of Creation). Specifically the following section of the bigger Tree is about tracking what was Isasaw (Jesus).
There are various clues, general as well as specific to Isasaw deployed in the construct of this Big Tree.  The most obvious one is of course the non-normative birth of Isasaw (Jesus).   Others are related to what the Al-Quran says about the Angel, Jinn, Man.  And all of them were enhanced by the following critical verses:
Ya-Sin  36 : 67-70   If it had been Our Will, We could have transformed them in their places.   Then they would be unable to go forward nor could they have turned back.   And he whom We grant long life- We reverse him in creation.   Will they not then understand? And We have not taught him (Muhammadsaw) poetry, nor is it suitable for him.   This is only a reminder and a plain Quran.  That it may give warning to him who is living, and that Word may be justified against the disbelievers.
Al-Baqarah 2 : 36   Then the Iblis (Satan) made them slip there from (Paradise), and got them out from that in which they were.   We said:  “Get you down, all, with enmity between yourselves.   On earth will be a dwelling place for you and an enjoyment for a time.” 
[Note:  This is just an allegorical “curse” of ALLAH on Man and Jinn that between Man and Jinn there will be crosses in many aspects of their existence on earth.  Of course one is invincible to the others during their given period of reprieve (prescribed time)]
Most of the principle involved in outlining the schematic are similar as explained previously.  The accompanying notes in this schematic are specific to Isasaw (Jesus) whose nature was highly crossed.
Notes:
1.   Both Man and Jinn possess male and female aspects and lust to produce offspring. Angels do not.   As a result of this, the initiator of Mary’s conception couldn’t have been an angel but a Jinn (male) under “supervision” of Mary’s own Guardian Angel by ALLAHswt Leave.
2.   Both Man and Jinn go thru the cycles of Life and Death (resurrection).  This implies that all the Jinn beings -  who originated from an evolved Man, as well, as offspring born in the Jinn Kingdom go thru the same Barzakh (after death state and judgment) as Man and their offspring.
3.   ALLAHswt doesn’t make any Prophet (Messenger) from the Jinn Kind.  They don’t have Scriptures to follow.  Those Jinn born in their heavenly kingdom rely on the teachings of their ancestral fathers, mothers, sisters, brothers, uncles, aunties to teach them about ALLAHswt and their own creation.  In this regard, among the Jinn kind they are strongly patriarchal and/or matriarchal, stronger than that of the human kind.  Family-wise, they are very closely and tightly knit and obedient to each other.   And the downside to that they are extremely tribal and, therefore,  among them are generation after generation of them (offspring) thru their lack of knowledge on their ancestors (of Man) who continue to interact with the human species in a very deceptive way.   The phrase We reverse him in creation” mentioned in the above verse  Ya-Sin  36 : 67-70 has a direct impact on their afterlife.  reverse him in creation” means they would be reborn as Man in the Man’s World or their soul, which was created out of the smokeless flame,  is retransformed back to Man from where their (Human) ancestors originated.
4.   Researching on the many narratives of Isasaw (Jesus) and scrutinizing all the narratives (with the assumption that not all of them are unauthentic), what he was describing to his disciples were very much related to the life in the heavenly kingdom of the Jinn and they are loaded with some highly charged bragging/proud tone.  That could only come from his sub-conscious mind  and we spikes from his prior existence as Son of a Jinn  (not necessarily an evil one, perhaps a high level good one).
5.   About 700 years after Isasaw (Jesus), the late Prophet Muhammad “sighted” and “met” Isasaw (Jesus) at the 2nd. Stage of the heavenly Jinn kingdom. So at the most Isasaw (Jesus) prior existence as Jinn offspring was (with high optimism) the 1st. Stage.  And after his death (in the Jinn Kingdom) ALLAHswt had chosen him reverse him in creation and be born as human and become a Messiah (Prophet/Messenger).  We are not in the position at which human stage he was born (only ALLAHswt and, possibly, Isasaw/Jesus) would know it exactly.  In the chart outline here, it is assumed at the 7th. Stage to just make an illustration of the process.  It could be the 2nd. Stage of Man if we follow strictly our projection of average 100 years per lifetime/stage as Man or Jinn and based on the time gap, between Isasaw and Muhammadsaw, of 700 years and 14 periods (1400) of Man and Jinn existence before the soul of a Man is raised into the Angelic Kingdom wherein the cycles of life and death terminates.
So, going thru the symbolism in the chart we have thus:
J1  --  Isasaw (Jesus) prior existence was an offspring (stage/level 1) in the Jinn Kingdom ;   physically and bodily,  it was an astral (physically non-solid and invincible) body, A1 , a conception product of a Jinn Father and Jinn Mother (say Abba X –Amma X).  His first and original soul, jp1 , was freshly created out of a smokeless flame derived from the spirit of another seed of Jinn, or, that of a highly evolved Man at the end of his/her 7th. Stage, matched and predetermined by ALLAHswt’s Will..   Upon his death in the Jinn Kingdom, the soul, jp1 , left the astral body, A1 ,  At ALLAH’s Intervention, for one reason or another, the soul didn’t make the progress to the J2  level.  The soul jp1 is then reverted into a spirit form jS1 , and transformed, jS1 └────────────┘,  into a human soul, p7 to which is assigned a human body, M7 whom we identified as Isasaw (Jesus)  conceived by Mary and an unknown father X, which by the order of things, could only from among the Jinn kind.  With certainty, the father X was of the good kind and most likely from among the highest state closer to the Angelic state – the heavenly 7th. Level.   Right from the day he was born thru to the final hours on the crufixion, the father X was always behind his back.   All the miracles performed was with assistance from Father X  who also shielded and protected him from other Jinn of the Satanic kind.  The crucifixion  event was actually a testing time for both Isasaw (Jesus) and his Father X  that demonstrated ALLAHswt is above all and that both were just part of His CREATION.   As I said earlier the level (stage) indicator, as used in the schematics, serves only to illustrate the flow process.  It must not be used, in any way,  as a statement of  actual state for  Isasaw (Jesus), his jinn Father X and human Mother (Mary)  

  


                                          A                  L                 L                 A                 H 


                                         ─┬───────┬──────────┬───────┬─────┬── ─ ─


                                            L0            L0           jL0          jL0        jL0         


                                           ф                 ф                   ф                ф             ф


                                         d0          d0           d0         jd0         jd0


     <        ── ─ ┘                                                              


                                                              


                 Man Stages (M0 to M7)                                                            jp2        


1st                                                                                           jp1            │└────


C                                                                          p7               │└───  J2                


R                                              p6                       │└───    J1     jp2 ──┴──┐


E                             p5                                            M7    jp1 ──┴──┐               A2 A2 jS2                     


A                         │└───     M6                   ──┴──┐p7       A1 A1 jS1                               


T                          M5     p6 ──┴──┐          B7 B7S7   jS1                     


I                p5 ──┴──┐                       ──┴──┐     └────────┘   


O                                                         MXF           JXM


                                                                       (Unknown FatherX)


N                                                        (Mary)                                                                     


                                 B5 B5 S5   B6 B6 S6                                                           


> S0─ ──┘                     T                 I                 M                E    


       2nd          C            R             E              A              T              I              O              N 


 


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5 years ago  ::  Feb 20, 2010 - 6:35PM #44
visio
Posts: 3,250

Originally the following was intended for the thread entitled "What Muslim says about Mary and Jesus". However, I felt it more connected to aspect of creation, I just bring it under this thread.
It is interesting to note that there are followers of Isasaw (Jesus) who says Isasaw (Jesus) was Son of David as the following verse says:
Gospel of Nazirene, Chapter 2, The Immaculate Conception of Yeshua the Messiah.
>2 : 5.    "And the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David; and He will reign over the house of Jacob for ever; of His kingdom there will be no end."
From the perspective of the  CREATION TREE, there is nothing figurative about the statement.  It is purely direct and literal.   David preceded Isasaw (Jesus) by about 800 - 1000 years.   Within that time span he (David) could have elevated to the 7th. (last) stage of the Jinn Kingdom, i.e. just before the beginning of the Angelic state. By ALLAH's leave, his Guardian angel (female aspect) caused David's (then a Jinny) soul (male aspects) to appear as a male before Mary and initiated the conception of Isasaw (Jesus). That was a CROSS conception between two successive phases of forms of existence.  The active participation of the Guardian angel during this event is implied by the Al-Quranic verse that says at his conception/birth, Isasaw (Jesus) was strengtened with the Ruh Al-Amin - an indication of a supervision by the Guardian Angel. The human image given to the soul of (former) David could be that of his last (7th.) stage in the Man phase which was not necessarily that when he was the King of Israel. Had the soul of David elevated into the angelic stage, his capacity to initiate a human or jinn conception is zero, zilch.  In the whole of the Universe of Existence of Cosciousness being, the last and highest being with the active capability to produce an offspring is the Jinn being at the 7th.Stage (Level) and this capacity is extendible to the Man phase.   In the same Gospel this is also clearly said:
2 : 4.When she saw the angel, she was perplexed by what he was telling her. She pondered what kind of greeting this might be. The angel said to her, "Don't be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God, behold you will conceive and bring forth a child from your womb, and He will be great and will be called a 'Son of the Highest'."
The bolded word "Highest" is indicative of the highest level of being to effect a procreration of both a human and jinn species. In the case of Isasaw (Jesus) it was the Son of Man (Mary).  It was not uncommon in the ancient period, especially from pagan tribes, that the Jinn beings were taken as God or Gods. Hence we had Isasaw (jesus) labelled as Son of God.   This fact has been reaffirmed in the Al-Quran by the following verse:
Saba’ 34 : 40-41   And (remember) the Day when He (ALLAH) will gather them all together, then He will say to the angels:   “Was it you these people used to worship?” They (the angels) will say: “Glorified be You.   You are our Wali (Lord) instead of them.   Nay, but they used to worship the jinn, most of them were believers in them.”         



 


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5 years ago  ::  Feb 27, 2010 - 8:43PM #45
Lavender
Posts: 1,069

Hello, Muslim friends! I want to be very respectful of you and your religion; so if I say something offensive, please tell me. But, right now, I have a question:


Why is your holy day Friday?

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 27, 2010 - 9:41PM #46
visio
Posts: 3,250

Feb 27, 2010 -- 8:43PM, Lavender wrote:


Hello, Muslim friends! I want to be very respectful of you and your religion; so if I say something offensive, please tell me. But, right now, I have a question:


Why is your holy day Friday?




No problemo.  There is nothing holy about it.  ALLAH never sleeps.  But Man needs to sleep his/her mind off.  It was just that in those early days, the Jews and Christians have the Saturday an d Sundays as ther community holidays.  The Jews have picked up Saturday.  The Christian Sunday.  the neo-Muslims have no choice, they have to pick up Fridays.  I guess it was just the day when the community pick up their day to do their collective group spiritual activities like prayer.  Perhaps it was one of those day one picks up to mark the beginning and/or an end of of his/her timescale.  I don't see it written on the sun whenever it rises a writing that says sunday, friday or saturday.... May be some who call themselves of pure semitic tribes can explain this better.  They may no their .......HISTORY.  As a side step to the question an din th esame token,  in the Islamic Theology, when a person realised his/her ALLAH, there is nothing in his/her elevated state he/she is going to witness any words, logos to say that is is ALLAH.  There is no word, no sound, no names, no entity, no deities, no idols.  Just FYI.  

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2010 - 2:40PM #47
Lavender
Posts: 1,069

OK, that makes sense; but don't you pray five times daily anyway? I guess I just don't understand. The gathering of like-minded people I get. Do you have like discourses or something?

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2010 - 6:16PM #48
visio
Posts: 3,250

 


Feb 28, 2010 -- 2:40PM, Lavender wrote:


OK, that makes sense; but don't you pray five times daily anyway? I guess I just don't understand. The gathering of like-minded people I get. Do you have like discourses or something?




Of course we do - individually or in groups.  The particular day as chosen  once in a week is even a bigger group involving the bigger community.  The discourses centre around the bigger issues of the community in aspect of community spiritual growth.  That is part of it.  The other part is the Salat itself.  Synchronised in a larger group of bodies it does benefit from the psychological effect of group dynamics.  In this case the effect is a sort of spiritual magnetism. The astral and hence spiritual force (magnetic) generated collectively by the synchronised and flowing movements of a larger group of bodies, in one single purposeness of submission and surrender of their mind and bodies to ALLAH, all add up.  The resultant of it is felt by the each participant.  The weaker ones are helped in this way.  The stronger ones impart their spiritual astral forces to be shared with the group by their presence and participation. The "magnetism"  isn't in the noise/sound in the recitation of the imam but the all the silence generated in between those words. I guess it requires some imagination/experience  to understand this.  Under the same principle, the ritual spect of it, that similar effect is generated when one gets involved in the Hajj Performance.  A large concentration of people concentrated at one single place,  in a single time , doing the same flow of acts/movements for the single purposeness of submission and surrender of their mind and body to ALLAH (in the case of Muslims) is a humilifying experience.  There on erealises that PEACE is in the SILENCE of HUMILITY.      .  

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2010 - 8:00PM #49
Lavender
Posts: 1,069

That makes sense. Is the imam in the Qu'ran? Is that what is sung?

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5 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2010 - 9:12PM #50
visio
Posts: 3,250

Feb 28, 2010 -- 8:00PM, Lavender wrote:


That makes sense. Is the imam in the Qu'ran? Is that what is sung?




There are no songs or hymns to be sung.  Only various verses of the Al-Quran in Arabic Sound. The Arabic root sound of the Arabic words (if read in a classical mode) generate enough train of molecular vibration from the throat, down to the back spine and then raised up again thru it, thru the cranium of the head. In this way the mind is processed to be stilled.  All the verses that the imam recites are nothing different that anyone would recite, if he/she is performing the salat  him/her ownself.   The only difference is that the imam usually have commited more memories to recite more Al-Quranic verses as an option.  N.B. There are these new categories of so-called Muslims who perform their prayer in English (I am not sure if it is English only).  To me, personally, they miss that advantage of the root (invoking) sound of the Arabic.  In Arabic the root sounds are more, individually or in combination, and richer when compared to sanskrit.  I do not know much about Latin, though.  In sanskrit, the primary sound is OM, which an invoking root sound of creation.  In Ibrahimic Faith it is Aaaameeen, which is an invoking sound of leaving all this created aspect, rising and reaching out towards the Almighty One (ALLAH).         

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