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Switch to Forum Live View married in the temple
6 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2008 - 8:16PM #1
marleighF91
Posts: 34
I recently posted this somewhere else by mistake and found out that it was the wrong place so i decided to post it here.... I'm almost 17 and I've been having sex with my boufriend Alex for over a year now. i'm a member of the church and Alex isn't, so needless to say our values are extremely different. I've been applying to colleges and things like that lately and I began thinking about my future. One thing that popped into my head was a temple marriage. I thought about how Alex isn't Mormon and if he would convert to marry me. It's very important to me that I get married in the temple....I've known since the first time we slept together that I was doing something wrong. We've had conversations about it and not so surprisingly Alex doesn't see it that way. It's really worrying me that I might not be able to get married in the temple. I've been told to go talk to my Bishop. The only problem with that is that he's also my great uncle and I'm pretty sure that convo would be very awkward. Is a temple wedding completely out of the question now that I've had premarital sex? Also, i was recently told that no Mormon boy would ever want to marry me because I'm not "pure". I'm really hoping thats not true.
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6 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2008 - 8:40PM #2
JesseLDS
Posts: 60
Wow, there's a tough one.

A temple marriage in the future is not out of the question for you, but it probably will be for him. The advice to see the bishop is correct, but the situation will understandably be difficult given the family relation.

Here's the situation as I see it. You want to get married in the temple. He doesn't. You are LDS. He isn't. You recognize the current situation is not appropriate. He doesn't. You have different values and different stances on the issues at hand. And, sorry to break it to you, if he were to be baptized for the single purpose of marrying in the temple then that would not be repentance or even honesty on his part, and worlds away from conversion. You would simply be skirting the issue, not properly addressing it. The issue is that, and tell me if I'm wrong here, the relationship seems to lean far too heavily towards the physical wihout the spiritual and emotional needs being addressed, not to mention not having common goals and desires on things that really matter. If he is willing to truly investigate the church, live by its standards and experience a true conversion with its necessary change of heart, then the two of you can work towards a temple wedding with the help of your bishop. Otherwise, I just don't see it happening since your values systems and beliefs appear to be diametrically opposed.  Apart from all that, you will have your own repentance process to go through before you can marry in the temple or even make it past the recommend desk, which is precisely one of the things that the position of bishop is designed to help you with.

Sorry, that seems sort of blunt and cold but I'm really not all that great at selecting warm fuzzy words for a situation such as this one.
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6 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2008 - 8:48PM #3
bytebear
Posts: 1,451
I think it also has to do with your ages. Is he capable of even supporting you now? What if you get pregnant? Who is going to take care of that child. This is why making these kinds of choices are to be avoided. You just aren't ready for the repercussions of your actions. and neither is he. You are 16. You have years and years before you should even be thinking about who you want to spend your life with, and who you want to be the father of your children. You are going to change in a million ways in the next few years, and when you are in your 20s you will be a completely different person. But you should prepare yourself so that when you do meet that right guy worthy to take you to the Lord's House, he will find you equally worthy and he will want you to be the mother to his children. So, talk to your bishop, pray to your Heavenly Father, and tell each of them your desires to get back on track, and start the journey of becoming that person.
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6 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2008 - 8:53PM #4
moksha8088
Posts: 4,812
[QUOTE]
Also, i was recently told that no Mormon boy would ever want to marry me because I'm not "pure". I'm really hoping thats not true.
[/QUOTE]

It is definitely not true.  Those who love you will love you for what you are, not what you are not.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
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6 years ago  ::  Feb 28, 2008 - 10:21PM #5
Ironhold
Posts: 10,904
[QUOTE=moksha8088;321043]It is definitely not true.  Those who love you will love you for what you are, not what you are not.[/QUOTE]

I'll agree with Mok on this one.

I'm not at liberty to divulge why, but trust me - if they're smart, they'll accept you as you are.
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6 years ago  ::  Feb 29, 2008 - 6:17PM #6
Gaia-j
Posts: 636
[QUOTE=marleighF91;320966]I recently posted this somewhere else by mistake and found out that it was the wrong place so i decided to post it here.... I'm almost 17 and I've been having sex with my boufriend Alex for over a year now. i'm a member of the church and Alex isn't, so needless to say our values are extremely different. I've been applying to colleges and things like that lately and I began thinking about my future. One thing that popped into my head was a temple marriage. I thought about how Alex isn't Mormon and if he would convert to marry me. It's very important to me that I get married in the temple....I've known since the first time we slept together that I was doing something wrong. We've had conversations about it and not so surprisingly Alex doesn't see it that way. It's really worrying me that I might not be able to get married in the temple. I've been told to go talk to my Bishop. The only problem with that is that he's also my great uncle and I'm pretty sure that convo would be very awkward. Is a temple wedding completely out of the question now that I've had premarital sex? Also, i was recently told that no Mormon boy would ever want to marry me because I'm not "pure". I'm really hoping thats not true.[/QUOTE]


GAIA:

Hi There, and Welcome to the Forum, Marleigh --

First, let me say that i think it must have taken considerable courage for you to post this message, and speak so honestly of your situation, so i must tell you that i admire and appreciate that -- and i'm sure everyone else here does, too *smile*.

Now, may i (respectfully ) ask you a question --   WHY do you want to get married in the Temple?  WHY is that so important to you?

I'lll wait for your answer, before going further, ok?

Blessings to you --
~Gaia
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6 years ago  ::  Mar 01, 2008 - 12:14AM #7
marleighF91
Posts: 34
It is something I've wanted to do my entire life. Everyone in my family has done it. I want to be eternally sealed to my husband.
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6 years ago  ::  Mar 01, 2008 - 8:05PM #8
Gaia-j
Posts: 636
[QUOTE=marleighF91;323974]It is something I've wanted to do my entire life. Everyone in my family has done it. I want to be eternally sealed to my husband.[/QUOTE]


GAIA:

OK, thanks for that.

Yknow, when it comes to motivation, there are some things that motivate us, and some things that just don't. {*rueful smile*}.  In my experience, personal motivation comes from honestly understanding and BELIEVING in some thing -- not just because others do, not just because we're told to, but because WE ourselves have studied it out, and become "converted" to it. 

In this case of Temple Marriage, i just don't think that it's enough to motivate us, that our families or anyone else believes in and goes for it, i think to motivate us requires that we find something about it that is meaningful to US, personally.  It's one thing to have a child's somewhat idealized view of something, it's quite another to understand its meaning and purpose, and become truly "converted" to it -- don't you think?

IN your case, Marleigh -- With all due respect, i have to question just how much you honestly understand what the Temple is and means, and how much you're "converted" to it.  Now, please understand that i'm not trying to insult or denigrate you in any way; in fact, i think there are many LDS who don't really understand what the Temple is, what a temple marriage is, what it's for, why we do them, and what real benefits come from them; thus, how can they possibly develop a sincere,  personal   motivation about them; how can they be truly "converted" to the TEmple; and if that's the case, what is to keep them from doing (very appealing or attractive)  things that will  keep them from it --  Seewhatimean?

I think you may not quite understand the Temple, so it has little real meaning for you, other than a general symbol that is certainly positive, but when it comes to designing your life   around preparing for it,  it has little real meaning or power.  And that may be (at least one reason) why it was (somewhat) easy for you to do things that were contrary to a Temple marriage.

May i respectfully suggest that you do some study on what the Temple is, what Temple marriages are, where they 'fit" within the Gospel,  and why they are important?  I think that may help you to begin to see what real place it has in YOUR PERSONAL wellbeing, such that it would become a powerful, meaningful goal in your life.


Here are just a few thoughts, toward that end; i hope they help: 

A lot of people make (what i think is) a small but very important mistake about the Temple:  It isn't just about "added spirituality"; if that were all it was, i don't think LDS would have much to offer beyond that which other religions do, to be honest.

Instead, the TEmple endowment about spiritual POWER and AUTHORITY .  Those are two different but related things.   Let me see if i can explain:  If a person says a prayer, the Lord answers it based upon the circumstances, what's best in the long run for that person, and their faith, right?  But if that person has added spiritual POWER and AUTHORITY, they are no longer just supplicants requesting a "favor" anymore, they become in a sense,  part of what ANSWERS that prayer

One with true spiritual power and authority -- not just hoping or assuming  s/he has it, but who KNOWS s/he has it and who uses it honorably, responsibly, and by the inspiration of the HOly Spirit --  is no longer just a supplicant, s/he can call down the powers of heaven with the knowledge that those powers / blessings are (to some degree) REQUIRED to respond to that call. 

That is a very different position to be in.  Very few ever attain it, but the Gospel is designed to help those who can and wish, to do so.  THAT in fact, is (again, imo)  part of the ultimate design of the Gospel -- to make you no longer a beggar, no longer a supplicant, but rather, an "HEIR of God and joint-Heir with Christ"   -- an Heir of ALL that the FAther has.  Now consider the position of an heir, relative to a servant -- even a trusted and beloved servant--  VERY different, huh.  We quote that all the time in Church, but think a bit on what it really means, what it implies, to be "Heir of all the Father has" (Romans 8:17, Hebrews 6:17, James 2:5)  ---

THAT is what the Temple rituals are designed to do -- to start you on the road to becoming no longer a beggar, no longer a supplicant, nor even a beloved servant, but a JOINT HEIR with Christ, with spiritual power and authority, to extend the blessings that are given to you, to others - starting with your own children, and then moving out into the community/ world, as a Queen (one who disseminates temporal blessings to others) and a Priestess (one who disseminates spiritual blessings) --

(Doctrine and Covenants 76:50-70.)

  And again we bear record—for we saw and heard, and this is the testimony of the gospel of Christ concerning them who shall come forth in the resurrection of the just—
51 They are they who received the testimony of Jesus, and believed on his name and were baptized after the manner of his burial, being buried in the water in his name, and this according to the commandment which he has given—
52 That by keeping the commandments they might be washed and cleansed from all their sins, and receive the Holy Spirit by the laying on of the hands of him who is ordained and sealed unto this power;
53 And who overcome by faith, and are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, which the Father sheds forth upon all those who are just and true.
54 They are they who are the church of the Firstborn.
55   They are they into whose hands the Father has given all things—
56 They are they who are priests and kings {OR Priestesses and Queens} -- who have received of his fulness, and of his glory;
57 And are priests of the Most High, after the order of Melchizedek, which was after the order of Enoch, which was after the order of the Only Begotten Son....
58 Wherefore, as it is written, they are gods, even the sons of God—
59 Wherefore, all things are theirs, whether life or death, or things present, or things to come, all are theirs and they are Christ's, and Christ is God's.. 



A quote from a BYU Women's Conference says:

That higher state, promised in the eternal marriage covenant, is called becoming kings and queens, priests and priestesses unto the most high God. ...."
(As Women of Faith: Talks Selected from the BYU Women's Conferences [Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1989], 117.)


BYU Religion Professors and authors Monte S. Nyman and Charles D. Tate, Jr.:
"... The Holy Priesthood after the order of the Son of God is from eternity to eternity, from everlasting to everlasting, meaning from one existence to the next. It was in operation in the first estate, it blesses lives and seals souls to eternal life in mortality, and it will continue into the world of spirits and beyond, on into the kingdoms of glory [u] wherein dwell kings and queens, priests and priestesses
."
(Monte S. Nyman and Charles D. Tate, Jr., eds., Alma, the Testimony of the Word [Provo: BYU Religious Studies Center, 1992], 70.)


~End quotes.


For more on what the Temple is really about, please see the following:

- "Principles of Perfection" by Hyrum L Andrus

Here are a couple of excellent books on the symbolism of the symbols used on the temple exterior:

- Allen H. Barber. "Celestial Symbols: Symbolism in Doctrine, Religious Traditions and Temple Architecture", Bountiful: Horizon, 1990, ISBN 0-88290-344-6

- Paul Thomas Smith & Matthew B. Brown. "Symbols in Stone: Symbolism on the Early Temples of the Restoration",  American Fork: Covenant, 1997, ISBN 1-57734-134-1


- Here is where you can download a very interesting, helpful  (but please note, NOT official) book by a  well-known BYU professor, Cleon Skousen, on the Temple Endowment and its symbolism:
http://www.geocities.com/eleazarbenyair/tempbook.htm


I'm sure others can offer other suggestions on where to find good information on the meaning and purpose of the Temple -- I hope you'll take advantage of them, and come back and share with us, what you learn, and how it affects you and your life.


Blessings and Good luck to you --
~Gaia
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6 years ago  ::  Mar 01, 2008 - 8:05PM #9
Gaia-j
Posts: 636
[QUOTE=marleighF91;323974]It is something I've wanted to do my entire life. Everyone in my family has done it. I want to be eternally sealed to my husband.[/QUOTE]


GAIA:

OK, thanks for that.

Yknow, when it comes to motivation, there are some things that motivate us, and some things that just don't. {*rueful smile*}.  In my experience, personal motivation comes from honestly understanding and BELIEVING in some thing -- not just because others do, not just because we're told to, but because WE ourselves have studied it out, and become "converted" to it. 

In this case of Temple Marriage, i just don't think that it's enough to motivate us, that our families or anyone else believes in and goes for it, i think to motivate us requires that we find something about it that is meaningful to US, personally.  It's one thing to have a child's somewhat idealized view of something, it's quite another to understand its meaning and purpose, and become truly "converted" to it -- don't you think?

IN your case, Marleigh -- With all due respect, i have to question just how much you honestly understand what the Temple is and means, and how much you're "converted" to it.  Now, please understand that i'm not trying to insult or denigrate you in any way; in fact, i think there are many LDS who don't really understand what the Temple is, what a temple marriage is, what it's for, why we do them, and what real benefits come from them; thus, how can they possibly develop a sincere,  personal   motivation about them; how can they be truly "converted" to the TEmple; and if that's the case, what is to keep them from doing (very appealing or attractive)  things that will  keep them from it --  Seewhatimean?

I think you may not quite understand the Temple, so it has little real meaning for you, other than a general symbol that is certainly positive, but when it comes to designing your life   around preparing for it,  it has little real meaning or power.  And that may be (at least one reason) why it was (somewhat) easy for you to do things that were contrary to a Temple marriage.

May i respectfully suggest that you do some study on what the Temple is, what Temple marriages are, where they 'fit" within the Gospel,  and why they are important?  I think that may help you to begin to see what real place it has in YOUR PERSONAL wellbeing, such that it would become a powerful, meaningful goal in your life.


Here are just a few thoughts, toward that end; i hope they help: 

A lot of people make (what i think is) a small but very important mistake about the Temple:  It isn't just about "added spirituality"; if that were all it was, i don't think LDS would have much to offer beyond that which other religions do, to be honest.

Instead, the TEmple endowment about spiritual POWER and AUTHORITY .  Those are two different but related things.   Let me see if i can explain:  If a person says a prayer, the Lord answers it based upon the circumstances, what's best in the long run for that person, and their faith, right?  But if that person has added spiritual POWER and AUTHORITY, they are no longer just supplicants requesting a "favor" anymore, they become in a sense,  part of what ANSWERS that prayer

One with true spiritual power and authority -- not just hoping or assuming  s/he has it, but who KNOWS s/he has it and who uses it honorably, responsibly, and by the inspiration of the HOly Spirit --  is no longer just a supplicant, s/he can call down the powers of heaven with the knowledge that those powers / blessings are (to some degree) REQUIRED to respond to that call. 

That is a very different position to be in.  Very few ever attain it, but the Gospel is designed to help those who can and wish, to do so.  THAT in fact, is (again, imo)  part of the ultimate design of the Gospel -- to make you no longer a beggar, no longer a supplicant, but rather, an "HEIR of God and joint-Heir with Christ"   -- an Heir of ALL that the FAther has.  Now consider the position of an heir, relative to a servant -- even a trusted and beloved servant--  VERY different, huh.  We quote that all the time in Church, but think a bit on what it really means, what it implies, to be "Heir of all the Father has" (Romans 8:17, Hebrews 6:17, James 2:5)  ---

THAT is what the Temple rituals are designed to do -- to start you on the road to becoming no longer a beggar, no longer a supplicant, nor even a beloved servant, but a JOINT HEIR with Christ, with spiritual power and authority, to extend the blessings that are given to you, to others - starting with your own children, and then moving out into the community/ world, as a Queen (one who disseminates temporal blessings to others) and a Priestess (one who disseminates spiritual blessings) --

(Doctrine and Covenants 76:50-70.)

  And again we bear record—for we saw and heard, and this is the testimony of the gospel of Christ concerning them who shall come forth in the resurrection of the just—
51 They are they who received the testimony of Jesus, and believed on his name and were baptized after the manner of his burial, being buried in the water in his name, and this according to the commandment which he has given—
52 That by keeping the commandments they might be washed and cleansed from all their sins, and receive the Holy Spirit by the laying on of the hands of him who is ordained and sealed unto this power;
53 And who overcome by faith, and are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, which the Father sheds forth upon all those who are just and true.
54 They are they who are the church of the Firstborn.
55   They are they into whose hands the Father has given all things—
56 They are they who are priests and kings {OR Priestesses and Queens} -- who have received of his fulness, and of his glory;
57 And are priests of the Most High, after the order of Melchizedek, which was after the order of Enoch, which was after the order of the Only Begotten Son....
58 Wherefore, as it is written, they are gods, even the sons of God—
59 Wherefore, all things are theirs, whether life or death, or things present, or things to come, all are theirs and they are Christ's, and Christ is God's.. 



A quote from a BYU Women's Conference says:

That higher state, promised in the eternal marriage covenant, is called becoming kings and queens, priests and priestesses unto the most high God. ...."
(As Women of Faith: Talks Selected from the BYU Women's Conferences [Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1989], 117.)


BYU Religion Professors and authors Monte S. Nyman and Charles D. Tate, Jr.:
"... The Holy Priesthood after the order of the Son of God is from eternity to eternity, from everlasting to everlasting, meaning from one existence to the next. It was in operation in the first estate, it blesses lives and seals souls to eternal life in mortality, and it will continue into the world of spirits and beyond, on into the kingdoms of glory [u] wherein dwell kings and queens, priests and priestesses
."
(Monte S. Nyman and Charles D. Tate, Jr., eds., Alma, the Testimony of the Word [Provo: BYU Religious Studies Center, 1992], 70.)


~End quotes.


For more on what the Temple is really about, please see the following:

- "Principles of Perfection" by Hyrum L Andrus

Here are a couple of excellent books on the symbolism of the symbols used on the temple exterior:

- Allen H. Barber. "Celestial Symbols: Symbolism in Doctrine, Religious Traditions and Temple Architecture", Bountiful: Horizon, 1990, ISBN 0-88290-344-6

- Paul Thomas Smith & Matthew B. Brown. "Symbols in Stone: Symbolism on the Early Temples of the Restoration",  American Fork: Covenant, 1997, ISBN 1-57734-134-1


- Here is where you can download a very interesting, helpful  (but please note, NOT official) book by a  well-known BYU professor, Cleon Skousen, on the Temple Endowment and its symbolism:
http://www.geocities.com/eleazarbenyair/tempbook.htm


I'm sure others can offer other suggestions on where to find good information on the meaning and purpose of the Temple -- I hope you'll take advantage of them, and come back and share with us, what you learn, and how it affects you and your life.


Blessings and Good luck to you --
~Gaia
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6 years ago  ::  Mar 12, 2008 - 8:36PM #10
marleighF91
Posts: 34
Ok. I've done some studying on the temple and I've come to the conclusion that I still want to get married in the temple and I would still really like for the man standing next to me to be Alex, but he said a comment last weekend that really makes me think otherwise. I'm still going to be his girlfriend, I just want to know everytihng I can possibly do to get back to being able to go to the temple.
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